TR F-16 Özgür | Hürkuş - Fighter Trainer Aircraft Projects

[BTT34]

personally , I stopped following ( engine projects - altay tank project ) news because it's became a pure propaganda not just by the government but also by ssb and defense firms .

He was talking about turboshaft engines, not internal-combustion engine. Also It's not a propaganda. Turkey has enough know-how for turboshaft engines

 

[Ecderha]

A total cliché question, how much of that "engine" have we completed ?

I know TEI has said we've developed the core engine, but how much else progress has been made ? If anyone have an infogram depicting the engine and showing percentage wise and with colors completing it would be really helpful.

I am sorry mate, but you question is just unthinkable?
You forgeting that if TEI or Any offical show some prove there will Imediate reaction from psudo Allies.
I dont want to think what will be the embargo reaction or etc if Turkiye show any progress on engine.
Turkiye is not ready to handle Counter rage from west It will be big Campain against Turkiye

 

[AWP]

I am sorry mate, but you question is just unthinkable?
You forgeting that if TEI or Any offical show some prove there will Imediate reaction from psudo Allies.
I dont want to think what will be the embargo reaction or etc if Turkiye show any progress on engine.
Turkiye is not ready to handle Counter rage from west It will be big Campain against Turkiye

embargo against turkey because they manufacture their own engine ? how ?

 

[Ecderha]

embargo against turkey because they manufacture their own engine ? how ?

I am not talking about any engine.
Post is about progress of MMU engine.

When context is MMU engine then Things change.
Turkiye is on Close watch.
So nobody predict or expect Turkiye to have big progress on MMU own engine. That is the question and as I said at posts above that nobody from Turkiye officals should show any progress.
Keep it as Turkish dream

 

[Cabatli_TR]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1479113696156680194

 

[Combat-Master]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1479113696156680194

On the left side of the image, I can see the wing of Hurjet?

 

[Combat-Master]

 

[Combat-Master]

 

[Stuka]

TAI

2 Hürküs HYEU
> 2nd Hürkus is in the Hangar behind the T129.

 

[Yasar_TR]

According to this site (I am not sure how trustworthy the site is. I have only just come across it) all F16s block 30 planes that were placed in hangar for structural upgrades may have had their “Ozgur” modernisation completed before they have left - sans Aesa - . It reckons Aesa will be completing on the plane flight tests this year and start being fitted on to F16s.

Türkiye’nin F16 talebi ve Özgür Projesi

Kamuoyunda ve özellikle savunma sanayii sektöründe son günlerde sıkça gündeme gelen konu; Türkiye’nin F-16 talebi. Önümüzdeki günlerde de bu konu tartışılmaya devam edecek gibi gözüküyor. F-16 talebi konusu birçok farklı açıdan ele alındı ve tartışıldı. Bana göre Türkiye ve F-16 sözcükleri aynı...

defensehere.com

There are, however, a number of very valid questions right at the end of the article that is worth mentioning:
1. Since the F16s that we have in our inventory are not “free”/“Ozgur” , why are we trying to buy more planes that will not be “free”/“Ozgur”?
2. Why are we asking US to modernise our 80 planes, when we can do it better with our Ozgur modernisation project?
3. By choosing US route, won’t our planes be dependent on US whims and decisions ?

 

[tayyare]

According to this site (I am not sure how trustworthy the site is. I have only just come across it) all F16s block 30 planes that were placed in hangar for structural upgrades may have had their “Ozgur” modernisation completed before they have left - sans Aesa - . It reckons Aesa will be completing on the plane flight tests this year and start being fitted on to F16s.

Türkiye’nin F16 talebi ve Özgür Projesi

Kamuoyunda ve özellikle savunma sanayii sektöründe son günlerde sıkça gündeme gelen konu; Türkiye’nin F-16 talebi. Önümüzdeki günlerde de bu konu tartışılmaya devam edecek gibi gözüküyor. F-16 talebi konusu birçok farklı açıdan ele alındı ve tartışıldı. Bana göre Türkiye ve F-16 sözcükleri aynı...

defensehere.com

There are, however, a number of very valid questions right at the end of the article that is worth mentioning:
1. Since the F16s that we have in our inventory are not “free”/“Ozgur” , why are we trying to buy more planes that will not be “free”/“Ozgur”?
2. Why are we asking US to modernise our 80 planes, when we can do it better with our Ozgur modernisation project?
3. By choosing US route, won’t our planes be dependent on US whims and decisions ?
View attachment 38171

Apparently we have access to source code and such for Block 30/40 and we can modify, but we can’t modify block 50/50+ readily. If we had to we would probably have to remove all the avionics and basically rebuild the plane. So it makes more sense if those can be upgraded by Lockheed.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Apparently we have access to source code and such for Block 30/40 and we can modify, but we can’t modify block 50/50+ readily. If we had to we would probably have to remove all the avionics and basically rebuild the plane. So it makes more sense if those can be upgraded by Lockheed.

I think you will find that we only have partial access to some of the planes‘ computer programming. We are managing to introduce all our own indigenous weapons to the planes as US counterparts. (KGK as JSOW , HGK as JDAM, SOM as JASSM, GOKDOGAN as AMRAAM etc etc) . Currently we have no problems doing it to any of the blocks we have in our inventory.(as confirmed by Tubitak MD).
Ozgur modernisation actually upgrades all avionics to V70 level and gives us access to our own flight computer.
There is some form of a time limit of either 25years or 30 years (it was discussed here earlier as either 25 or 30 years) on any F16 purchased, that we can not interfere with on any of it’s parts. Apparently, Block 30s are out of this time limit. Block 40s will become available gradually till 2025. Then the block 50s.
If you check below list you can see the expiration of these time limits on the various F16s purchased over the years. (If that is the case)
How this non interference agreement is drawn out and how it is implemented is still a mystery until we see the actual purchase contract of our f16s which were purchased under FMS rules.

 

[Ryder]

Ozgur camo is so beautiful!!

 

[TheInsider]

Apparently we have access to source code and such for Block 30/40 and we can modify, but we can’t modify block 50/50+ readily. If we had to we would probably have to remove all the avionics and basically rebuild the plane. So it makes more sense if those can be upgraded by Lockheed.

That is not true. Both the president of SSB and the director of Tubitak Sage confirmed that we can upgrade all of our F-16s on our own. The President of the SSB spoke crystal clear. There is no room to speculate in his words. I take his word until I see concrete evidence.

 

[TheInsider]

According to this site (I am not sure how trustworthy the site is. I have only just come across it) all F16s block 30 planes that were placed in hangar for structural upgrades may have had their “Ozgur” modernisation completed before they have left - sans Aesa - . It reckons Aesa will be completing on the plane flight tests this year and start being fitted on to F16s.

Türkiye’nin F16 talebi ve Özgür Projesi

Kamuoyunda ve özellikle savunma sanayii sektöründe son günlerde sıkça gündeme gelen konu; Türkiye’nin F-16 talebi. Önümüzdeki günlerde de bu konu tartışılmaya devam edecek gibi gözüküyor. F-16 talebi konusu birçok farklı açıdan ele alındı ve tartışıldı. Bana göre Türkiye ve F-16 sözcükleri aynı...

defensehere.com

There are, however, a number of very valid questions right at the end of the article that is worth mentioning:
1. Since the F16s that we have in our inventory are not “free”/“Ozgur” , why are we trying to buy more planes that will not be “free”/“Ozgur”?
2. Why are we asking US to modernise our 80 planes, when we can do it better with our Ozgur modernisation project?
3. By choosing US route, won’t our planes be dependent on US whims and decisions ?
View attachment 38171

We paid a big chunk of money for the F-35 program we want to make use of that. The US won't pay that money in cash ever.
We know the US congress will reject our advances. We are using this situation against them.
We can upgrade our F-16s but 40 new Vipers will be very good for our short-term needs. The only way to get the new vipers is to buy them from the US. Other options(Russian, Chinese or European fighters) are too costly. We can immediately retire the aging F-4 fleet and will be in a good position until supersonic MİUS matures and TF-X serial production starts. Currently, there is no life and death situation as there is not a huge generational gap between F-16 CCIP and F-16 block 70 but 40 additional vipers will be very good for us.

 

[Yasar_TR]

We paid a big chunk of money for the F-35 program we want to make use of that. The US won't pay that money in cash ever.
We know the US congress will reject our advances. We are using this situation against them.
We can upgrade our F-16s but 40 new Vipers will be very good for our short-term needs. The only way to get the new vipers is to buy them from the US. Other options(Russian, Chinese or European fighters) are too costly. We can immediately retire the aging F-4 fleet and will be in a good position until supersonic MİUS matures and TF-X serial production starts. Currently, there is no life and death situation as there is not a huge generational gap between F-16 CCIP and F-16 block 70 but 40 additional vipers will be very good for us.

True! We need to make a point by trying to buy more planes to recover the monies we have with the US company.
There are many faces of this medallion though;
1. Do we really need 40 more planes if we have the capability to furnish all our existing F16s with new flight computers, Aesa radars and V70 level avionics and electronics?
2. Why do we need the US company to upgrade our F16s to V70 level if we can do it even better ourselves?
3.If they do it they won’t be Ozgur.
4. If these 40 planes are being requested as stop gap measure, we should be aware that they won’t be available for shipment before 2027 and probably more. (Taiwan order accepted in 2019 for deliveries between 2023 to 2026). Five customers have ordered 128 F-16 Block 70/72s; 66 from Taiwan, 24 from Morocco, 16 from Bahrain, 14 from Slovakia and eight from Bulgaria. Indonesia may be reverting back to F16s from the Russian Su35s too. They will have to wait their turn to receive these planes. Our only advantage could be, if LM agrees, to produce the 40 planes and it’s engines in Tusas and TEI respectively to expedite deliveries.

 

[TheInsider]

2. Why do we need the US company to upgrade our F16s to V70 level if we can do it even better ourselves?

Because we are betting they are going to refuse and then we will upgrade it ourselves and show them that we are not dependent on them. Did you listen to the speech of Erdogan yesterday? We are continuously trying to send them a message. The massage is a military embargo on Türkiye is a wasted effort and we are doing it with reverse psychology. We want to buy something from them they see that as a weakness then we slap back with our own products/answers. There is a pattern here. The first few times people thought this was a fluke but now there is a growing understanding that it is not. A lot of people were questioned Turkish defense products in the past. I think this is a very wise way to handle the situation. When the US wants to blame us we say hey we want to buy it from you guys but you didn't sell so I produced it on my own.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1479362165689753600

They didn't give us UAVS and UCAVs we produced better ones.
They didn't give us airdefense systems we bought some at the first phase after that we produced Hisar and now we are developing Siper and beyond.
They didn't give us cameras for our UAVs they thought that we can't produce them on our own, we produced them too.
The next line of this speech will be
They didn't upgrade our fighters. We upgraded our fighters on our own.

1. Do we really need 40 more planes if we have the capability to furnish all our existing F16s with new flight computers, Aesa radars and V70 level avionics and electronics?

It is not vital but it will be really good. We can retire F-4s immediately.

4. If these 40 planes are being requested as stop gap measure, we should be aware that they won’t be available for shipment before 2027 and probably more. (Taiwan order accepted in 2019 for deliveries between 2023 to 2026). Five customers have ordered 128 F-16 Block 70/72s; 66 from Taiwan, 24 from Morocco, 16 from Bahrain, 14 from Slovakia and eight from Bulgaria. Indonesia may be reverting back to F16s from the Russian Su35s too. They will have to wait their turn to receive these planes. Our only advantage could be, if LM agrees, to produce the 40 planes and it’s engines in Tusas and TEI respectively to expedite deliveries.

You wrote your own answer. We are betting TEI to produce F-110 engines and TAI to produce block 70 F-16s. F-110 will also be used for prototype TF-X and maybe for early serial production. TAI can also produce F-16s for some other countries as the LM production line is very crowded.

 

[Combat-Master]

BLOCK 70​	Block 30 - OZGUR Modernisation​

 

[akrepon]

BLOCK 70​	Block 30 - OZGUR Modernisation​
View attachment 38202​	View attachment 38204​

Both look nice but I noticed visuals on the left one. It is night vision view. Do we have the similar features such as this one for example?

 

[Turko]

Both look nice but I noticed visuals on the left one. It is night vision view. Do we have the similar features such as this one for example?

ASELPOD Advanced Targeting Pod Electro-Optical Reconnaissance, Surveillance and Targeting System | ASELSAN

ASELPOD Advanced Targeting Pod Electro-Optical Reconnaissance, Surveillance and Targeting System

www.aselsan.com.tr