TR Air Defence Programs

[Saithan]

Is it possible to cross radar waves at distance to lower/raise the band to see if anything bounces of it. I mean like waves moving in and out at different wavelength that makes it difficult to avoid ?

 

[Yasar_TR]

Is it possible to cross radar waves at distance to lower/raise the band to see if anything bounces of it. I mean like waves moving in and out at different wavelength that makes it difficult to avoid ?

Answer to that is in post #4183 in previous page in italic letters.

 

[Saithan]

Answer to that is in post #4183 in previous page in italic letters.

Would passive signal relay points be of any use, kinda like extenders that send back information ?

 

[sh. Abdj]

With our air defence systems we don't need to cover the whole Turkey. Israel or Greece wouldn't risk flying all that distance to attack residential areas. Israel can however try to justify an attack on important military facilities, claiming they pose a potential threat to them. We just need to make sure that critical places are very well protected. My question now: If Israel attacks TUSAS (TAI) facilities with its F35s, at which distance can we detect those planes or their missiles? If we detect the missile say only at a close distance can we still shoot it with our Hisar A? How about a Korkut like system which can fire many dispersing munition. How many such systems would we need to protect TAI? Or whatever the number of Hisar A or Korkut, because of some technical aspects (detection, speed of munition etc) it is not possible to protect. I mean I don't think Korkut etc. are that expensive systems so we should produce them in very large numbers (if they are at all useful) in the next couple of year. This is essential because our air force is not up to par due to mistakes done in the past (which we somehow always do and seem never to learn our lesson).

Bro you will be surprised how determinant the enemy to hit civilians areas. They could attack off duty generals or their relatives, or even politicians and scientists or even their relatives. We are talking about a crazy criminal entity, and all of us have seen how sadistic they are. Don't leave them any path or you will regret. Believe me.

 

[sh. Abdj]

I think visual detection network with AI will be the best for detecting enemy stealth Airplanes. We are talking about tens of thousands of systems in all Turkey with thousands in Syria and hundreds in the Sea. Sure the Radar Systems should be covering all the country and the surrounding also but as a start this will be fast solution and first step the second step is mass production of Radars in all sizes especially many small ones with mass production of ground air defence systems. The third will be a great AIWACS network system from all sizes. All supported by AI as the country is a Tourist destination and tricks can be done by enemy using the big daily Air traffic.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Would passive signal relay points be of any use, kinda like extenders that send back information ?

How can that be passive? That statement doesn’t sound right to me.
If it is relaying signal, then it is active.
Radar is a device that operates in electromagnetic domain. If you are sending signals then you are active.
Aesa radars do that cleverly by sending signals in rotating frequency pulses.by spreading signals across a wide frequency range and by rapid frequency shifting, and by using low probability intercept modes by emitting signals that are very weak and difficult to detect, minimising the chance of being intercepted by enemy sensors, they can be stealthy.

So if we go by the example given in that post; tower A and tower B sending and receiving signals with their Aesa radars, their detection would be difficult and they may be able to detect a stealthy plane that passes through their signal.

 

[Strong AI]

Was this shared? It is about anti-drone capability, so i post it here.
Imo very interesting concept.

Anti-Drone Role for Standard Weapons from ASELSAN Konya

Anti-drone munitions developed through a joint project between SATEK R&D and URBAN will be used in ASELSAN Konya’s AKONS series.

The IDEF 2025 International Defense Industry Fair, an internationally prestigious event showcasing the latest technological developments and products in the defense industry, concluded on July 27. Many domestically developed and nationally produced systems were introduced to attendees at the fair. One of the most closely followed products was the anti-drone munitions developed through joint efforts of Turkish defense industry firms.

Developed by ASELSAN Konya, the AKONS (Smart Optical Sight System) provides a cost-effective solution against drones. To further enhance the effectiveness of AKONS, testing continues with anti-drone munitions developed by SATEK R&D and URBAN. According to information obtained by Defence Turk, the prototype is still under development and is expected to be tested by Turkish Armed Forces personnel in the near future.

Previously, AKONS had already demonstrated high effectiveness against drones when used with standard M-80 and M-80 (7.62 mm x 51) ammunition. In the newly developed system, the goal is to achieve greater effectiveness by firing specialized munitions that each contain 7 projectiles. The primary goal here is to create an effective projectile cluster against drones.

As a result of live-fire tests, shots were successfully conducted at 100 meters with 7.62 mm and at 200 meters with 12.7 mm effective ammunition. Resembling shotgun shells with a scatter-shot structure, these anti-drone munitions offer higher accuracy than traditional shotguns frequently used on the Russia-Ukraine front. Another advantage of the AKONS (Smart Optical Sight System) is its compatibility with other M-80 ammunition in terms of size, fit, and physical properties, allowing for multi-mode automatic firing.

The anti-drone ammunition, designed to be used within a specific range to bring down target drone systems, is expected to become operational following field experience and refinement based on user feedback. With input from various military commands, further development and improvements of this ammunition will continue. The prototype stage is nearing completion, and mass production is expected to begin soon.

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Anti-Drone Ammunition Calibers​

• 12.7 mm – Tested / Approved
• 7.62 mm – Tested / Approved
• 5.56 mm / 5.45 mm – In Development

The anti-drone ammunition, which features deployable sabot-based projectiles designed for kinetic impact, has been tested on ASELSAN AKONS 7.62 mm MPT-76 and ASELSAN SARP 12.7 mm RWS M2 weapons and is compatible with all standard firearms.

---

General Specifications​

Caliber	Weight & Propellant Charge	Muzzle Velocity (m/s) (+/-10%)	Effective Damage Range (meters, horizontal)	Penetration Capability (horizontal fire)	Projectile Reach (meters, horizontal)
7.62 mm	Same as standard ammunition	850	0–100	Sheet metal / 0.75 mm metal	120
12.7 mm	Same as standard ammunition	950	0–250	Sheet metal / 1.5 mm metal	500

ASELSAN Konya'dan standart silahlara anti-drone rolü

SATEK AR- GE ve URBAN firmalarının ortaklaşa çalışmasıyla geliştirilen Anti drone mühimmat, IDEF 2025 fuarında ilk kez kamuoyuna tanıtıldı.

www.defenceturk.net

 

[Strong AI]

Interview with MKE about TOLGA layered drone defence system. Here is the interesting part. When he talks about the rotary cannon, at like 3:07 min he tells that it creates a cloud consisting of particles. Can MKE produce 12.7 mm airburst rounds?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1948328418077982997

Anti-Drone Ammunition Calibers​

• 12.7 mm – Tested / Approved

@UkroTurk do we have our answer here? Despite saying it was only tested with Aselsan Sarp (12.7 mm)? Would this be too expensive to use with a 12.7 mm rotary cannon?

 

[Strong AI]

The anti-drone ammunition, which features deployable sabot-based projectiles designed for kinetic impact, has been tested on ASELSAN AKONS 7.62 mm MPT-76 and ASELSAN SARP 12.7 mm RWS M2 weapons and is compatible with all standard firearms.

Now we know why Aselsan Sarp was following the drone in this video.

 

[begturan]

Interview with MKE about TOLGA layered drone defence system. Here is the interesting part. When he talks about the rotary cannon, at like 3:07 min he tells that it creates a cloud consisting of particles. Can MKE produce 12.7 mm airburst rounds?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1948328418077982997

this 20 mm auto cannon was developed by ALSTAG approx 7 years before, but we see that weapon on the MKE stand.

ALSTAG T-20 mm Boğaç Silah Sistemi

ALSTAG T-20mm Boğaç Silah Sistemi

www.millisavunma.com

 

[Strong AI]

this 20 mm auto cannon was developed by ALSTAG approx 7 years before, but we see that weapon on the MKE stand.

ALSTAG T-20 mm Boğaç Silah Sistemi

ALSTAG T-20mm Boğaç Silah Sistemi

www.millisavunma.com

Yeah looks like the same, maybe they bought it/them.

 

[begturan]

Yeah looks like the same, maybe they bought it/them.

MKE is incorporating the products of many companies and pretending to have developed them itself. I think it is in a way creating obstacles in the way of those companies and convincing them to transfer their rights to it.

MPT76 was also developed by Kalekalıp but its production was not allowed, later it was produced under MKE.

 

[Radko]

MKE is incorporating the products of many companies and pretending to have developed them itself. I think it is in a way creating obstacles in the way of those companies and convincing them to transfer their rights to it.

MPT76 was also developed by Kalekalıp but its production was not allowed, later it was produced under MKE.

MPT76 was NOT developed by Kalekalıp

 

[begturan]

MPT76 was NOT developed by Kalekalıp

I first held this infantry rifle in 2008. At the time, MKE held the weapons production license and refused to allow Kalekalıp to produce it. After numerous unsuccessful attempts, they reached an agreement with Kalekalıp and began producing these rifles under the name MPT76. Over time, Kalekalıp was given a share of the production, forcing them to remain silent.

This page includes the rifle's production date.

MPT76

MPT76

www.kalekalip.com.tr

 

[UkroTurk]

@UkroTurk do we have our answer here? Despite saying it was only tested with Aselsan Sarp (12.7 mm)? Would this be too expensive to use with a 12.7 mm rotary cannon?

I adore our defense industry that could fit fuze even in .50 call.

Great achievement!!