Applause for Nazi SS officer in Canadian Parliament

Bogeyman 

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@Nilgiri What are you saying
 

Nilgiri

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@Nilgiri What are you saying


Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau recognize Yaroslav Hunka, who was in attendance and fought with the First Ukrainian Division in the Second World War before later immigrating to Canada, in the House of Commons on Friday.

One can look up some of the details and references here:


Especially under:

1. Background, organisation, atrocities etc
2. Canadian deschenes commission
3. Legacy

There are uncomfortable things like this with many countries (Finland also comes to mind) with many organisations that cooperated with the Nazis during WW2 for set of objectives that were not congruent with the Nazi ones (w.r.t their war crimes and holocaust etc)....but rather to leverage Wehrmacht power dynamic at play on the field against a common opponent (USSR in most cases).

Of course I don't like the double standards in play (I would not applaud any group/individual that has participated in WW2 under or alongside the Nazis), but there are many in play in Canada even domestically.

All kind of elements linked to Quebec violent separatism have for example been rehabilitated now in Canada (so there is large precedent now to look the other way on such things established). But on other issues such kinds of groups are treated much more "collectively" and "permanently".

In end it depends how politically convenient this is w.r.t the populations that harbour political leverage within Canada and their perspective on such matters as its resides with them. Ukraine minority is very significant one in Canada.

Maybe folks like @UkroTurk and @Woland can offer more comment on what they think.
 

UkroTurk

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One can look up some of the details and references here:


Especially under:

1. Background, organisation, atrocities etc
2. Canadian deschenes commission
3. Legacy

There are uncomfortable things like this with many countries (Finland also comes to mind) with many organisations that cooperated with the Nazis during WW2 for set of objectives that were not congruent with the Nazi ones (w.r.t their war crimes and holocaust etc)....but rather to leverage Wehrmacht power dynamic at play on the field against a common opponent (USSR in most cases).

Of course I don't like the double standards in play (I would not applaud any group/individual that has participated in WW2 under or alongside the Nazis), but there are many in play in Canada even domestically.

All kind of elements linked to Quebec violent separatism have for example been rehabilitated now in Canada (so there is large precedent now to look the other way on such things established). But on other issues such kinds of groups are treated much more "collectively" and "permanently".

In end it depends how politically convenient this is w.r.t the populations that harbour political leverage within Canada and their perspective on such matters as its resides with them. Ukraine minority is very significant one in Canada.

Maybe folks like @UkroTurk and @Woland can offer more comment on what they think.

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How could i answer dear?

İ think the main stimulus was the hatred toward NKVD .


@Nilgiri more divisions from Bosniacs
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1695507298819.png
 
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Ryder

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Honestly Ukrainians were not the only ones to collarborate with the Nazis.

Nazis had so many collarborators in Europe even extended to non Europeans like Africans, Turkish, Arabs, Indians, Caucasians and Central Asians.

Russians also had numerous collarborators to the Germans like the Russian liberation army.

Seriously what a fck up. This is just helping the Russians more in their propaganda.
 

Gary

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Honestly Ukrainians were not the only ones to collarborate with the Nazis.

Nazis had so many collarborators in Europe even extended to non Europeans like Africans, Turkish, Arabs, Indians, Caucasians and Central Asians.

And it's completely normal, I don't get why allying with (then) successful military forces like Germany is seen wrong to begin with. Any middle power wishing to share the power and grandeur of conquest would've realized that allying with Germany meant that you too could have a piece of the pie.


Nazi Germany is imo, vilified beyond belief in today's society.
 

Ryder

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And it's completely normal, I don't get why allying with (then) successful military forces like Germany is seen wrong to begin with. Any middle power wishing to share the power and grandeur of conquest would've realized that allying with Germany meant that you too could have a piece of the pie.


Nazi Germany is imo, vilified beyond belief in today's society.

I agree people make it such a big deal out of it.

Human history is literally littered with collarborations.

Since the ancient times.
 

Anastasius

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Oh Canada, never stop sticking your foot in your mouth. Whenever Americans feel bad about the shit going down over here, we can look up north and feel just a bit better about ourselves that we're not quite as cucked as Canada.

Regardless of whether Nazi Germany is excessively vilified or not (I think they are vilified just enough), this dude is a former war criminal.

"But you don't know that!"

He served in the Waffen SS. What are the odds he didn't participate in their usual modus operandi of brutalizing every civilian they saw? I'd put it at 0.

And don't get me wrong, I support Ukraine basically 100% in terms of kicking Russia's teeth in. I just think this is hilarious.
 

Ryder

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Oh Canada, never stop sticking your foot in your mouth. Whenever Americans feel bad about the shit going down over here, we can look up north and feel just a bit better about ourselves that we're not quite as cucked as Canada.

Regardless of whether Nazi Germany is excessively vilified or not (I think they are vilified just enough), this dude is a former war criminal.

"But you don't know that!"

He served in the Waffen SS. What are the odds he didn't participate in their usual modus operandi of brutalizing every civilian they saw? I'd put it at 0.

The problem with a lot of collarborators they tend praise the fck out of them.

Ukraine does it and the Baltic countries.

Russia has never condemned the Russian liberation army. But Russian nationalists and Russian momarchists who hate the Soviet Union and communism see them as heroes trying to save their nation from communism.

Some nations will never talk about their collarborations or will try to sweep it under the rug like the Netherlands which actually had the highest collarborators also had many of the Dutch who served in the German Army.

Role of Vichy France tends to get overlooked because the French control the narrative that most of the French fought for Free France and also overblow the role of the French Resistance.

France did not even liberate its country basically the Allied forces mainly the USA and UK did hence why most found it offensive how the French went into Paris first.
 

Xenon54

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People applaud Soviet collaborators all the times, all in all Stalin killed more people than Hitler, why is one bad and the other good?
 

Bogeyman 

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People applaud Soviet collaborators all the times, all in all Stalin killed more people than Hitler, why is one bad and the other good?
Because Hitler lost. The Soviets won. If Hitler had won, the propaganda machine would have said the exact opposite. Those who say Hitler burned the Jews are probably ignoring the US's use of nuclear weapons. I'm sure there are even people in the USA who are proud of this. That crazy chief of staff almost used nuclear weapons on China. But China got off cheap. If Hitler had won, US genocides would definitely have been taught in textbooks in the regions where Germans dominated. I have no doubt about it.

I say all this without taking any sides, of course. They committed great genocide on three sides.
 

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One can look up some of the details and references here:


Especially under:

1. Background, organisation, atrocities etc
2. Canadian deschenes commission
3. Legacy

There are uncomfortable things like this with many countries (Finland also comes to mind) with many organisations that cooperated with the Nazis during WW2 for set of objectives that were not congruent with the Nazi ones (w.r.t their war crimes and holocaust etc)....but rather to leverage Wehrmacht power dynamic at play on the field against a common opponent (USSR in most cases).

Of course I don't like the double standards in play (I would not applaud any group/individual that has participated in WW2 under or alongside the Nazis), but there are many in play in Canada even domestically.

All kind of elements linked to Quebec violent separatism have for example been rehabilitated now in Canada (so there is large precedent now to look the other way on such things established). But on other issues such kinds of groups are treated much more "collectively" and "permanently".

In end it depends how politically convenient this is w.r.t the populations that harbour political leverage within Canada and their perspective on such matters as its resides with them. Ukraine minority is very significant one in Canada.

Maybe folks like @UkroTurk and @Woland can offer more comment on what they think.
I think this was an exceptionally stupid move from Canada/Ukraine, it looks bad and is completely unnecessary.

Regarding Ukrainians who supported Germany in WWII, I'll try to provide some context with stories from my grandmother. She was Jewish and lived in a village somewhere next to Krivoy Rog (central Ukraine). She was too young to experience WWI but was around during Holodomor, and remembers people searching for food coming to sit down next to her house and dying of hunger several hours later. In 1941, as the Germans were advancing through Ukraine she recalled significant disagreement in the Jewish community. Some of her relatives remembered Germans from WWI fondly, described them as civilized, better than Russians, and that stories about German brutality was propaganda. Information was limited. My grandmother's family ended up evacuating East, but many stayed and welcomed Germany. Those who stayed were mostly killed as part of the Final Solution. Those who survived were later repressed by the Soviets for collaboration.

Similar stories played out across Ukraine. It's important to remember that after the Russian revolution, Germany supported the creation of the Ukrainian People's Republic (1917-1921). In exchange for food, Germany provided Ukraine with military support against Russia. The treaty of Brest-Litovsk established Ukraine as an independent nation. By 1918 however, Germany was defeated, and by 1921 the Ukrainian War of Independence was over. After the short-lived Ukrainian People's Republic, the horrors of Holodomor, and 20 years under the Soviet Union, many were willing to give Germany a chance.
 
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Ryder

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Mao Tsetung was responsible of 45 mio dead people, and nobody cared.

Stalin and Mao mainly killed their own people hence why nobody cares.

Then again if we are complaining about Communist China, Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union.

European Colonial Empires like Britain and France were also awful to be honest with their numerous atrocities. After WW2 the French tried whatever means to keep their empire intact by massacring Algerians and the Vietnamese the British and the Americans turned a blind eye to it.

British would have done the same thing but after ww2 it was clear that they can no longer keep their empire intact. Best example was the Mau Mau uprising where the British were pretty much brutal and ruthless against the Kenyans even keeping torture camps.
 
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Gary

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Mao Tsetung was responsible of 45 mio dead people, and nobody cared.
Like a lot...2 out of 3 industrial era biggest murderers are commies. In the case of Mao, most of them happened in only 4 years during the Great Leap Forward (1958-1962).

XIxtu8pRtqbdOqGokKuQJHH_0lJucsTokN_jDvA1Y8w.jpg


Yet today nations have diplomatic relations with the PRC, and respected its symbols and leaders.

Meanwhile Germany...
 

Xenon54

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Like a lot...2 out of 3 industrial era biggest murderers are commies. In the case of Mao, most of them happened in only 4 years during the Great Leap Forward (1958-1962).

XIxtu8pRtqbdOqGokKuQJHH_0lJucsTokN_jDvA1Y8w.jpg


Yet today nations have diplomatic relations with the PRC, and respected its symbols and leaders.

Meanwhile Germany...
Enver pashas bodycounty keeps increasing with each graph, we reached Armenians total population now, anyone who offers more?
 

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