TR HÜRJET-Advanced Jet Trainer/ Light attack aircraft

[Sanchez]

Hürjet 20-30% larger with 2 F-404 engines

I see where you are coming in regards to a "Hürjet-N", but I don't think we should forget that Hürjet should first and foremost be a capable trainer aircraft, that is by its nature is somewhat cheap to acquire and cheap to operate.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

I see where you are coming in regards to a "Hürjet-N", but I don't think we should forget that Hürjet should first and foremost be a capable trainer aircraft, that is by its nature is somewhat cheap to acquire and cheap to operate.

The Hürjet, in its current trainer configuration, is not suitable for a naval version. Investing in such an adaptation would be a waste of resources, as the aircraft would be outmatched in every aspect. In a potential conflict, it would stand no chance against competitors. Deploying an aircraft carrier to critical positions only to discover that the adversary has significantly superior aircraft—two or three Levels ahead of the Hürjet—would defeat the entire purpose of such deployments. Under those circumstances, building aircraft carriers or maintaining overseas bases in locations like Libya or Somalia would be meaningless.

The goal is not to actively engage in war but to establish a credible deterrence, especially against future rivals like France, Greece, Russia, Iran, and India. Credible deterrence requires capable systems. If a naval fleet equipped with carriers is deployed but forced to retreat from potential danger zones due to an inability to secure air superiority or adequately defend those areas, the deterrent effect is nullified. A semi-competitive aircraft is not a "nice to have" but an absolute necessity.

The ideal solution would be a low-cost, naval stealth aircraft. The Hürjet M should be 20–30% larger, with significant design revisions incorporating stealth features, drawing on elements from the TAI KAAN. With two F-404 engines, it would have sufficient thrust to carry more payload while remaining agile and fast. A small internal weapons bay capable of carrying 2–3 air-to-air missiles (AAMs) would allow it to serve alongside Kızılelma as a stealthy interceptor. In essence, this revised Hürjet would resemble an enhanced F/A-18 Hornet, but with better stealth characteristics and modern systems.

The addition of a second pilot would enable the management of drone operations. This pilot could oversee targeting and direct drones in offensive, defensive, or support roles via predefined tactical commands, assuming the drones are sufficiently autonomous to handle such tasks.

A pleasant side effect is that you would have a very affordable naval platform that Spain, Italy, and even the UK might consider purchasing as a complement to the F-35B/C.

 

[boredaf]

The ideal solution would be a low-cost, naval stealth aircraft. The Hürjet M should be 20–30% larger, with significant design revisions incorporating stealth features, drawing on elements from the TAI KAAN. With two F-404 engines, it would have sufficient thrust to carry more payload while remaining agile and fast. A small internal weapons bay capable of carrying 2–3 air-to-air missiles (AAMs) would allow it to serve alongside Kızılelma as a stealthy interceptor. In essence, this revised Hürjet would resemble an enhanced F/A-18 Hornet, but with better stealth characteristics and modern systems.

The aircraft you're describing has absolutely nothing to do with Hürjet, you're talking about a completely new aircraft. At that point, we'd be far better off with starting with Kaan's design instead of Hürjet and making a smaller, single engine Kaan for the navy.

And as it is, with minimal changes, Hürjet is a shitty choice for an aircraft carrier that we expect to have in 10-15 years. It is already behind the times, by the time it is on the carrier, it'll be completely obsolete and nothing but an embarrassment and potential missile fodder.

It's a bloody trainer, its inherent weakness come from the fact that it is a trainer. As long as you're basing something on it, that version (whether it is light attack or naval) will share those weaknesses.

 

[Huelague]

is already behind the times, by the time it is on the carrier, it'll be completely obsolete and nothing but an embarrassment and potential missile fodder.

Obsolete and behind the times, like 60-70% of all our weapon systems, including F-16. And we try more to buy.
Dont be so unkind, huh.

 

[boredaf]

Obsolete and behind the times, like 60-70% of all our weapon systems, including F-16. And we try more to buy.
Dont be so unkind, huh.

First, I said it'll be obsolete by the time we will have the carrier, not right now. US keeps building 100+ F-35s a year, radar and missile tech keeps improving, more and more countries testing stealth fighter drones like KE and on top of all that, 6th gen is either already being designed or prototyped. So, yes, I'd argue by the time a naval Hürjet might be seen on our carrier, it'll be obsolete.

Second, comparing Hürjet with F-16 Block 70 is ridiculous. Hürjet, as a fighter jet, is virtually half the jet F-16 is. And we are not planning to put those on a carrier in 2040s.

And last, I'm not being "unkind", I'm being realistic about what Hürjet is, a fantastic trainer, a good light attack jet for countries that doesn't need to drop really heavy munitions and a terrible naval jet for 2040s.

 

[uçuyorum]

So we should make TF/A - 18 A/B? Naval hürjet should just be a stepping stone for something better that will come later.

 

[dBSPL]

Since Germany lifted their opposition to the supply of Typhoon jets, the EJ200 engines can be produced in house by Kale/RR for 40 planes(80+ engines) and 90 Hurjets (100 engines).
On top of these if we export Hurjets and go for another squadron of Typhoons there could be an optional quantity of some 70-80 engines. That is a total of 260+ engines.
A reasonable price point can be achieved for the single use of EJ200 when you add approximately 50 more navalised engines needed for the Hurjet Naval too.

The maximum armament capacity of the Gripen C/D with the F404 engine variant RM-12 is 11700lb/5300kg.

Although the maximum ammunition capacity of Gripen E/F with the F414 variant (RM-16) is not specifically stated which pylon can carry how much, it is reported that the total payload capacity has been increased to 7200kg.

The Gripen Maritime, another variant marketed internationally by Sweden, is apparently ready for production in case of demand, and the engine configuration offered with this model is the GE 414G reconfigured as fully marinized. Both engines have a maximum sea level speed of 1.2/1.4 mach.

The reason why I keep giving this Gripen example: The F404 engine configuration of this aircraft is a concrete example of the fact that the Hürjet will continue to make progress in total lift capacity, and the other issue is that it is a good example to see what the gap would be if an engine option with the same diameter standard but with a maximum wet thrust of up to 100kN is gained, like Gripen E/F.

A supersonic navalized combat jet capable of STOBAR operation, capable of lifting 5-6 tons of ammunition meet most of the operational requirements needed in the first place to form our naval fighter aviation. (I think unmanned combatants with dual TF-6000 configurations will catch up in the same period)

The Mig-29K, widely used in the Eastern bloc, has a maximum payload of under 10,000lb/4500kg. The Mig29K has a sea level top speed of 1.2 mach and a combat radius of 460 nmi, but it is worth taking this data with a pinch of salt. Until just two years ago, Eurasianist friends were praising the Mig-29K and Atlanticist friends were praising the Gripen E on social media. It is sad to see the same friends not giving the necessary support to the Hürjet N.

If the Eurojet can somehow be redirected to a navalized EJ-2xx, which, -as I have argued before we can finance under the condition of under license production-, this will not only provide a great deal of flexibility to the Hürjet program, but will also make it one of the most attractive options for small and medium-sized air forces.

 

[Saithan]

we're repeating ourselves too much, but I guess that's because everyone has a little dream they can't avoid slapping on top of the bread we're baking, like a topping of sorts.

Hürjet is a trainer and we need to get building 90+ of these.

I could add my topping which is a LCA version of it, which may come at some point. but not a priority.

 

[Turkic]

There's a point we're missing about the engine to be used on MUGEM's main combatant. If we're talking for commissioning it around 2040, than we should talk about indigenious engine programs again.

Developing an engine to fill the gap between TF-10k and TF-36k was discussed not long ago and to me, the most plausable answer was the unnecessity of adding the burden of a 3rd engine program to our defence industry (I don't remember who's opinion it was).

But by 2030-32, TF-6/10k will be done and the most job on TF-35k will be done too. So TEI can focus on TS-3000 and a 20k libre class engine until 2040. It would take less than 10 years since they will be developed two turbofan engines before. We can build our main naval aircraft with our indigenious engines. Either single engine TF-36K or twin-engine TF-XXk.

 

[dBSPL]

we're repeating ourselves too much, but I guess that's because everyone has a little dream they can't avoid slapping on top of the bread we're baking, like a topping of sorts.

Hürjet is a trainer and we need to get building 90+ of these.

I could add my topping which is a LCA version of it, which may come at some point. but not a priority.

With its updated specs, the Hürjet is really quite capable and perhaps one of the best aircraft in its class. So much so that when I see it being compared to trainers such as the M346 or L159T2 on the internet, it really makes my stomach cramp. This will be a true lead-in fighter trainer jet, a trainer that can maneuver at near sea level with the climb/turn rate of almost most supersonic fighter jets, with an extraordinarily wide repertoire of ammunition, including 2000lb ones. Also suitable for a variety of mission scenarios, such as air-to-air refueling(is planned) or operation with wing drones. There is nothing more natural than this aircraft being utulitized for some combat roles. Even if our air force doesn't use it, this is an approach that is in demand around the world and a way of making money.

In fact, speaking in terms of the training standards of many different air forces, it can be said that the Hürjet will be the operational conversion aircraft for the pilots to be prepared for KAAN. The platform with such advanced avionics and a suitable flight envelope is actually an LCA because it meets related requirements, even if we don't call it that. Whether to use it or not is a matter of demand.

 

[Saithan]

With its updated specs, the Hürjet is really quite capable and perhaps one of the best aircraft in its class. So much so that when I see it being compared to trainers such as the M346 or L159T2 on the internet, it really makes my stomach cramp. This will be a true lead-in fighter trainer jet, a trainer that can maneuver at near sea level with the climb/turn rate of almost most supersonic fighter jets, with an extraordinarily wide repertoire of ammunition, including 2000lb ones. Also suitable for a variety of mission scenarios, such as air-to-air refueling(is planned) or operation with wing drones. There is nothing more natural than this aircraft being utulitized for some combat roles. Even if our air force doesn't use it, this is an approach that is in demand around the world and a way of making money.

In fact, speaking in terms of the training standards of many different air forces, it can be said that the Hürjet will be the operational conversion aircraft for the pilots to be prepared for KAAN. The platform with such advanced avionics and a suitable flight envelope is actually an LCA because it meets related requirements, even if we don't call it that. Whether to use it or not is a matter of demand.

yes, but we all know how the west likes tripping us, so I think making it a trainer and selling it as trainer is a good move and we should stick to it.

Even if we can do some light chances and turn it into a LCA we should let that be an option for much later. Our needs and priorities can't match very well at the moment because of hidden embargoes and the tripping I mentioned, so we need to move a step or two behind our priority.

Getting 90+ trainer is a priority.

LCA is not a priority, at least not a move that should be revelaed as being possible.

Selling to Spain is not a priority, just a nice reduce cost move.

 

[Nutuk]

Hurjet as platform is very similar to the Boeing T7. As platorm she is not unique but Hurjet is to get a unique feature.

She will be like with Kaan able to link with unmanned drones. As you can imagine core of 5th / 6th gen fighters will be having a "loyal wingman" and Hurjet at the moment is the sole (first) trainer that can link up with unmanned drones.

Hurjet as LCA will be also very interesting for a lot of countries who do not have the huge budgets to afford fighter jets like Kaan, F35 etc. A combination of LCA fighters that are interoperable with drones like Akinci, Kizilelma and ANKA-3 may become very appealing for countries low on budget.

 

[2033]

Why don't we have a single-engine project with TF35000???

We can develop a 4.5-generation 'Hürjet-2' equivalent to the F-16V

 

[Fairon]

Why don't we have a single-engine project with TF35000???

We can develop a 4.5-generation 'Hürjet-2' equivalent to the F-16V

Manpower, budget and time.

 

[begturan]

We don't have to do everything, this is a subject that requires a large budget and workforce, when necessary, we can cooperate with friendly and allied countries and further develop our relations.

In this context, replacing F4 aircraft with EF2000 aircraft is not a negative step. Perhaps in 5/10 years, an aircraft in this class may be developed, perhaps after unmanned combat aircraft prove their reliability, we can develop and use platforms such as Kızılelma or Anka 3 according to these mission definitions.

In addition, we cannot know who will be our friend and who will be our enemy tomorrow. If we are on good terms with Russia today and bad tomorrow, then having alternative systems will be a balancing force for us.

 

[uçuyorum]

We don't have to do everything, this is a subject that requires a large budget and workforce, when necessary, we can cooperate with friendly and allied countries and further develop our relations.

In this context, replacing F4 aircraft with EF2000 aircraft is not a negative step. Perhaps in 5/10 years, an aircraft in this class may be developed, perhaps after unmanned combat aircraft prove their reliability, we can develop and use platforms such as Kızılelma or Anka 3 according to these mission definitions.

In addition, we cannot know who will be our friend and who will be our enemy tomorrow. If we are on good terms with Russia today and bad tomorrow, then having alternative systems will be a balancing force for us.

Another issue is pilot training difficulty. We have had help from Pakistan to train pilots after the coup attempt I heard from a few people. Eurofighter purchase likely includes pilot training and comes with ability to join more NATO and non NATO drills and exercises with other eurofighter users, stay up to date with them.

 

[Kaan Azman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1884625653816754680

 

[Sanchez]

Unsure if this is a CG doctored image or a genuine photo. Hürjet near the mach barrier. From TAI gazette 139.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1887809727247069612

 

[Saithan]

I am not sure a dustcloud appears when an object moves beyond the speed of sound. What if it was a cloud free day ?

 

[Ripley]

I am not sure a dustcloud appears when an object moves beyond the speed of sound. What if it was a cloud free day ?

True, not after breaking sound barrier but just when breaking through it. So, it must have been that particular sequence.
i believe a so called vapor cone is created and is related to humidity. Since I’m not a technical person can’t explain the physics involved there properly

Of course, assuming this is a real image captured the sequence.