TR Air Forces|News & Discussion

[Turkic]

To even contemplate shooting a 20 to 50 thousand dollar kamikaze drone with a state of the art 3 million dollar meteor is madness.
A missile like meteor is specifically built to bring down fast fighter jets 30 to 50 times pricier than itself.
For such drones, Koral and Sungur is the best medicine.
Talking about Meteor; It is high time we should be fire testing our Gökhan by now. It would be wasteful if we spend all that money on Meteors, when we are close to having our own ramjet powered a2a missile.

I just said 'some' extra. Also they used 1-2 million dollar a2a missiles to stop those Iranian 20 to 50k dollar kamikaze drones, not me.

 

[Yasar_TR]

I just said 'some' extra. Also they used 1-2 million dollar a2a missiles to stop those Iranian 20 to 50k dollar kamikaze drones, not me.

They did that to show solidarity with Israel.
There is also the point whereby a 50 thousand dollar drone is targeting a 1 billion dollar air defence system or a civilian and/or strategically important military settlement. Then you have to stop that drone with whatever means you have available to yourself , irrespective of it’s cost.
But shooting drones with expensive a2a missiles actually shows the inefficiency of a layered air defence system whereby it is the prime duty of that air defence system to intercept those drones with suitable interceptors.

 

[Bilge adam reis]

To even contemplate shooting a 20 to 50 thousand dollar kamikaze drone with a state of the art 3 million dollar meteor is madness.
A missile like meteor is specifically built to bring down fast fighter jets 30 to 50 times pricier than itself.
For such drones, Koral and Sungur is the best medicine.
Talking about Meteor; It is high time we should be fire testing our Gökhan by now. It would be wasteful if we spend all that money on Meteors, when we are close to having our own ramjet powered a2a missile.

We still couldn't even get the gezgin out I would say give it some time.

 

[dBSPL]

While developing our own ramjet-propelled anti-aircraft missile, the presence of the Meteor missile, which is a reference in this field, in the inventory of the Air Force will definitely be a plus factor. It is not only the balancing of the Greek air threat, but also the training activities of the air force in exercises, without relying on paper specs or digital simulation environment, that will allow direct comparison and improvement both fleet tactical and system specs; here it may be necessary to open a separate parenthesis on the capabilities of the 401st squadron. As a related example, one of the reasons why we have so much confidence in Bozdogan and Gokdogan missiles is that TAF is already among the world's one of the most important operators of AIM-120s and Sidewinder missiles.

Of course, depending on the quality and size of the procurement, we should not assume that every foreign procurement is detrimental to domestic industrial activity. In this context, both on the industrial side and in terms of the tactical capabilities of our air force, we should see the Meteors in a good move.

 

[dBSPL]

Although I have not been able to verify the source, It is speculated that until the reorganization of the Syrian air force is completed, the Turkish air force will temporarily deploy 2 squadron size air force to protect and support of Syrian airspace. If this news is true, the bases will probably also be used for training the Syrian air force.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885818900572754321

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Although I have not been able to verify the source, It is speculated that until the reorganization of the Syrian air force is completed, the Turkish air force will temporarily deploy 2 squadron size air force to protect and support of Syrian airspace. If this news is true, the bases will probably also be used for training the Syrian air force.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885818900572754321

For some, a very big pill to swallow.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

The development of Gezgin (Tomahawk equivalent) and Gökhan (MDBA Meteor equivalent) must definitely be accelerated.
Greece is very afraid that the import of the MDBA Meteor will not only give Turkey a weapon to exert great pressure in the Aegean.
But that Turkey can significantly improve the Gökhan missile with later blocks through deep analysis and reverse engineering. Because you then have a reference model in your hands to improve your own product. Imagine Gökhan as Block II would have a range of 200 km with a real no escape zone of 100 km, Greece and Cyprus can then buy as many Rafaele and F-35 as they want as naval version as two-stage booster/ramjet missile and as A2A ramjet missile they would face unsolvable challenges for Greece & Co. As Turkey can produce more as needed and improve them with additional blocks with multispectral seekers.

 

[hugh]

Although I have not been able to verify the source, It is speculated that until the reorganization of the Syrian air force is completed, the Turkish air force will temporarily deploy 2 squadron size air force to protect and support of Syrian airspace. If this news is true, the bases will probably also be used for training the Syrian air force.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885818900572754321

It's meaningless unless we have the quality and the capacity to counteract Israel's air force. And unfortunately we will need a decade to reach that stage.

 

[KhanOfEurasia]

The development of Gezgin (Tomahawk equivalent) and Gökhan (MDBA Meteor equivalent) must definitely be accelerated.
Greece is very afraid that the import of the MDBA Meteor will not only give Turkey a weapon to exert great pressure in the Aegean.
But that Turkey can significantly improve the Gökhan missile with later blocks through deep analysis and reverse engineering. Because you then have a reference model in your hands to improve your own product. Imagine Gökhan as Block II would have a range of 200 km with a real no escape zone of 100 km, Greece and Cyprus can then buy as many Rafaele and F-35 as they want as naval version as two-stage booster/ramjet missile and as A2A ramjet missile they would face unsolvable challenges for Greece & Co. As Turkey can produce more as needed and improve them with additional blocks with multispectral seekers.

Gökhan will have a Range up to 200 km +, Gökhan ER likely up to 400 km like the chinese PL-21.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885674276948242843

 

[Bilge adam reis]

Gökhan will have a Range up to 200 km +, Gökhan ER likely up to 400 km like the chinese PL-21.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885674276948242843

How are they the best missiles when they are still in testing phase? Some of them isn't even made yet also bozdoğan and gökdoğan were to enter service in 2023 they are still not even serially produced.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

Gökhan will have a Range up to 200 km +, Gökhan ER likely up to 400 km like the chinese PL-21.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1885674276948242843

However, these are not the real ranges, but rather the estimated ranges. The Meteor's range is also 100-+150km with a zero escape zone of 60-70 km.
If at all, you can only reach such ranges if you fire your missiles top down to the target.

But I say that with reservations, I got the information from a German fighter pilot.

 

[I_Love_F16]

However, these are not the real ranges, but rather the estimated ranges. The Meteor's range is also 100-+150km with a zero escape zone of 60-70 km.
If at all, you can only reach such ranges if you fire your missiles top down to the target.

But I say that with reservations, I got the information from a German fighter pilot.

You can do those kind of ranges when conditions are ideal, typically when you fly at higher altitude and at greater speed. So not always the case.

 

[Bilge adam reis]

However, these are not the real ranges, but rather the estimated ranges. The Meteor's range is also 100-+150km with a zero escape zone of 60-70 km.
If at all, you can only reach such ranges if you fire your missiles top down to the target.

But I say that with reservations, I got the information from a German fighter pilot.

60 to 70km for a deadzone is Impressive are we counting up the AWACS support or just the AESA radar?

 

[Ryder]

It's meaningless unless we have the quality and the capacity to counteract Israel's air force. And unfortunately we will need a decade to reach that stage.

Imagine if Turkiye had the F35B no doubt that would have levelled the playing field when the Turkish naval aviation squad can send planes to deter Israel.

Basically sends a message to the Israelis, Greeks, Haftar of Libya and Egypt.

 

[Bilge adam reis]

Imagine if Turkiye had the F35B no doubt that would have levelled the playing field when the Turkish naval aviation squad can send planes to deter Israel.

Basically sends a message to the Israelis, Greeks, Haftar of Libya and Egypt.

Even with F35's you are not deterring Israeli air force buddy.

 

[Ripley]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1886507569537310850

“According to the Spanish newspaper @larazon_es , 40 Typhoon jets, the first 20 of which will be second-hand from the UK and the other 20 of which will be newly produced, are expected to enter service with Meteor missiles between 2026 and 2030.”


Not what we hoped for but also it’s a known fact that TurAF definitely need aircraft right now.

 

[uçuyorum]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1886507569537310850

“According to the Spanish newspaper @larazon_es , 40 Typhoon jets, the first 20 of which will be second-hand from the UK and the other 20 of which will be newly produced, are expected to enter service with Meteor missiles between 2026 and 2030.”


Not what we hoped for but also it’s a known fact that TurAF definitely need aircraft right now.

I'm all for second hand if it means they will enter inventory next year, that would be very fast, and we can hopefully modernize them to tranche 4.

 

[boredaf]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1886507569537310850

“According to the Spanish newspaper @larazon_es , 40 Typhoon jets, the first 20 of which will be second-hand from the UK and the other 20 of which will be newly produced, are expected to enter service with Meteor missiles between 2026 and 2030.”


Not what we hoped for but also it’s a known fact that TurAF definitely need aircraft right now.

That timeline, obviously if correct, would be pretty good for us. We won't rely on these jets for decades to come, even if we keep using them. But we need them to fill in the gaps, figuratively, while we wait for our own products to mature and go in to production.

 

[Sanchez]

“According to the Spanish newspaper @larazon_es , 40 Typhoon jets, the first 20 of which will be second-hand from the UK and the other 20 of which will be newly produced, are expected to enter service with Meteor missiles between 2026 and 2030.”


Not what we hoped for but also it’s a known fact that TurAF definitely need aircraft right now.

Another news that contradicts the previous ones. Most recently Güler's statement saying they would all be new aircraft. Though recent history showed that his semi official remarks are hardly gospel.

I've said before that RAF T1s are not at the end of their service life and Brits are just too cash strapped to keep them flying and modernizing them. But, it's not even clear if these aircraft can be modernized in a realistic fashion. I really don't see the "give them to us and we'll make'em fly to the moon" angle working. These are aircraft we don't know and we have no experience with. Aselsan coming up with a mod package for these 20 aircraft in a shorter timeframe than a decade is a dream at best.

Some older but still very high performance aircraft compared to anything we have can still be good, if they are to be refurbished and deliveries to start quickly and if they come from RAF with Meteors. Per the newspaper:
"The first deliveries are expected to begin in 2026 and full operational capability is expected to be achieved by 2030."

First delivery to FOC in 4 years is good, but slower than what the Greeks achieved with second hand Rafales and new production airframes in 3 years. Of course we don't have the details, it's pretty light on them. There's no mention of refurbishment process in the UK, sale of spares, training of pilots, whether there would be a joint RAF/TurAF squadron etc.

Newspaper itself doesn't seem to be a defence publication, so we also cannot know if the claims are true. Maybe they are just regurgitating the previously stated claims.

Regardless, it's just better to wait and see without seeping much into guesswork. There's literally no official paper, no confirmation, no details of the sale yet. We are just tiring ourselves.

 

[zio]

However, these are not the real ranges, but rather the estimated ranges. The Meteor's range is also 100-+150km with a zero escape zone of 60-70 km.
If at all, you can only reach such ranges if you fire your missiles top down to the target.

But I say that with reservations, I got the information from a German fighter pilot.

Dual pulse AA missiles are cheap alternative to meteor missile in tems of no escape zone