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TR Air Forces|News & Discussion

Zafer

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I don't think this is as big of a leverage as it's made out to be. TK for decades have run a dual fleet of European and American aircraft. It's a doubling of the fleet to get better deals from manufacturers and to make sure in the event of a crisis, portion of the fleet can run regardless, be it systematic issues, maintenance issues etc.

TK already ordered about 250 Airbus units in 2023. Airbus orderbook is nearly full, with airlines outbidding each other to get a slot, lots of delays in production due to supply chain issues in both sides of the atlantic as well. TK has to order Boeings to hit their previously stated goals and to keep the fleet young. Maybe the order gets delayed 2-3 more years, but it will happen.
Who knows maybe China catches up or maybe Airbus grow bigger. Boeing losing deals left and right puts them in a tight spot. Delays of several years is pressure enough to make them compromise.
 

Spitfire9

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Was anything related to F-35 decided at the meeting between Erdogan and Trump? Is a Eurofighter deal now dead?
 

Fairon

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Was anything related to F-35 decided at the meeting between Erdogan and Trump? Is a Eurofighter deal now dead?

No. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

For a while, and possibly in the foreseeable future, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ will be the answer to all questions related to Air Force procurements.
 

Costin1984

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Why are we putting up with this crap? They can keep their SAFE, Eurofighter, F-16/35.
It's time to make a clean break and turn to countries that really deliver, while doing our own thing. Once we've reached a certain level of technological maturity, these countries will come crawling back to us.
As I was saying in another thread, Turkey s trade volume with, a small country like Romania,is 11 billion....with Pakistan is 1.4 billion...
Welcome to the real world
 

mTT

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The procurement of 12 C-130J military transport aircraft from the United Kingdom has been finalized.

📍Ministry of National Defense:

▪️As part of the efforts to procure 12 C-130J aircraft from the United Kingdom to meet the operational needs of our Air Force Command, the aforementioned aircraft have been delivered to the relevant company for maintenance and modernization.

▪️Following maintenance and modernization in the United Kingdom, the aircraft will be gradually incorporated into the inventory of our Air Force.

▪️Furthermore, the maintenance and servicing of the C-130J aircraft will be carried out using domestic and national resources after Type Training.

 

Sanchez

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Finally some updates on this front.

Company in question is Marshall Aerospace based in UK, most probably. All 15 aircraft were being kept near their hangar since 2023:

1760610895644.png


Now my question is, what will the transfer really entail; there are some really nice specimens in the ex-RAF fleet, like the C-130J4 RAF 47 SQN used for special forces missions, equipped with AN/AAQ-24 DIRCM. Being an American system, it is possible that this might be removed if the said aircraft is one of the ones to be transferred. Most aircraft are also equipped with American MWRs as well, which air force would probably would like to change with Aselsan ones.

Well after the program is concluded and aircraft are delivered to TurAF, there'll be work to do.
 

Saithan

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Good to hear about C130 from UK. Fighterjet news is just as annoying as usual. Better not talk about them considering how messed up and put of option I consider the government to be.
 

Sanchez

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Finally some updates on this front.

Company in question is Marshall Aerospace based in UK, most probably. All 15 aircraft were being kept near their hangar since 2023:

View attachment 77748

Now my question is, what will the transfer really entail; there are some really nice specimens in the ex-RAF fleet, like the C-130J4 RAF 47 SQN used for special forces missions, equipped with AN/AAQ-24 DIRCM. Being an American system, it is possible that this might be removed if the said aircraft is one of the ones to be transferred. Most aircraft are also equipped with American MWRs as well, which air force would probably would like to change with Aselsan ones.

Well after the program is concluded and aircraft are delivered to TurAF, there'll be work to do.
Özbek claims "per official sources", Turkey will pay 740 million USD for the 12 aircraft. Only source I can find re that figure is the defencesecurityasia article from last year. And that site's credibility can only be called dubious.


I didn't see any actual official sources, definitely no official remarks. Take that number with a huge grain of salt. They are of course not going to be on pennies but 61 mil a pop is about 10 mil more than I expect.

 

Sanchez

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Marshall Aerospace secures C-130J support contract with Turkish Ministry of National Defence​


The Turkish Ministry of National Defence has awarded Marshall Aerospace a major contract to support its fleet of newly-acquired Lockheed Martin C-130J Super Hercules aircraft.

The multi-year agreement covers entry into service and sustainment for all 12 aircraft to be operated by the Turkish Air Force, including scheduled maintenance, spares and tooling.

Marshall will also provide training to enable the customer to build up an indigenous capability on the C-130J platform....

In addition to the scheduled maintenance, Marshall will have completed centre wing box replacements on each of the 12 airframes prior to the aircraft entering into service with the Turkish Air Force.

 

Fairon

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Wonder if we also consider the C27s after the C130Js? They use the same engine (different variants, though I'm not sure how different they are), we have good relations with Italy in the aviation sector, and they can reduce the C130's workload for loads that are just outside the C235's capacity but not worth using the C130 for.
 

Sanchez

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Wonder if we also consider the C27s after the C130Js? They use the same engine (different variants, though I'm not sure how different they are), we have good relations with Italy in the aviation sector, and they can reduce the C130's workload for loads that are just outside the C235's capacity but not worth using the C130 for.
Sünnetçi wrote about a smaller aircraft to bridge the gap and replace some capability that will be lost with aging C-235s last year.

"The Turkish Air Force, which is closely interested in the C-130J Super Hercules Transport Aircraft, which will be decommissioned by the British Royal Air Force in 2023 in order to support the C-130BM/EM Fleet, sent a delegation to the UK to inspect the aircraft and held preliminary discussions on cooperation within the scope of the project. In the first phase, it is planned to transfer 8 C-130J-30 (C4, with extended fuselage) and 2 C-130J (C5, with standard length fuselage) Super Hercules Transport Aircraft from RAF stocks to the Turkish Air Force after undergoing the necessary maintenance, repair and overhaul procedures (FASBAT), Later on, the number of aircraft was revised as 12 (2 of which will be used as spare parts), all of which will be C-130J-30s, but the number of aircraft was re-determined as 10 aircraft (all long-body C-130J-30 versions) based on the airframe/structural condition of the aircraft. The contract was expected to be signed by the end of this year"

Air force as usual can't reach consensus, but C-130J deal is progressing well.

"The CN235s in the inventory are very worn out and have spare parts and sustainment problems. Some of them will undergo avionic modernization, some of them will be decommissioned in the future, perhaps they will be sold, and if the budget is available, they will be replaced by an estimated 20-25 new production C295 or C-27J aircraft. Of course, this will be realized on a 10-year timetable. In the first phase, 10 C-130Js are expected to be delivered between 2025 and 2027..."

C-27 would be a good pick for the air force on engine alone, but C-295 also uses the same engine Navy ATRs do; so there's that as well.

Remembering this post, new C-130J number is given as 12. So the number is again increased to 12, or are the +2 still for spare? We don't know.
 

Fairon

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Sünnetçi wrote about a smaller aircraft to bridge the gap and replace some capability that will be lost with aging C-235s last year.


C-27 would be a good pick for the air force on engine alone, but C-295 also uses the same engine Navy ATRs do; so there's that as well.

Remembering this post, new C-130J number is given as 12. So the number is again increased to 12, or are the +2 still for spare? We don't know.

Actually I am more leaning towards to mixed fleet with CN295 and C27. I think they will complement each other well. CN295 is longer but has less height, while the C27 is shorter but has greater height.(Also there is a slight MTOW difference as well) This could strengthens the air force’s hand when dealing with cargo of varying volumes with lower weights.

I've only written C27 because I think the Air Force wouldn't consider buying another aircraft after acquiring the C130J, and I tried to give myself hope by highlighting the C27 due to its engines :D
 

BalkanTurk90

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An unlimited number of Kızılelma and Anka3 can shift the balance of air power to our side in 3 years before any new foreign jet can be inducted.
Heavy Electronic attack by enemy and can you still use kizilelma or other drones ! While manned jets are another matter , they still can fly under electronic attack and at least bring jet back home not into the sea or at enemy airbase 🤦‍♂️
 

boredaf

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An unlimited number of Kızılelma and Anka3 can shift the balance of air power to our side in 3 years before any new foreign jet can be inducted.
In what world do we get "unlimited" number of KE and Anka-3 in 3 years, exactly? Because it is quite literally impossible in this one that we occupy right now.

We don't know how many Ukrainian engines we have now, nor do we know how many we can get over the course of next 3 years. However, we do know that their factory has been bombed multiple times over the course of the war, one being very recently.

We know that TF6000 is still going through ground testing, which is far from over, and then it'll have to go through another set of tests in the air. We also know that TF10000 hasn't been built or at the very least fired yet. After that, it'll have to go through ground tests first, then, it'll have to go through aerial testing.

Erdoğan himself said it probably wouldn't be ready before 2028 for TF6000 a couple of years ago, TEI engineers has said they expected it to start qualification tests by 2028 as well, some time last year. TEI CEO said TF10000 would be started in a few years, just this year.

So, please explain to me, how are we getting "unlimited number of KE and Anka 3" in 3 years, in a logical manner that is based on facts and basic understanding of physical reality.
 

what

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An unlimited number of Kızılelma and Anka3 can shift the balance of air power to our side in 3 years before any new foreign jet can be inducted.

An unlimited number of ducks can kill a tiger too eventually.
But no such thing as unlimited.
 

Zafer

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An unlimited number of ducks can kill a tiger too eventually.
But no such thing as unlimited.
When you make the plane yourself you are only bound by how many you want to make. The US made 48.000 planes in a year during WW2. Compared to only a couple hundred a couple thousand is unlimited.
 
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