TR Defence Exports & Updates

[Agha Sher]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605678805523259409

@Zafer

 

[B_A]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605678805523259409

 

[urban mine]

I tried to find a post about SOM that Roketsan suggested to Korea, but it was explained here.

KAI KF-21 Boramae (KFX Korean Indigenous Fighter program)

recent article talking about the integration of various air to ground missiles on both the FA-50 and KF-21. basically the Taurus series and LIG its interesting to note how many European missiles the KF-21 is planned to operate. its basically a Eurofighter but Korean it says it would take 2...

www.secretprojects.co.uk

"Then there is this program which is called the "Medium Range Air to Ground Missile". This program is currently going through ROKAF internal feasibility studies I've heard, which means nothing of it is official. ROKAF thinks that this program is not really urgent, since it will be primarily be used by the FA-50, replacing the Pre-ATO allocated to the F-4s' Popeyes. There currently 2 offers regarding this program, which are from Hanwha and Taurus GmbH(so MBDA, kinda).

Hamhwa is offering a license produced Roketsan SOM. Discussion between Hanwha and Roketsan seems to have been in place even prior to 2019 it seems. This makes sense for both parties, since Hanwha lost to LIG in LRAGM program and Roketsan lost its sales prospect for SOM-J after Turkey's expulsion from the JSF program.

Taurus on the other hand is offering what is known as the KEPD 350K-2, a smaller version of KEPD 350. I should say it reminds me of the old KEPD 150 a bit as well. Their original goal was to offer it to ROKAF as an ALCM for their F-16 fleet. For such reason it weighed around 1,100 kgs, meaning that its use on FA-50s would have been unsuitable. Then they've chamged their target as ALCM small enough to be operated by the FA-50, further minimizing its size into a sub-700 kg class ALCM. It has been revealed in the interview with president of Taurus Systems Korea last November, that Taurus Systems have sent RFI for possible joint,development to several entities within Korea, ramging from gov. agencies like ADD to private companies like Hanwha, KAI, LIG, etc."


The "Medium Range Air to Ground Missile" program has been suspended (almost terminated) because the FA-50 has decided not to take over the role of the F-4 (AGM-142). Even if the program comes back to life, it will be integrated into KF-21.

It seems to me that it is a matter of necessity. Not that Korea has neglected it in particular.

 

[Zafer]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605678805523259409

@Zafer

Mali

 

[Agha Sher]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605809104865267712

Rusky transport plane landed in Tekirdag. What could it be? Baykar has been clear that they don’t want to partake in war profiteering

 

[B_A]

As others have said before, Korea and Türkiye have different geostrategic and political environment. Most importantly Koreans don‘t have political conflicts with US and many European powers. And that won’t change in the foreseeable future: no embargoes or sanctions expected (except when we field nuclear weapons there will be a grand shitstorm ).

I respect Turkiye‘s enormous rise in the military arms development and industry against many odds. Korean strategists are pretty realistic in judging scientific, technological and industrial capabilities for the future and plan accordingly when to develop indigenous (sub-)systems or procure foreign parts.

1. Drones: They didn‘t ignore drone technology. Prototypes for reconnaissance and stealth drones have flown. Male UCAV was neglected. Overall Korean drone industry is pretty good.

2. SOM: Already in development, planned delpoyment in 2028. Most important part was to obtain deep multi-penetration tech for warhead - to crack NK strategic bunkers. Besides SK has extensive experience and deployed land-, sea-, submarine launched cruise missiles. Works on hypersonic missiles are also ongoing.

3. Jet engine: Actually only a handful of nations can build high performance turbofan engines as you surely know (US, UK, France, Russia, China). Even advanced aerospace countries like Germany and Japan are struggling. Horribly expensive and risky.

4. Air defense: After KM-SAM Block II (Russian tech refined with Korean electronics/software) for multi-tier multi-layered air defense. They‘re testing long range L-SAM anti-ballistic and anti-aircraft system with AESA radar (deployment 2026). Therefore I‘m interested in Turkish Hisar/Siper project

Similar to Turkiye the Koreans are working on 6,000 lbf thrust engine for loyal wingman-type stealth drones of KF-21. Hanwha Aerospace license-build GE engines (like TEI or was it Tusas?) and industrial gas turbines. Their advancements in this field are solid and government officials are totally secretive/sensitive about potential jet engine plans (not to stirr up shit with the US boys ).

No country is perfect when it comes to national defense planning: so far SK acted smart and performed well. The sole strategic missing link is going nuclear not only with SSN. Aircraft-carrier CVX plan IMO is an useless expensive toy of our Navy admirals. I‘m confident that our nation is on a safe way.

There‘s a future technological level assessment of a Korean think tank regarding SK and other hand-picked military powers (regrettably without assessment of Turkiye, would very interested in it):

국방기술진흥연구소

국방기술과 방위산업 혁신을 선도하는 연구기관

www.krit.re.kr

Download the PDF, it‘s in English and an interesting read.

As others have said before, Korea and Türkiye have different geostrategic and political environment. Most importantly Koreans don‘t have political conflicts with US and many European powers. And that won’t change in the foreseeable future: no embargoes or sanctions expected (except when we field nuclear weapons there will be a grand shitstorm ).

I respect Turkiye‘s enormous rise in the military arms development and industry against many odds. Korean strategists are pretty realistic in judging scientific, technological and industrial capabilities for the future and plan accordingly when to develop indigenous (sub-)systems or procure foreign parts.

1. Drones: They didn‘t ignore drone technology. Prototypes for reconnaissance and stealth drones have flown. Male UCAV was neglected. Overall Korean drone industry is pretty good.

2. SOM: Already in development, planned delpoyment in 2028. Most important part was to obtain deep multi-penetration tech for warhead - to crack NK strategic bunkers. Besides SK has extensive experience and deployed land-, sea-, submarine launched cruise missiles. Works on hypersonic missiles are also ongoing.

3. Jet engine: Actually only a handful of nations can build high performance turbofan engines as you surely know (US, UK, France, Russia, China). Even advanced aerospace countries like Germany and Japan are struggling. Horribly expensive and risky.

4. Air defense: After KM-SAM Block II (Russian tech refined with Korean electronics/software) for multi-tier multi-layered air defense. They‘re testing long range L-SAM anti-ballistic and anti-aircraft system with AESA radar (deployment 2026). Therefore I‘m interested in Turkish Hisar/Siper project

Similar to Turkiye the Koreans are working on 6,000 lbf thrust engine for loyal wingman-type stealth drones of KF-21. Hanwha Aerospace license-build GE engines (like TEI or was it Tusas?) and industrial gas turbines. Their advancements in this field are solid and government officials are totally secretive/sensitive about potential jet engine plans (not to stirr up shit with the US boys ).

No country is perfect when it comes to national defense planning: so far SK acted smart and performed well. The sole strategic missing link is going nuclear not only with SSN. Aircraft-carrier CVX plan IMO is an useless expensive toy of our Navy admirals. I‘m confident that our nation is on a safe way.

There‘s a future technological level assessment of a Korean think tank regarding SK and other hand-picked military powers (regrettably without assessment of Turkiye, would very interested in it):

국방기술진흥연구소

국방기술과 방위산업 혁신을 선도하는 연구기관

www.krit.re.kr

Download the PDF, it‘s in English and an interesting read.

You have political conflicts with China ,North Korea and Japan.

And japanese willing to sanctions in semiconductor

Btw i always felt your country overrate japanese.in your movies ,japanese always superpower

for course by now the Japanese Space rocket still advanced but not other industry

 

[Agha Sher]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605685078079770625

 

[Chocopie]

You have political conflicts with China ,North Korea and Japan.

And japanese willing to sanctions in semiconductor

Btw i always felt your country overrate japanese.in your movies ,japanese always superpower

for course by now the Japanese Space rocket still advanced but not other industry

SK doesn‘t use defence related material from China or Japan. My comment was related to usage of sanctionable US and European arm systems and parts.

The Japanese semiconductor material „sanctions“ was a shoot in the own foot. But the 1st time a Japanese administration tried to use an economic weapon against South Korea because of political differences.

Never underestimate your opponent, we know them Chinese and Japanese for several millennia. Japanese are still leading in material science and many technical fields. The Chinese with their vast capital and human ressources are making leaps in quantum computing and AI. We, as a smaller nation, have to punch above our weight class. Because it‘s the most challenging neighborhood with nuclear China, Russia, North Korea and untrustable Japan around.

 

[Lool]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1605685078079770625

This isnt a good sign, I guess
@TheInsider @Bogeyman any thoughts?

 

[Bogeyman]

 

[what]

That reminds me, of something. To all those that oppose defence exports to certain countries. These exports create dependencies, look at us for example in the past with our defence equipment.

If you buy Turkish equipment, you buy into an ecosystem. If you plan to use your new toys in the future, you will need Turkey once again. Meaning if you as a buyer of Turkish equipment ruin your relations with the country, you might no longer get your vehicles, drones etc serviced, get no spare parts or the bombs/missiles you need for your new toys.

 

[Afif]

That reminds me, of something. To all those that oppose defence exports to certain countries. These exports create dependencies, look at us for example in the past with our defence equipment.

If you buy Turkish equipment, you buy into an ecosystem. If you plan to use your new toys in the future, you will need Turkiye once again. Meaning if you as a buyer of Turkish equipment ruin your relations with the country, you might no longer get your vehicles, drones etc serviced, get no spare parts or the bombs/missiles you need for your new toys.

Exactly, when it comes to certain unfriendly countries, these sells in the end actually works somewhat in Turkeys advantage.
i tried to explain it once somewhere in this forum but didn't worked out very well!

And when it comes to allies and friendly countries it is a win win for both parties!
for example, if now BD intended to use newly bought drones and MLRS in a limited offensive in against Myanmar at the south eastern border, Turkey wont cut our supply for so called 'violation of international law.'

This was one of the crucial factor why BD chose Kaplan and tb2. even though iirc, Chinese offered similar capabilities, but they came up with some limiting string attached to it.

And hopefully, in the next couple of years Turkey will also get the tender for the army's ATGM and manpad license production project.
( the order expected to be in thousand.)

 

[Stimpy75]

Uganda

 

[Agha Sher]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1606219294202687488

2022 recap. IHA-230 hit also shown.

 

[what]

Reaction videos are not news.

 

[Ripley]

That reminds me, of something. To all those that oppose defence exports to certain countries. These exports create dependencies, look at us for example in the past with our defence equipment.

If you buy Turkish equipment, you buy into an ecosystem. If you plan to use your new toys in the future, you will need Turkiye once again. Meaning if you as a buyer of Turkish equipment ruin your relations with the country, you might no longer get your vehicles, drones etc serviced, get no spare parts or the bombs/missiles you need for your new toys.

@what

I am one of those who oppose but as I said before I raise my objection for certain countries and also must emphasize that I’m not against arms sales to such countries.

The buzzword here is dependent. And let’s face it, who could know this better than us, Turks, who countless times had to wait for approval or even scared of making any military moves because of embargo fear and economic sanctions. That’s dependency right there.

There are some certain countries, however, who can not be tied by contractual binding and proved numerous times they don’t like to be dependent (politically and militarily) contrary to common belief. Because
- they are rich and don’t care about the financial burden once Turkey (or any other country for that matter) pulls the plug off if they get bent out of shape.
- they are known to change sides OR ‘purchase new friends‘ frequently as the situation changes
- they are (some of them) also known as masters of playing both sides against the middle

In conclusion, I wouldn’t rely on the assumption that military deals/sales will create dependent states and you can pull the strings from Ankara when it comes to, again, certain governments since they act as they see fit and are not bothered by political ties or military and technological partnerships.
Therefore, Turkey must be careful especially where technological cooperation is involved.
That’s my two cents.

 

[zio]

Two anka for Tunisia,9 anka with satcom and sar radar payloads for maleisa in 3 systems.Defence Turkey magazine issue 119.

 

[Afif]

Two anka for Tunisia,9 anka with satcom and sar radar payloads for maleisa in 3 systems.Defence Turkiye magazine issue 119.

@Zafer i told you bruh!

 

[Agha Sher]

Two anka for Tunisia,9 anka with satcom and sar radar payloads for maleisa in 3 systems.Defence Turkiye magazine issue 119.

Is it two additional Anka for Tunesia? They already received 3, correct?

 

[Zafer]

@Zafer i told you bruh!

They are already on the map. We can not track numbers as they are not usually disclosed.