Heartbang
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We dunno what kinda deal Erdogan has struck in the summit, but Greek and Armenian sycophants are seething HARD. 
We seriously need to stop reading shitty greek and armenian propagandaWe dunno what kinda deal Erdogan has struck in the summit, but Greek and Armenian sycophants are seething HARD.
Regardless of what they think, it is a deal in which Turkey loses everything yet gains nothing. You cant be admitted to the EU in a day and a night but you can admit Sweden into the EU within a fortnight!
What makes ppl confident that the EU will fulfill their pledge to admit Turkey into the EU after Sweden joins NATO? This is literally the refugee deal all over again 8n which Erdogan got tricked badly
Moreover, the moment Turkey joins the EU it will be subjected to direct orders from the EU parliament where applicable and this might include the release of radical PKK terrorists from prisons or even the withdrawal of Turkey from Syria etc
Finally, the dispute regarding the Med East EEZ with Greece still hasnt been resolved and only God knows where that will end
I just see no way in which Turkey benefits from this deal
AWP
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Why everyone acting shocked for this ? I mean we all know at one point that Turkey would allow Sweden to enter Nato . What power do Turkey have ? Powerful EU countries changed their policy to flatter the US
RTE made the economy a shithole and if Turkey refused Sweden , any economical threat even from Alzheimer Biden will send Lira to the shit .
At the end of the day , if you have a powerful army to facd pkk/ypg but still a pussy fearing the West then the problem is not the West .
Turkey always wanted some sort of cover or a shoulder to cry like in 2015 and 2020 .
If RTE had 1% of his Sensei courage he would be great .
RTE made the economy a shithole and if Turkey refused Sweden , any economical threat even from Alzheimer Biden will send Lira to the shit .
At the end of the day , if you have a powerful army to facd pkk/ypg but still a pussy fearing the West then the problem is not the West .
Turkey always wanted some sort of cover or a shoulder to cry like in 2015 and 2020 .
If RTE had 1% of his Sensei courage he would be great .
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The issue is not fearing the West. There is nobody in NATO except the US that could permanently deny Sweden membership, including European countries with good economies. The issue is not even trying to extract promises on other topics. EU tries to blackmail Turkey daily anyway. Any promises we gained would always have tricky enforcement but I'm sure mechanisms are thought of to make it as reliable as possible.
The issue is Erdogan saying this stuff publicly. I am sure Europeans try to force much cruder blackmail on Turkey behind closed doors but the operative phrase is behind closed doors. When you look like you want to publicly trade NATO membership for EU, you look like a shifty merchant. It hurts the legitimacy of your valid claims such as Sweden supporting terror.
Erdogan has an abrasive, argumentative style that is obnoxious to many westerners. Much of the reason the western countries don't even consider the Turkish perspectives on issues we are extremely justified in, such as terror in Syria and EEZ issues with Greece, is because Erdogan's image is too negative in their eyes. Any western public opinion shift will not be possible with Erdogan in charge. Thankfully we are strong enough that our vital interests are not dependent on western public opinion. But it wouldn't hurt to have Erdogan behaving like a professional diplomat once in a while. The UKR-RUS balance was going pretty well, for example.
The issue is Erdogan saying this stuff publicly. I am sure Europeans try to force much cruder blackmail on Turkey behind closed doors but the operative phrase is behind closed doors. When you look like you want to publicly trade NATO membership for EU, you look like a shifty merchant. It hurts the legitimacy of your valid claims such as Sweden supporting terror.
Erdogan has an abrasive, argumentative style that is obnoxious to many westerners. Much of the reason the western countries don't even consider the Turkish perspectives on issues we are extremely justified in, such as terror in Syria and EEZ issues with Greece, is because Erdogan's image is too negative in their eyes. Any western public opinion shift will not be possible with Erdogan in charge. Thankfully we are strong enough that our vital interests are not dependent on western public opinion. But it wouldn't hurt to have Erdogan behaving like a professional diplomat once in a while. The UKR-RUS balance was going pretty well, for example.
Not really
EU doesnt consider Turkey's perspective on issues like Syria, PKK/YPG, and terrorism is because they are the ones who are financing such radical groups in order to destabilise Turkey in the first place before even Erdogan was made president or prime minister
USA was the one that formed the PKK in the 70s (I believe) in order to destabilise Turkey. Greece used to give its own lands as military bases for training and countries like France, Germany, and Sweden not only financed the PKK but are also suspected of financing Isis
The game is way bigger than you think and the reason for all this is that Turkey is weak to pursue its own interests while those who destabilise Turkey are the ones who control the current world order! The decades of inaction by the Ottomans and after Ataturk till now haunts Turkiye and the Turks till this date
Not really. It was the Soviets who set up the PKK to destabilize a frontier NATO country with a Marxist group but it doesn't matter now. I am talking about the public opinion. The support of West for the PKK is due to the bad image of Turkey in their eyes and the freedom-loving feminist, environmentalist image the PKK (or "the Kurds" as they like to call them) cultivated. Public opinion is what moves these matter rather than realpolitik. If the public hated PKK as much as they hated ISIS the Western governments would not be able to support PKK as openly to this extent. There is no shadowy group running world politics. It's just a mess of perceptions aimed at gullible populations.
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According to Arda Zentürk the economic woes of Turkey is to blame for the cavein. If you think of how much trade we have with EU I think it makes sense.
www.hurriyetdailynews.com
Seriously, what has he even accomplished in reforms ever since the goddamn coup for him to talk about EU membership, nothing.
He's raped Türkiyes economy and brought it to this point and put the noose of the gallow on the country's neck himself.
Sweden to actively support Türkiye’s EU bid - Türkiye News
A joint statement issued by Türkiye, Sweden and NATO stipulates the Nordic state’s active support towards reviving the former’s stalled accession process into the European Union in return for getting the green light to join the security alliance.
Seriously, what has he even accomplished in reforms ever since the goddamn coup for him to talk about EU membership, nothing.
He's raped Türkiyes economy and brought it to this point and put the noose of the gallow on the country's neck himself.
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The US had set the 2023 NATO leaders' summit as a deadline 3-4 months ago. So today. The US failed to achieve this, but TR announced that it would submit the decision to the parliament, that is, at the presidential level, it announced that it approved Sweden's membership under the conditions set.
Parliament may vote on the resolution in early October. In the first two weeks until October 17, the 2023 budget bill will be proposed, so the vote on this resolution could be postponed until late October or early November. We have at least 3 months ahead of us. This is enough time to see what will happen and what will not happen. Also, read Devlet Bahçeli's recent statement carefully. He very clearly reaffirmed his stance against this decision. Unless this is a rupture in the government wing, and there is not much argument to support that at the moment, there are other calculations at play.
Parliament may vote on the resolution in early October. In the first two weeks until October 17, the 2023 budget bill will be proposed, so the vote on this resolution could be postponed until late October or early November. We have at least 3 months ahead of us. This is enough time to see what will happen and what will not happen. Also, read Devlet Bahçeli's recent statement carefully. He very clearly reaffirmed his stance against this decision. Unless this is a rupture in the government wing, and there is not much argument to support that at the moment, there are other calculations at play.
B_A
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Leftist always had support in West,even in cold war age,lot s of westerners,even the elites support Marxist ,even in japan there were Marxist Japan red army.
Meanwhile the extremist religious organization such as ISIS of cos dislike by them
I hope you are right my friend. But to be completely honest with you it won't be the case. We will be deceived once again. I am sorry to say that but I agree with some of the members about leaders having courage...
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I am just trying to put the developments in a logical framework. I don't claim to be right, and I could probably be wrong about a lot of things.
Bahçeli's statement on the issue and his clear statement on the unacceptability of the situation is an important detail. He even went further and said that Parliament should work until September without going into recess. This is also an important detail. If we taking into account their other statements (improving the living conditions of pensioners, etc.), Bahçeli started to do what the opposition could not do, at least in terms of rhetoric.
MHP support is essential for a simple majority. If the CHP supports it and not the MHP, it means that the government has already fallen. Even within the AKP, the situation is not clear and the reactions after the decision reminding me of failed March 1st decree.
The Turkish Presidency gave the green light to Sweden's NATO membership, but the leader of the main supporting structure that made it possible for the President to be there gave the red light. On the other hand, while the White House had set the July summit as the deadline, Stoltenberg said that the process in the Turkish Parliament should be respected, in a sense pointing to October.
Other topics: What about the Ukraine war from a geopolitical perspective? Is Russia winning or losing? How far can TR delay Sweden's accession and at what point can it jeopardize its gains and at what point can it produce the best benefits. I will skip these discussions as they are a bit subjective.
The most important issue that attracts my attention at this stage is the repercussions on domestic politics. Something is happening, either deep rifts will emerge or there are other calculations, I am not sure for now. Meanwhile, our main opposition leader Kılıçdaroğlu says that Selahattin Demirtaş and Osman Kavala is Turkiye's path to the EU. God must give this country a proper opposition first, nothing will happen before that. RTE is a big Atlanticist, he was well restrained until now. In this respect, the current cabinet gave him room for maneuver. But the problem is that the alternative to his position was worse than him.
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Sending Syrian refugees home - it's likely there will be more coming from Idlib instead.
Also note the US did not make any such effort, they are not in favour of the factions that Turkey is with in the NW.
Russia's veto - I think it is linked to Erdogan's statements. This is likely going to be another foreign policy problem.
Chakib.Y
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after turkey becomes an EU member
Erdogan: now milk me a pigeon, after that i'll think about it
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Here we go
US Senate Foreign Relations Committee member Chris Van Hollen: (F-16 sale to Turkey)
I haven't changed my mind yet.
Ankara should at least commit not to use these weapons against NATO members or America's Kurdish allies.
We will have to consider all this going forward.
But I want to say that it is a big step forward that Turkey has finally accepted Sweden as part of NATO.
When you bend over this is what happens.
US Senate Foreign Relations Committee member Chris Van Hollen: (F-16 sale to Turkey)
I haven't changed my mind yet.
Ankara should at least commit not to use these weapons against NATO members or America's Kurdish allies.
We will have to consider all this going forward.
But I want to say that it is a big step forward that Turkey has finally accepted Sweden as part of NATO.
When you bend over this is what happens.
Heartbang
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Its impossible to enforce such commitments with platforms like F-16s. If they hadn't kicked us off JSF program, those statements would have more oomph.
I don't think the Turkish Armed Forces lose sleep over these statements. And you shouldn't as well.
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Yeah sure mate. When the US stops spare parts delivery or sanctions us when TAF flies sorties on the Sea of Islands or Northern Syria, it would be best if you remind us not to lose sleep.
