TR Missile & Smart Munition Programs

[Saithan]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501194457080897541

testing kuzgun this year

 

[TheInsider]

@TheInsider ?

Yes, there is but TRLG-230 is higher on the priority list.
TRG-300 is heavier than SOM(660kg for 90km block II missile with a 180kg warhead and 585kg for 120km block III with 105kg warhead) and can only be carried by bigger UAVs and fighters.
TRLG-230 is also effective against mobile targets while TRG-300 is only effective against stationary targets.

 

[Trakya_forever]

@TheInsider any news about Roketsan NLOS missile? Can we see it till the end of this year?

 

[TheInsider]

@TheInsider any news about Roketsan NLOS missile? Can we see it till the end of this year?

Probably no maybe a teaser. The project is in an advanced phase and surely some info or demonstration can be released but 2023 will be a monumental year for the defense industry and companies want to press the hold button to release everything at once for a shock effect in 2023. "Dozens" of projects will be showcased in 2023 some of the projects that never confirmed officially some other projects we only saw a slight teaser or only mentioned verbally in some reviews.

 

[Trakya_forever]

Thank u so much for the answer. NLOS missiles and loitering munitions are really vital. We experienced in Karabagh and now if Ukraine had these kinds of systems, the situation would be much harder for Russia.

 

[Hexciter]

 

[Blank1]

@Yasar, @TheInsider
- Any news when can we expect tripod mounted and shoulder fire sungur ?
- Can you clarify Umtas / Mızrak classification and what are their direct US equivalent's ?

 

[Ecderha]

@Yasar, @TheInsider
- Any news when can we expect tripod mounted and shoulder fire sungur ?
- Can you clarify Umtas / Mızrak classification and whats are their direct US equivalent's ?

Mate there is new high tech trend.
It is called Blue Traktors

 

[TheInsider]

1) This year. There will also be an ATAS version.
2) UMTAS/MIZRAK-U is the same product with different names. UMTAS (Uzun Menzilli TAnk Savar-long range anti-tank) is the name of the project. MIZRAK-U is the name of the missile itself. It is similar to Hellfire missile.

 

[Yasar_TR]

@Yasar, @TheInsider
- Any news when can we expect tripod mounted and shoulder fire sungur ?
- Can you clarify Umtas / Mızrak classification and what are their direct US equivalent's ?

The plan is that the Sungur will be joining the inventory this year. (I thought ATAS is the acronym for Air To Air Stinger)
There is work being carried out to increase Sungur’s effective range and altitude. So there may be a Sungur-ER to come yet.

Turkey to Deploy SUNGUR Air Defence Missile in 2022

The SUNGUR Air Defence Missile developed by Turkey’s defence giant Roketsan will be made available to the Turkish Armed Forces this year.

www.turkishdefencenews.com

As per @TheInsider has explained Mizrak/Umtas is similar to Hellfire of US. But with recent modifications our Umtas now has a range of 16km.
Both missiles have speeds over 2mach. So they are difficult to intercept.
Umtas has RF two way data link guidance.
Sungur has IIR guidance for precision strikes.

 

[TheInsider]

ATAS=Air to Air Sungur

 

[dustdevil]

The plan is that the Sungur will be joining the inventory this year. (I thought ATAS is the acronym for Air To Air Stinger)
There is work being carried out to increase Sungur’s effective range and altitude. So there may be a Sungur-ER to come yet.

Turkey to Deploy SUNGUR Air Defence Missile in 2022

The SUNGUR Air Defence Missile developed by Turkey’s defence giant Roketsan will be made available to the Turkish Armed Forces this year.

www.turkishdefencenews.com

As per @TheInsider has explained Mizrak/Umtas is similar to Hellfire of US. But with recent modifications our Umtas now has a range of 16km.
Both missiles have speeds over 2mach. So they are difficult to intercept.
Umtas has RF two way data link guidance.
Sungur has IIR guidance for precision strikes.

UMTAS should be subsonic. From a previous launch it’s more like 0.5 Mach.

source video:

On the left there is a time and distance counter.

I wonder if they changed the missile for 16km or if it was already capable of that distance from the start with a curved trajectory.

 

[Yasar_TR]

UMTAS should be subsonic. From a previous launch it’s more like 0.5 Mach.

My logic was that Umtas was produced as a Turkish replacement of US’s Hellfire, which is a 2 Mach missile, ours should be of the same ilk.
Quote
Both UMTAS variants are analogous to the AGM-114 Hellfire whose use on fixed wing aircraft and helicopters shaped the Middle East’s history for three decades running.
Unquote.

Turkish Anti-Tank Missiles Are Extremely Sophisticated

The OMTAS is an ATGM with alternating guidance options. Via Roketsan. With the exception of the United States no other NATO ally is advancing its military-industrial sector as fast as Turkey. At th…

21stcenturyasianarmsrace.com

OMTAS Anti-tank Guided Missile (ATGM) - MilitaryLeak.COM

The Roketsan OMTAS (Mizrak-O) manufactured by Roketsan is the first 160mm-calibre manportable/vehicle-mounted medium-range anti-tank guided missile (ATGM)

militaryleak.com

Both Umtas and Omtas use a dual thrust rocket engine. These engines are synonymous with carrying missiles with Mach speeds.

 

[TheInsider]

UMTAS should be subsonic. From a previous launch it’s more like 0.5 Mach.

View attachment 40876
source video:

On the left there is a time and distance counter.

I wonder if they changed the missile for 16km or if it was already capable of that distance from the start with a curved trajectory.

Yes, the UMTAS missile is on the slower side but it is intentional. It is done for the operator to assess the situation and switch targets if necessary with the 2-way datalink. The missile was advertised as an 8km missile but even in the earlier batches, it was able to hit a target 10.5km away(info comes directly from a person who hit the trigger of the missile in person). IMHO production development studies, further optimizations, and better gliding algorithms from the MAM-L probably applied to the UMTAS. That is how the range is possibly extended to 16km in a curved flying route.

 

[Trakya_forever]

@TheInsider do you have any info the altitude of Umtas during curved flying?

 

[Anmdt]

UMTAS should be subsonic. From a previous launch it’s more like 0.5 Mach.

View attachment 40876
source video:

On the left there is a time and distance counter.

I wonder if they changed the missile for 16km or if it was already capable of that distance from the start with a curved trajectory.

They have introduced an improved propellant, this is obvious.

Notice the changes on the range of Karaok/OMTAS missiles. Depending on the missile's size and dimensions the gain on the range is between of 1.5 to 0.5 of the initial range.

I think we may expect an update on Cirit's range with this pace, it could be above 12, even 14 km.

A few years ago the Naval version of the L-UMTAS with a reduced warhead weight (rather a special purpose warhead instead of an anti-tank) has reached beyond 10 to 12 km with the legacy propellant.*

It is not publicly disclosed but Navy had a special requirement for the missiles to be deployed on Navy's crafts. We may expect Roketsan to have got this fulfilled it at the moment.

 

[TheInsider]

@TheInsider do you have any info the altitude of Umtas during curved flying?

Nope. My guesstimate is 10k feet with a 6km glide path to the target.

 

[Anmdt]

My logic was that Umtas was produced as a Turkish replacement of US’s Hellfire, which is a 2 Mach missile, ours should be of the same ilk.
Quote
Both UMTAS variants are analogous to the AGM-114 Hellfire whose use on fixed wing aircraft and helicopters shaped the Middle East’s history for three decades running.
Unquote.

Turkish Anti-Tank Missiles Are Extremely Sophisticated

The OMTAS is an ATGM with alternating guidance options. Via Roketsan. With the exception of the United States no other NATO ally is advancing its military-industrial sector as fast as Turkey. At th…

21stcenturyasianarmsrace.com

OMTAS Anti-tank Guided Missile (ATGM) - MilitaryLeak.COM

The Roketsan OMTAS (Mizrak-O) manufactured by Roketsan is the first 160mm-calibre manportable/vehicle-mounted medium-range anti-tank guided missile (ATGM)

militaryleak.com

Both Umtas and Omtas use a dual thrust rocket engine. These engines are synonymous with carrying missiles with Mach speeds.

It should be high-subsonic. (0.8 to 0.9 mach if i remember correctly from some open sources).

Hellfire is wider in radius (thus the trust) and heavier to have an effective super-sonic speed at its maximum range.

The studies back then showed the missile with those parameters were to best to settle with for multiple factors.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1502627621326278657

@SavunmaSanayiST.com reportage with Roketsan on the way.

 

[TheInsider]

Note that the range of the MAM-L is also improved from 8km to 15km.