India Indian Kashmir Archive

Jackdaws

Experienced member
Messages
2,759
Reactions
1 1,583
Nation of residence
India
Nation of origin
India
Link
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/jam...-in-jammu-and-kashmir-parties-protest-3264670

Srinagar:
Jammu and Kashmir is likely to have 25 lakh new voters in the next election, with non-locals registering to vote for the first time in the region. Former Chief Ministers Mehbooba Mufti and Omar Abdullah have sharply criticized the move, calling it a "dangerous attempt" to influence elections.

Jammu and Kashmir has been without an elected government for more than four years. Elections are expected next year.

A special revision of the electoral rolls will allow non-locals to register as voters in Jammu and Kashmir for the first time since the Centre scrapped its special status under Article 370 in 2019, changing the constitution to allow non-Kashmiris to vote and own land there.
 

Jackdaws

Experienced member
Messages
2,759
Reactions
1 1,583
Nation of residence
India
Nation of origin
India
I don't see the fuss. If a person moves from New York to California and takes California residence, pays state taxes in California then he is allowed to vote there.
 

Nilgiri

Experienced member
Moderator
Aviation Specialist
Messages
9,775
Reactions
119 19,814
Nation of residence
Canada
Nation of origin
India
I don't see the fuss. If a person moves from New York to California and takes California residence, pays state taxes in California then he is allowed to vote there.

That's not the right comparison. California joined US under the same constitutional provisions on how a US territory acquires statehood that applied to the original 13 states (like say New York).

Kashmir joined by special articles in which it would retain special status provisions regarding its local administration and govt.

The rest of India did not as there was not a joining process, rather a transition from British Raj.

In north america, special provision comparisons that have some arguable similarity to Kashmir would be specific statutes in Quebec (given the way Quebec was slowly and fitfully absorbed into Canada after montcalms defeat, which was markedly different to rest of Canada) ...


.....or in the US case how this works with various territories and indigenous native statutes for their reservations (as these people/nations did not voluntarily join the US under same provisions US territories did to become full states)....which again allows for their local laws on what rest of US citizens can buy/execute/live there past their fundamental core rights.

There would be uproar if things are changed here by federal power overnight too.
 

Jackdaws

Experienced member
Messages
2,759
Reactions
1 1,583
Nation of residence
India
Nation of origin
India
That's not the right comparison. California joined US under the same constitutional provisions on how a US territory acquires statehood that applied to the original 13 states (like say New York).

Kashmir joined by special articles in which it would retain special status provisions regarding its local administration and govt.

The rest of India did not as there was not a joining process, rather a transition from British Raj.

In north america, special provision comparisons that have some arguable similarity to Kashmir would be specific statutes in Quebec (given the way Quebec was slowly and fitfully absorbed into Canada after montcalms defeat, which was markedly different to rest of Canada) ...


.....or in the US case how this works with various territories and indigenous native statutes for their reservations (as these people/nations did not voluntarily join the US under same provisions US territories did to become full states)....which again allows for their local laws on what rest of US citizens can buy/execute/live there past their fundamental core rights.

There would be uproar if things are changed here by federal power overnight too.
1/3rd of the territory that became Republic of India was princely states like Kashmir with their own sets of laws. They all signed the Treaty of Accession - voluntarily or under duress.

Imagine if different rights existed everywhere from Hyderabad to Bhopal.
 

Nilgiri

Experienced member
Moderator
Aviation Specialist
Messages
9,775
Reactions
119 19,814
Nation of residence
Canada
Nation of origin
India
1/3rd of the territory that became Republic of India was princely states like Kashmir with their own sets of laws. They all signed the Treaty of Accession - voluntarily or under duress.

Imagine if different rights existed everywhere from Hyderabad to Bhopal.


Im just telling you what "the fuss" is about...and what the appropriate hypothetical "fuss" would be to compare in other contexts different to India.

People (and their representatives they elect) locally were promised certain things and got used to decades of one system and it was removed overnight after prolonged whittling away. None of which was done with their (promised) consent....and several other injustices done due to the security context which is bigger sordid topic to get into.

US state comparison (that you used) is simply not equivalent to it (for matter of appropriate "fuss" comparison equivalency)....but there are other more relevant things I mention that are somewhat similar in north america....(though the security context is far different....any similarity there was a long time ago in 19th century for the US, though Quebec had a fairly significant 20th century resurgence).

You try change things in Quebec from the federal side or US native reservation operations overnight from DC (after all the norms, conventions and codes established by compromise over long time), you will see similar uproar and fuss then...as now you are comparing something closer to India's case with Kashmir.

To take an extreme (even with a constitutional framework in force for significant part of it)...

The British over a number of centuries cudgeled its neighbouring island in grievous manner (letting some norms wax and others wane at other times, gaslighting plenty on both when convenient for westminster to do so... to have a very inconsistent structure in the end ) that eroded trust and great deal many other things over time.

"The fuss" exploded eventually with Irish liberation and independence (and the pangs still continue with the remnant part in the north and so on).

If India wanted to do its constitution framework and application different from the start, then it should have done so to have more consistent basis on how Kashmir stacks up vis a vis other princely states processes and the regular states (and reorganisation etc).

But thats a deeper thing to get into...how centralised and unified one desires to be in theory versus an often different reality...and how do you shape a republic basic law (i.e the constitution) for it and how it is to be best applied (and knowing hindsight is 20/20) given unification over such a large expanse and population is always going to be a work in progress.

What do you secure, what do you leave flexible given gestation and budding of certain things at an inherited juncture, rather than consolidated trust and maturity.

Same thing goes for having a unified civil code.

There will again be uproar (simple observation without having to take a side on the issue) if its done (esp ad hoc politically) due to leaving it this late after people got used to current norms.

Now if you outnumber "the fuss" by 100 times to 1 (unlike say other ratios like british to irish), you get your way regardless basically.

But its not really a debate or ordered logic (and hard legislative work and application for greater coordination and trust over time) at that point.

Perhaps thats why UCC stalls even with central (and even raw majority desire for it.... political capital and risk is perhaps not worth expending given that the dominant raw ratio isnt there like there was for kashmir's art 370 "abrogation".
 

Joe Shearer

Contributor
Moderator
Professional
Advisor
Messages
1,111
Reactions
21 1,942
Nation of residence
India
Nation of origin
India
As much as I dislike the current dispensation, I am glad they got rid of Article 370. Imagine an American living in California not being able to buy land in Dakota. It was a ridiculous arrangement.
Article 370 of the Indian Constitution had nothing to do with the ability of non-residents and registered citizens of Kashmir to buy land in Kashmir.
 

Jackdaws

Experienced member
Messages
2,759
Reactions
1 1,583
Nation of residence
India
Nation of origin
India
How true do you feel all this is @Jackdaws et al?

In agreement. Once lives improve via tourism, connectivity and other economic activity, the religious argument will fall apart.
 

Zapper

Experienced member
India Correspondent
Messages
1,719
Reactions
10 944
Nation of residence
United States of America
Nation of origin
India
1672408481860.png


1672408641390.png


1672408653233.png



 

Zapper

Experienced member
India Correspondent
Messages
1,719
Reactions
10 944
Nation of residence
United States of America
Nation of origin
India

Delhi has the right to generate hydroelectricity ,In a first India has called on Pakistan to enter intergovernmental negotiations within 90days​



India has sent a notice to Pakistan calling for an amendment of the Indus Waters Treaty even as the dispute resolution mechanism of the treaty remains in a logjam for 5 years. This is for the first time New Delhi has called on Islamabad for the amendment of the treaty that was signed in 1960 in Karachi between the then-Indian PM Jawaharlal Nehru and then-Pakistani president Ayub Khan.

Sources told WION, "India has issued notice to Pakistan for modification of the Indus Waters Treaty (IWT) of September 1960. This is as per Article XII (3) of IWT...Pakistani intransigence on the Indus Waters Treaty forced India to issue a notice of modification to the Treaty."
Under the notice, India has called on Pakistan to enter into intergovernmental negotiations within 90 days to "rectify the material breach" of the treaty and also "update the treaty to incorporate the lessons learned over the last 62 years", sources explained.

Under the Indus water treaty of 1960, the waters of 3 Eastern Rivers - Sutlej, Beas, and Ravi are allocated to India for unrestricted use while the waters of 3 Western rivers - Indus, Jhelum, and Chenab go to Pakistan. Additionally, New Delhi has the right to generate hydroelectricity through the run of the river projects on the 3 Western rivers, subject to specific criteria for design. Pakistan can under the treaty raise technical objections to the design of Indian hydroelectric projects on Western rivers.

One of the key issues has been dispute resolution mechanisms that have led to India issuing the notice. For example, in 2015, Pakistan requested the appointment of a Neutral Expert to examine its technical objections to India’s Kishenganga and Ratle Hydro Electric Projects (HEPs).
The following year, that is 2016, Pakistan unilaterally retracted from the "neutral expert" mechanism and proposed that a "Court of Arbitration" decide on its objections. Meanwhile, India made a separate request for the matter to be referred to a Neutral Expert. The initiation of two simultaneous processes on the same issue essentially creates a legal issue.

Sources pointed out, "at Pakistan’s continuing insistence, the World Bank has recently initiated actions on both the Neutral Expert and Court of Arbitration processes. Such parallel consideration of the same issues is not covered under any provision" of the treaty, adding, " faced with such violation of the treaty provisions, India has been compelled to issue a notice of modification". In 2016, World Bank took a decision to “pause” the initiation of two parallel processes and request India and Pakistan to seek an amicable way out.
Despite repeated efforts by India to find a mutually agreeable way forward, Pakistan refused to discuss the issue during the five meetings of the Permanent Indus Commission from 2017 to 2022. The last Indus water talks took place in Delhi between India's Indus water commissioner AK Pal and Pakistani counterpart Mehr Ali Shah. The next meeting of the Indus water commission will take place in Pakistan.

https://www.wionews.com/world/in-a-...waters-treaty-sends-notice-to-pakistan-556414


 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom