TR Attack & Utility Helicopter Programs

[Sanchez]

Our best look yet to an air force T70 CSAR helicopter with its LWR, MWR, RWR, RF jammer, FLIR and winch. Not sure about the winch, but rest are Aselsan products. Such a complete, great package. I do hope T70 issue is soon resolved and we can continue production.

 

[Strong AI]

Beauty

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1926924987887222785

 

[Pete Mitchell Maverick]

This color added a different atmosphere to the helicopter.

 

[Sanchez]

New T925 scale model from Paris Air Show.

 

[uçuyorum]

New T925 scale model from Paris Air Show.

View attachment 75891

Finally a more sensible version

 

[Strong AI]

Finally a more sensible version

You also made some design modifications. Can you briefly explain? Because needs evolve over time.
Two years ago, we showcased a mockup of the 10-ton. Based on updated needs assessments, it became clear that a helicopter more like the T70 one that meets most operational requirements at an optimal level is needed. So, we said, let’s build one helicopter that maximizes commonality and benefit. We discussed it again with the forces.
Instead of the helicopter from the original mockup, we evolved it into a slightly larger and heavier version of the T70 that can lift more and fly faster. We’re planning to unveil it at IDEF.

 

[Pokemonte13]

New T925 scale model from Paris Air Show.

View attachment 75891

T-70 that went to grandma for the weekend

 

[Sanchez]

We of course don't have the details and it's conjecture, but I do think OGM's request for a more conventional design did lead to this back doorless design, OGM being the launch customer. And DzKK requests were shafted as a result.

To restart the clock, Kotil had mentioned in 2022 that first flight of T925 would happen in March 2024, that obviously didn't happen. Current claim is Q3 of 2026 with production start in 2028. Another ambitious claim.

 

[Strong AI]

And DzKK requests were shafted as a result.

Yeah would be nice to have. But i think at least Aselsan will make them happy.

 

[mTT]

10-Ton Class Water Bomber Helicopter

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10-Ton Class General Purpose Helicopter​

 

[Khagan1923]

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Would not be surprised if we see an announcement that the engine to be used will be the T700-TEI-701D. I do not see another viable alternative in the near future to power this.

Then of course who knows might see our officials be stubborn and continue betting on an Ukraine who clearly is in no shape to deliver the needed engines.

And yet the Navy is in no shape to wait half a decade until they can get their hands on new naval choppers.

 

[Strong AI]

Would not be surprised if we see an announcement that the engine to be used will be the T700-TEI-701D. I do not see another viable alternative in the near future to power this.

Then of course who knows might see our officials be stubborn and continue betting on an Ukraine who clearly is in no shape to deliver the needed engines.

And yet the Navy is in no shape to wait half a decade until they can get their hands on new naval choppers.

We’re proceeding with the Ukrainian engine. At the same time, a local engine project is ongoing between SSB and TEI. Hopefully, like with Gökbey, we’ll see it fly with a local engine too.

 

[TR_123456]

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This looks better then the mockup sent to Paris Air Show.

 

[Khagan1923]

This project is going nowhere with Ukrainian engines they don’t need to kid themselves and us. T-929 is dead in the water for the exact same reason. And this one will be too.

Even before the war Ukraine was not
Reliable and even less now( understandable)

 

[Strong AI]

This project is going nowhere with Ukrainian engines they don’t need to kid themselves and us. T-929 is dead in the water for the exact same reason. And this one will be too.

Even before the war Ukraine was not
Reliable and even less now( understandable)

Please read the whole post i quoted for you. They prioritize T925 over T929 for now.

We're working on a 10-ton helicopter and on Atak 2, and our approach is to unify them as much as possible. Whatever can be shared will be shared. The rotor blades, rotors, transmission, avionics, rivets, bolts, paint whatever is common will be used across both. Only the fuselage might be different, seats might vary, as those must be customized anyway. In this context, once we prioritized, we saw that there’s a high likelihood that the T70 might no longer be an option for the Land Forces, and there’s a serious need across the Land Forces, Air Forces, Naval Forces, and Gendarmerie. Between 2030 and 2040, a significant number of similar helicopters will be retired due to age. Considering all this, we consulted with authorities at the SSB and the forces, and made a decision:
We will prioritize the 10-ton helicopter over Atak 2 due to the greater need.

Does Baykar has problems acquiring ukrainian engine? All their KE prototypes are flying with ukrainian engine and afaik ANKA-3 too.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Would not be surprised if we see an announcement that the engine to be used will be the T700-TEI-701D. I do not see another viable alternative in the near future to power this.

Then of course who knows might see our officials be stubborn and continue betting on an Ukraine who clearly is in no shape to deliver the needed engines.

And yet the Navy is in no shape to wait half a decade until they can get their hands on new naval choppers.

TEI had licence to produce 248 engines between the 2020 to 2025 time period.

quote:

In the serial production phase which is expected to launch between 2020 and 2025, a total of 248 T700-TEI-701D engines (236 committed and 12 optional) will be produced. Within the program the objective is also to achieve the capacity to produce 1 engine per week in the later stage of the serial production phase.

unquote.

So after that date the licence would expire. Unless we can somehow extend the licence, there is no way to produce these engines. Our best bet would be to develop our own T700 like we did with CTS800 when producing TS1400.

The first Helicopter Engine Produced in Turkey – the T700-TEI-701D Engine Delivered to Power T70 Utility Helicopter

www.defenceturkey.com

 

[Khagan1923]

Please read the whole post i quoted for you. They prioritize T925 over T929 for now.



Does Baykar has problems acquiring ukrainian engine? All their KE prototypes are flying with ukrainian engine and afaik ANKA-3 too.

Yes Baykar has had problems acquiring engines. As had TAI. There is a reason why Baykar has started their own engine programs. I don’t know why some of you act as if we have peanut brains. Everyone with knowledge and the right sources knows what kind of problem Ukraine has been especially when it comes to the supply of these engines not to mention that they are outdated.

Do I need to tag @Anmdt here so he can go into detail, again ?

I said when T-929 “flew” years ago that the project won’t go anywhere with Ukrainian engines and I say the same now.

T-925 won’t happen with these engines. They might “fly” something as they did with T-929 as we get closer to the next election date though.

 

[Khagan1923]

TEI had licence to produce 248 engines between the 2020 to 2025 time period.

quote:

In the serial production phase which is expected to launch between 2020 and 2025, a total of 248 T700-TEI-701D engines (236 committed and 12 optional) will be produced. Within the program the objective is also to achieve the capacity to produce 1 engine per week in the later stage of the serial production phase.

unquote.

So after that date the licence would expire. Unless we can somehow extend the licence, there is no way to produce these engines. Our best bet would be to develop our own T700 like we did with CTS800 when producing TS1400.

The first Helicopter Engine Produced in Turkey – the T700-TEI-701D Engine Delivered to Power T70 Utility Helicopter

www.defenceturkey.com

Then both T-925 and T-929 are dead projects for the foreseeable future. Until they have a suitable engine ready in-country at least half a decade will pass.

Sometimes we need to accept that our officials are talking out of the wrong place because none of them are gonna openly declare a project a failure.

 

[Anmdt]

Then both T-925 and T-929 are dead projects for the foreseeable future. Until they have a suitable engine ready in-country at least half a decade will pass.

Sometimes we need to accept that our officials are talking out of the wrong place because none of them are gonna openly declare a project a failure.

929 was long dead, been a financial blackhole, nothing more than a flying "powertrain", but 925 definitely has a future. At least, the 925 we have seen before is dead, but a redesigned 925 is needed by all forces currently, also considering that T70 license is not continued, 925 is the only way to go. Ukrainian engines have no future, US may not supply the necessary engines for 925 as well, and that would leave us only with European, or Chinese alternatives.

 

[uçuyorum]

929 was long dead, been a financial blackhole, nothing more than a flying "powertrain", but 925 definitely has a future. At least, the 925 we have seen before is dead, but a redesigned 925 is needed by all forces currently, also considering that T70 license is not continued, 925 is the only way to go. Ukrainian engines have no future, US may not supply the necessary engines for 925 as well, and that would leave us only with European, or Chinese alternatives.

The 925 they first designed was good then they made a stupid redesign for whatever reason and now we are back to original sensible design more similar to T70. I don't understand why they thought a heli that can't be used by any ship or most hangars was ever considered.