This is no Islamist issue IMO
I believe none in this forum said that Turkey should fight for the Palestinians etc.... In fact, many including me, clearly stated that Turkey should watch both the Palestinians and Israelis burn to hell. The palestinians are reaping what they sow after betraying the Ottomans.... period!
However, what truly baffles me is how ppl still believe that Israel can be a friend! Israel as an entity is violent by nature, and is in a constant fight with its neighbouring countires.
Israel, believes that a major chunk of Eastern Turkey rigthfully belongs to Greater Israel, while have demonstarted clearly on numerous occassions that they woupd never allow a country stronger than it within the region. Israel has been one of the biggest critics for Turkey's participation in the F35 program, has been supporting Greece EEZ claims and PKK Kurdistan even before Erdogan came to power. Just open Youtube and watch older videos on Jewish Zionists talk about how PKK's kurdistan is a crucial step towards greater Israel etc...
Even the recent German-Turkish fiasco regarding the shadow embargo of Nuclear turbines is reported to be pushed forward due to jewish and greek lobbies in Germany......
Shall we rewing time back a bit, during the early 2000s when the Turkish-Israeli relations were at its peak, and remember when Israel used to sell defective drones to Turkey at dohble the price?
Many ppl seem to forget that Israel's foreign policy is based on absolute supremacy and this is directly threatened by Turkey. All the surrounding nations are being armed by the West which Israel controls but now Turkey emerges with its own domestic, high quality, NATO-standard, west independent, cheap weapons and ppl expect Israel to remain silent
Thus, I will say it again and again, the ones who created and supported the PKK for all those years were the US and Israel; the ones who gave Iraq to Iran were the US and Israel. The ones who supported radicalism in Syria (primarily Assad) were the US and Israel
and yet, after all this, ppl believe that this is an Islamist issue and that Turkey and Israel are best friends. Loooooool
No, the PKK is not created by Israel and the US and claiming this serve against you as many people will read this and your whole post will be invalidated while you still made some good points. Israel is not actively supporting PKK out of its rhetoric. Israel supports other Kurdish groups connected to the KDP-I which are tightly connected to the people we also support in Iraq. The KDP-I is concentrating its efforts in Iran. They support both groups connected to the KDP-I and Balochi insurgents active in Iran and Pakistan, not PKK.
As for the US, the reason for their support for PKK is not Israel. It is the independent policies that we implement, the risk involved in th fact that we are no longer trusted "ally" (this means puppet in their language) so they got a chance in Syria and took it. From a strategic perspective they are in the search for a replacement for the center of the Big Middle East Project of which Mr. President Erdogan served as a director for many years. Whatever bad happened to Turkiye happened because of this project in which Diyarbakir was given extreme importance. As you said, we are no more the pawns we used to...
Israel input and cooperation within the fight against PKK and far left organizations (not going to touch upon the cooperation during the hunt for ASALA) in the 90s is unmatched. The country which sent the first field operatives during the hunt for Ocalan in Kenya for exploration activities was Israel.
I may give the counter-thesis about Great Israel by showing you the maps of the Ottoman Empire and say that all Turks support that, the maps of Great Albania, Great Bulgaria, Great Armenia and we can go on forever. Imaginary maps pushed by fanatics are not a factor trough which I am going to judge the international relations between countries. Other than that if we want to compare Erdogan's advisers to Netanyahu's I would say that both of these countries are racing with eachother on who to employ the most ridiculous man for their adviser. We have a pretty good chance in winning when I think about Adnan Tanriverdi... The guy was preparing us to join Mehdi's army and liberate Quds
On the situation in the Mediterranean, the situation may have been different. I want to remind what would've happened if the Syrian Revolution was successful and what role Turkiye was destined to play in the whole process of exporting Israeli natural resources. The last time we normalized relationships with Israel, the same people that are currently calling for the annihilation of Israel were happy because there was the possibility of cooperation in the Mediterranean. So far there is no such chance with cooperation with Palestine because first of all their position is not as positive towards Turkiye as the Islamists think and second of all such a State will be Iranian pawn, the country that share no maps of Great Iran, but instead gets directly to the action of killing our soldiers both in Iraq and Syria, directly supporting PKK trough training and sophisticated weapons deliveries that costs us millions of dollars already and directly threatens that will "Delete Baku from the face of the earth".
On the situation with the selling of false military equipment I would say that the most capable tank in the Turkish Armed Forces, the only tank in our inventory that manages to take an ATGM to the face, keep the personnel alive and not explode to pieces came to this level after it went trough an Israeli modernization.
Yes, Israel's policy in the region is based on supremacy, but isn't our policy the same in the last 5-10 years?
Israel and Turkiye are neither friends nor enemies and we need eachother to contain bigger threats to both of our interests. I will say it again. We should localize the disagreements regarding Palestine, but continue expanding cooperation in Syria and Iraq.
What's so important in Syria and Iraq one may ask. The importance is that US armed terrorist organization with tens of thousands of fighters will go under Iranian control once again like it happened in Iraq with the PMU and while the US is so kind to give us soft warnings because we are still in NATO, Iran will not hesitate to bomb our bases till oblivion and this is the scenario we should be ready for after the US leaves Syria and unfortunately our capabilities are limited when it comes to containing this threat. This is where cooperation with Israel is important both for them as Iran is an existential threat to Israel and to our interests in the region. If the events that are happening right now happened in 2035 I would say "fuck it, we need nobody", but as I said earlier when I was thinking about this issue, unfortunately we are late to the game because Turkiye was destined to be a puppet, but it happens that suddenly we are no more and to be an independent country has its requirements which we couldn't meet just yet.
As
@Sanchez rightly assessed in my opinion, the conjecture is pushing us to reconcile once again at least temporarily. We should leave aside emotions, look at the situation trough analysis based on undisputed facts, determine what we should do and what are our options realistically and realistically we have only one option. I personally am not happy with it, but we play with the cards we got.
I've come to the conclusion that there is no use in shedding tears on past mistakes. If life gives you lemons, you make limonata. If life gives you Israel, you make israelonata or whatever this shiet will be called
