Indonesia Indonesian Strategic Industries

[R4duga]

cruise missile even the smaller one need atleast turbojet engine within 2KN - 6KN thrust power, i wonder if indonesia really can built that though...

 

[R4duga]

Damn, at least you should provide context.

it was one of the reply from dittekindhan admin here regarding our reverse engineered cruise missile plan.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CbzSZehPlEe/

 

[Madokafc]

cruise missile even the smaller one need atleast turbojet engine within 2KN - 6KN thrust power, i wonder if indonesia really can built that though...
View attachment 42313

Chroma engine? At least they are active in this field, to secure license production is not problem as they are already have capability to built mini turbojet engine befo

 

[Madokafc]

Any info or guess what missile range they aimed for?

Not much information about the projects actually, but from my conclusion should not far off from the C705 or Exocet Block 2

 

[Stuka Dive]

cruise missile even the smaller one need atleast turbojet engine within 2KN - 6KN thrust power, i wonder if indonesia really can built that though...
View attachment 42313

We should also start to built indigenous wankel rotary engine. It is very light, hi efficiency, and powerful. This would be the workhorse for our future UAV fleet. And the most important thing...not so high metalurgical technology (compare to gas turbine) . If we do it seriously, I believe the technology will be achievable in the near future for us.
See this vid from liquidpiston...such a handy engine

 

[Abarky]

KKP BUILD 2 ANTI ILLEGAL FISHING FISHING SUPERVISORY SHIPS

The Ministry of Maritime Affairs and Fisheries (KKP) will build two 50-meter fishing surveillance vessels by 2022.

The two ships with "anti-illegal fishing" technology will strengthen the fleet to combat illegal fishing in Indonesian seas.

The Director General for Supervision of Marine and Fishery Resources, Rear Admiral TNI Adin Nurawaluddin, explained that the supervisory ship to be built was equipped with sophisticated equipment and machinery.

Some of the features that have been developed include speeds of up to 30 knots, a 360° wheelhouse overview that allows the captain and officers of the ship to see all sides around the ship and rope cutter technology.

"The technology is designed according to the needs of eradicating illegal fishing, including rope cutters that are able to break the nets that have been often thrown into the sea to hinder the process of catching illegal fishing vessels," said Adin in a press release, Sunday (10/4/2022).

Adin added that the class II supervisory ship (50 meters long) is also equipped with a water cannon, and a sea rider with a capacity of 5 crew members, as well as a fin stabilizer and interceptor which makes the ship more stable.

Adin explained that the design, which was made in collaboration with the National Research and Innovation Agency (Swakelola Type II), has been tested at the Test Laboratory, Center for Hydrodynamics Technology, BRIN, Surabaya.

"This ship is faster and more stable than the previous types for the same class of ship," said Adin.

Furthermore, Adin said, the two ships will be built by PT. Palindo Marine - Batam and is expected to be used to strengthen the surveillance fleet in 2023.

Meanwhile, in the process of starting the construction of the supervisory ship, the KKP has involved supervision that provides supplies from various related agencies.

KKP Bangun 2 Kapal Pengawas Perikanan Anti Illegal Fishing, Beroperasi Tahun 2023

KKP membangun dua kapal pengawas perikanan berukuran 50 meter pada tahun 2022.

money.kompas.com

 

[Aghost132483]

Finally we built KKP ship with strengthen hull, so they have higher confidence when ramming their ship into illegal fishing boat, hope we built 90 meters Bakamla (Coast Guard) ship with strengthen hull.

 

[Madokafc]

We should also start to built indigenous wankel rotary engine. It is very light, hi efficiency, and powerful. This would be the workhorse for our future UAV fleet. And the most important thing...not so high metalurgical technology (compare to gas turbine) . If we do it seriously, I believe the technology will be achievable in the near future for us.
See this vid from liquidpiston...such a handy engine

On another notes

There is Permenhan to rule any research and development projects within MoD must be utilized into an actual product and prioritized into first article ready for mass production

SOSIALISASI PERMENHAN NOMOR 8 TAHUN 2021 TENTANG PENYELENGGARAAN PENELITIAN DAN PENGEMBANGAN ALAT PERALATAN PERTAHANAN DI LINGKUNGAN KEMHAN DAN TNI​

Kamis, 31 Maret 2022

SOSIALISASI PERMENHAN NOMOR 8 TAHUN 2021 TENTANG​

PENYELENGGARAAN PENELITIAN DAN PENGEMBANGAN ALAT PERALATAN PERTAHANAN DI LINGKUNGAN KEMHAN DAN TNI​

Jakarta – optimalnya output Litbang dalam mendukung pemenuhan kebutuhan Alpalhankam TNI, diperlukan lang kah konkret pengaturan kegiatan Litbang Alpalhan agar dapat mewujudkan output Litbang yang berdaya guna dan sesuai dengan kebutuhan pengguna. Hal tersebut disampaik an Dirmat Ditjen Kuathan Kemhan Brigjen TNI Jimmy Alexander Adirman saat membuka Sosialisasi Permenhan Nomor 8 Tahun 2021 tentang Penyelenggaraan Penelitian Dan Pengembangan Alat Peralatan Pertahanan di Lingkungan Kemhan Dan TNI.​

Selanjutnya Dirmat Ditjen Kuathan Kemhan Brigjen TNI Jimmy Alexander Adirman mengatakan bahwa Hal ini selaras dengan atensi dan rekomendasi BPK RI terhadap kegiatan Litbang di Kemhan dan TNI pada pemeriksaan TA. 2015 sampai dengan semester I Tahun 2018 bahwa hasil Litbang belum dapat mendukung pemenuhan kebutuhan Alpalhan TNI melalui pemberdayaan industri pertahanan. dari hasil monev tersebut ditemukan bahwa output Litbang Alpalhan sebagian besar masih dalam tahap model dan prototipe. Hal ini disebabkan karena secara regulasi belum ada ketegasan yang mengikat bahwa output Litbang Alpalhan harus ditindaklanjuti sampai dengan first article.

Berangkat dari urgensi perlunya langkah konkret agar pelaksanaan Litbang Alpalhan dapat menghasilkan output yang berdayaguna, selanjutnya Kementerian Pertahanan dalam hal ini Ditjen Kuathan telah menyusun

Permenhan Nomor 8 Tahun 2021 tentang Penyelenggaraan Penelitian dan Pengembangan Alat Peralatan Pertahanan di Lingkungan Kemhan dan TNI. Permenhan ini disusun secara bersama-sama oleh Kelompok Kerja Kemhan dan TNI dan telah diundangkan dalam berita negara. Selain memuat kebijakan pokok tersebut, terdapat beberapa pengaturan yang signifikan diantaranya penentuan prioritas pelaksanaan Litbang Alpalhan yang diarahkan terhadap Alpalhan strategis sesuai kebijakan pertahanan, Alpalhan yang sudah memiliki kerja sama alih teknologi, Alpalhan yang masuk dalam rencana induk industri pertahanan untuk pemenuhan Alpalhan TNI, Alpalhan yang menjadi prioritas kebutuhan Kemhan dan TNI.

Sosialisasi Permenhan Nomor 8 Tahun 2021 tentang Penyelenggaraan Penelitian Dan Pengembangan Alat Peralatan Pertahanan di Lingkungan Kemhan Dan TNI, di laksanakan pada tanggal 24 Maret 2022.​

 

[Var Dracon]

So the missile we developed only copying the outward look (or at least, just the same dimension) of C-705 ? Still hoping they would make stealthy, angled airframe

 

[Lordimperator]

Still hoping they would make stealthy, angled airframe

Like SOM Turkish?

 

[FPXAllen]

So the missile we developed only copying the outward look (or at least, just the same dimension) of C-705 ? Still hoping they would make stealthy, angled airframe

One step at a time, young Padawan...

I'm more excited about what they're gonna do with the missile's innards like the guidance and control system, warhead and the engine - especially with the rumor about the involvement of a European defense company in this project.

 

[Anmdt]

One step at a time, young Padawan...

I'm more excited about what they're gonna do with the missile's innards like the guidance and control system, warhead and the engine - especially with the rumor about the involvement of a European defense company in this project.

I have written a similar message but haven't posted it.

They can not reverse engineer the control and guidance, neither the seeker nor the components and algorithms for sea-skimming, terrain hugging or contour/map matching.

The best information to be extracted is missile architecture, component tighteners and connection diagrams, body shape, control surfaces, structural design, etc. .

The body shape can be easily optimized by an academician within a week including the maneuvering characteristics and control surfaces (lift model etc). That leaves us with another critical part; engine.

There are variety of TJ engine for this class of missile or the smaller one.

One does not need a reverse engineering program to make a cruise missile, but a solid road-map paved by R&D and milestones on critical components listed above.

I am not sure how far a foreign partner may contribute in such a project. If they are supplying the critical parts that differs this object from a TJ powered toy-drone, then why would they cut their future market loose? Unless otherwise, Indonesia has already granted a promise to acquire batch of hundred missiles and other related equipments worthing a billion and more at least?

They could initiate an R&D project at least to make a mini-cruise missile as technology demonstrator and development platform for the future larger cruise missiles, there is a potential for that, as well as necessary human sources and minds. Such a platform could serve a greater purpose, where they can gradually integrate critical components either outsourced or locally produced, even finally converted into a kamikaze drone at the end, optionally.

 

[FPXAllen]

They can not reverse engineer the control and guidance, neither the seeker nor the components and algorithms for sea-skimming, terrain hugging or contour/map matching.

The best information to be extracted is missile architecture, component tighteners and connection diagrams, body shape, control surfaces, structural design, etc. .

The body shape can be easily optimized by an academician within a week including the maneuvering characteristics and control surfaces (lift model etc). That leaves us with another critical part; engine.

I believe this is why they're using the C-705 'shell' as is: To minimize R&D cost since there will be less need for new aerodynamic calculations and tests. It's also likely that they're aiming to replace the original components with new ones with similar weight for the same reason.

On the other hand, if they can somehow replace some original components with ones that are lighter, there can be some other benefits too. For example, if the new guidance system is considerably lighter, they can have a choice to increase either the warhead weight or fuel capacity.

There are variety of TJ engine for this class of missile or the smaller one.

One does not need a reverse engineering program to make a cruise missile, but a solid road-map paved by R&D and milestones on critical components listed above.

Well, we're still lacking in the R&D department. Or at least that's what I think so far.

It's not that we don't have many qualified and highly skilled engineers and technicians, we do, in fact. But convoluted bureaucracy and other unnecessary burdens combined with overall atmosphere - or should I say, mentality (?) - that still doesn't see R&D as something truly worth to spend a lot of resources into have really hold us back in this regard.

It's even more 'cringy' when minor achievements being reported like they were so ground-breaking and revolutionary.

But back in the topic, I still hope that they will really do their 'homework' seriously in this 'reverse engineering' project. This is not only to provide us with the capability of "cloning" the missile, but to also set up a path for future projects.

I am not sure how far a foreign partner may contribute in such a project. If they are supplying the critical parts that differs this object from a TJ powered toy-drone, then why would they cut their future market loose? Unless otherwise, Indonesia has already granted a promise to acquire batch of hundred missiles and other related equipments worthing a billion and more at least?

I've talked a bit with a European company's representatives at one defense show, and yeah, basically that's what they told me.

Some Indonesian military enthusiasts still think that the "transfer of technology" term means that we'll also get 'blueprints', while forgetting that that's not how things work in regards to IP. Not when we're not buying a lot of what they're selling.

However, it's true that the company is willing to offer their assistance in this kind of project in the form of design/system integration consultation and probably more - especially if we're buying their stuff in sufficiently large number.

They could initiate an R&D project at least to make a mini-cruise missile as technology demonstrator and development platform for the future larger cruise missiles, there is a potential for that, as well as necessary human sources and minds. Such a platform could serve a greater purpose, where they can gradually integrate critical components either outsourced or locally produced, even finally converted into a kamikaze drone at the end, optionally.

Ah yeah, gradual R&D. That's what I believe too and not only in missile but in everything else as well.

It's unfortunate that some Indonesians are so adamant that we need to keep buying ready-made stuffs from foreign sources even if the capabilities to make them ourselves are inside or just a bit outside our reach. No wonder when considering that they often have their own vested interests to keep things as they are.

 

[Lordimperator]

a European company's representatives at one defense show

MBDA?

 

[FPXAllen]

MBDA?

Maybe, maybe not

 

[JATOSINT]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1514442300373422082

 

[R4duga]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1514442300373422082

if they can get license for AASM Hammer (both the bomb and guidance kit), it would be a pretty good deal.

we need a f*ck ton of precision guided munition.

 

[Madokafc]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1514442300373422082

Wish our other fighter can be certified to use them

 

[Umigami]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1514442300373422082

if they can get license for AASM Hammer, it would be a pretty good deal.

we need a f*ck ton of precision guided munition.

Wish our other fighter can be certified to use them

HAMMER is good and ITAR Free but Expensive and not econimical. We need a lot of LJDAM and Paveaway too.

 

[Umigami]

At the end of the day, there's one thing for sure, Pindad have to upgrade their facilities capacity.

It would be super funny if Pindad can only produce 1 unit of Hammer per month lol

HAMMER is guidance kit for MK series bomb, so why choose pindad and not electronical company like PT LEN?