TR Missile & Smart Munition Programs

[Radonsider]

It seems for political gain,we are risking to be sanctioned!!
We are not a party state, our programs can not be disclosed for political gains!!

Sanctioned for what?


This is not against MTCR.

 

[dBSPL]

President Erdoğan: "We are now working to take them (The technology of Tayfun-like missiles) much higher level."

This sentence means something like this: Don't deceive yourself by only looking at the tip of the iceberg.

 

[Huelague]

It seems for political gain,we are risking to be sanctioned!!
We are not a party state, our programs can not be disclosed for political gains!!

What the hell you are thinking is a war?

 

[Bogeyman]

It seems for political gain,we are risking to be sanctioned!!
We are not a party state, our programs can not be disclosed for political gains!!

Those who complained that the state did not respond when Greece made a military build-up on the islands now complain that we threaten Greece. What a comedy though.

 

[Mehmed Ali]

Serious states do not disclose their best weapons? So the pictures of ballistic missiles submarines are just wooden models? Ah yes it is very important what someone thinks of somebody , conveniently forgetting that, that thinking has been the same for 1000 years.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

There are weapons that will destroy humanity in the inventory of the so-called most humane and democratic Western countries of the world which are leading the so-called modernity in the world. Those who distribute freedom through democracy are countries that exploit the world for their own benefits and never pay any price and these men are the reason why hundreds of millions of people are killed with conventional and nuclear weapons.
If someone is looking for an excuse for the embargo, they will look in mirror first. Those who want to demonize Turkiye already find an excuse, even if there is no Tayfun or others, so there will be missiles with much much higher range of course, and whatever technology is owned by those who shake fingers or threaten us, those technologies must be developed in Turkiye and we will put them in their eyes when necessary. Someone will have to pay the price for threatening Turks with "Nuclear France" in future. At this time, the Tayfun had to be known and It has been revealed and now they are thinking about this missile even in bed at night with fear. There will be sleepless nights too.

 

[GoatsMilk]

Remember Azerbaijan was only able to solve her problems when the armenians started a war. If you don't allow the greeks to make that mistake, nothing will be resolved. You showed this missile, its not going to stop them arming those islands, its not going to stop them arming other islands. So yeah you showed a missile but in terms of facts on the ground its not gained Turkiye. You wanted the idiot political establishment in greece to believe their own bullshit like the armenians, you don't want to stop them making a fatal mistake.

So i think it was a strategic mistake to reveal this missile.

 

[Agha Sher]

Remember Azerbaijan was only able to solve her problems when the armenians started a war. If you don't allow the greeks to make that mistake, nothing will be resolved. You showed this missile, its not going to stop them arming those islands, its not going to stop them arming other islands. So yeah you showed a missile but in terms of facts on the ground its not gained Turkiye. You wanted the idiot political establishment in greece to believe their own bullshit like the armenians, you don't want to stop them making a fatal mistake.

So i think it was a strategic mistake to reveal this missile.

Do you seriously believe Armenia started the 2020 war?

 

[GoatsMilk]

Do you seriously believe Armenia started the 2020 war?

They were occupying the land illegally and their government was boasting about taking more land not just from Azerbaijan but also Turkiye. Armenians are also known to constantly fire on Azeri positions, even today after losing the war they still do it. So yes they started the war. Don't believe armenian victimhood lies that they are the victim in this.

Even before that war the armenians created a major hot incident 2 months before it started.

If the greeks even fired once on Turkish positions, that could be the basis for starting a war.

And if even we went with the idea that Azerbaijan started the war, if Turkey intends to start a war its no good revealing your capabilities to the enemy before hand.

By also revealing this weapon which created a detrimental effect on the enemy, it means that erdogan never ever planned to come suddenly one night against greece. All that talk is purely meant for domestic consumption, its not what he or the state has ever considered or planned for.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Remember Azerbaijan was only able to solve her problems when the armenians started a war. If you don't allow the greeks to make that mistake, nothing will be resolved. You showed this missile, its not going to stop them arming those islands, its not going to stop them arming other islands. So yeah you showed a missile but in terms of facts on the ground its not gained Turkiye. You wanted the idiot political establishment in greece to believe their own bullshit like the armenians, you don't want to stop them making a fatal mistake.

So i think it was a strategic mistake to reveal this missile.

The main issue here is what state mind or military planners of our state wants. If you cannot find the right answer to this question, all your analyzes will be meaningless.

Do you think Turkiye would like to take the risk of a war economy imposed lots of sanctions at a time when it started to deliver billion-dollar new products to new markets with its efforts to take advantage of the gap created by current crises at a time when Turkiye made some economic reforms and revived production to reach 300 billion $ annual export? Or do you want to focus your only concentration on the war with Greece while creating new perfect alternatives to EU market under leadership of Turkiye, together with the partnerships established with new emerging union, Central Asian Turkic Republics in order to benefit from this crisis in a time when the EU will have a difficult times in terms of energy? At a time when the most critical and most serious strategic investments are made in the name of production, when talking about establishment of our own chip factories, PV cells, giant battery factories, turbine factories, automobile initiatives... and exploring big gas reserves in Blacksea or when the most strategic defense projects that will create Turkiye's main striking and defensive power are implemented one by one, does the Turkiye want to enter a war with Greece at the expense of stopping these perfect projects worth more than 70 billion $ ? No way.

What Turkey is doing now is to show its deterrence and determination. The other side, on the other hand, is provoking us and forcing us to make a first move in a time and place that they together with their bosses have determined, relying on the protection of the USA and France at the expense of destroying itself. They are taking this risk because this is the time when Turkiye is demonized, surrounded with terrorist organisations from the South thanks to US and relations with the USA are at their worst and fighting with France in African influence.

We, on the other hand, give the message Greeks that we will finish them at a time that we will determine the place and time, not now. We are finishing the terrorists in Iraq and Syrian problem will be partially solved with Assad, and the relations with hostile Arab states are perfectly normalized and Israel will be a trusted friend state again before totally concentrating and targetting the Greece to finish them. That's why some unknown products had to appear NOW in order to continue the deterrence and the Greeks had to be woken up from their wet dreams and that's what happened with Tufan. If they want more, Be sure that Turkiye will give more powerful medicine that will make perfect effect for their bodies.

 

[Altay2071]

Remember Azerbaijan was only able to solve her problems when the armenians started a war. If you don't allow the greeks to make that mistake, nothing will be resolved. You showed this missile, its not going to stop them arming those islands, its not going to stop them arming other islands. So yeah you showed a missile but in terms of facts on the ground its not gained Turkiye. You wanted the idiot political establishment in greece to believe their own bullshit like the armenians, you don't want to stop them making a fatal mistake.

So i think it was a strategic mistake to reveal this missile.

I also think it was a mistake. On the other hand we need to test our missiles, hence probably we couldnt keep it secret anyway. I had asked this already before in this forum, no one tried to answer. I think this is a crucial question. Strangely enough the administrators deleted my post.

 

[Altay2071]

The main issue here is what state mind or military planners of our state wants. If you cannot find the right answer to this question, all your analyzes will be meaningless.

Do you think Turkiye would like to take the risk of a war economy imposed lots of sanctions at a time when it started to deliver billion-dollar new products to new markets with its efforts to take advantage of the gap created by current crises at a time when Turkiye made some economic reforms and revived production to reach 300 billion $ annual export? Or do you want to focus your only concentration on the war with Greece while creating new perfect alternatives to EU market under leadership of Turkiye, together with the partnerships established with new emerging union, Central Asian Turkic Republics in order to benefit from this crisis in a time when the EU will have a difficult times in terms of energy? At a time when the most critical and most serious strategic investments are made in the name of production, when talking about establishment of our own chip factories, PV cells, giant battery factories, turbine factories, automobile initiatives... and exploring big gas reserves in Blacksea or when the most strategic defense projects that will create Turkiye's main striking and defensive power are implemented one by one, does the Turkiye want to enter a war with Greece at the expense of stopping these perfect projects worth more than 70 billion $ ? No way.

What Turkey is doing now is to show its deterrence and determination. The other side, on the other hand, is provoking us and forcing us to make a first move in a time and place that they together with their bosses have determined, relying on the protection of the USA and France at the expense of destroying itself. They are taking this risk because this is the time when Turkiye is demonized, surrounded with terrorist organisations from the South thanks to US and relations with the USA are at their worst and fighting with France in African influence.

We, on the other hand, give the message Greeks that we will finish them at a time that we will determine the place and time, not now. We are finishing the terrorists in Iraq and Syrian problem will be partially solved with Assad, and the relations with hostile Arab states are perfectly normalized and Israel will be a trusted friend state again before totally concentrating and targetting the Greece to finish them. That's why some unknown products had to appear NOW in order to continue the deterrence and the Greeks had to be woken up from their wet dreams and that's what happened with Tufan. If they want more, Be sure that Turkiye will give more powerful medicine that will make perfect effect for their bodies.

Currently both our air force and navy are more powerful than greece. Land forces anyhow. Also more tham 500 Boras should also provide adequate deterrence. So we had at least five years of time to reveal Tayfun to deter greece when they get some marginal air superiority. In that sense not sure about this revelation. Of course we dont want a war it will be costly and you dont need deep state knowledge for this. And not revealing does not mean we want war. Finally, I dont believe there is a deep state making perfect decisions. Looking at the last 15 years evidences this, except some improvement in defence industry that period was lost.

 

[Osman]

I have an impression from some twitter accounts that 2023 will reveal much more projects. Especially Idef 2023 will be a great show for both Turkish military industrial complex and Cumhur alliance

 

[Lool]

Remember Azerbaijan was only able to solve her problems when the armenians started a war. If you don't allow the greeks to make that mistake, nothing will be resolved. You showed this missile, its not going to stop them arming those islands, its not going to stop them arming other islands. So yeah you showed a missile but in terms of facts on the ground its not gained Turkiye. You wanted the idiot political establishment in greece to believe their own bullshit like the armenians, you don't want to stop them making a fatal mistake.

So i think it was a strategic mistake to reveal this missile.

Armenia and Greece's situations are totally different IMO

Many seem to not realise the fact that Greece is a failed state which is primarily still allowed to exist for the sole reason of containing Turkey
The Western plan for Greece is to just be "there" and prevent the Turks from obtaining either the only thing that they lack for a stable and flourishing economy and that is gas or to prevent the Turks from expanding its borders (since Turkey was an massive imperial nation before)

For those who believe that Greece will make the "mistake" of waging war is just delusional. Greece has alway been weaker than Turkey no matter the era! Even when Greece took back parts of Turkey during thr collapse of the Ottomans, it was primarily due to the fact that the Greeks were being protected by the alliance army

Greece is already performing its job spectacularly by just being "there" since its existence alone is a nuisance for Turkey's growth

As for Turkey, the west want Turkey to neither be too strong or too weak. The main role of the Turks is to be the first line of defence against a potential Russian invasion (and the recent conflict proved that it is possible)! Therefore, the West want Turkey to be in that sweet spot where it will be a pain in the ass for the Russians to break through them while at the same time being easy for the West to control Turkey whenever it misbehaves! Thus, the existence of Greece is crucial for such things

The appearance of Tyfun missile is just a warning that Turkey wont just sit quiet while the West takes it for a fool; i-e, if push comes to shove, then Greece can be eliminated relatively quickly and especially after Greece stated that they would do all they can to stop the recent Libyan-Turkish EEZ deal

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Currently both our air force and navy are more powerful than greece. Land forces anyhow. Also more tham 500 Boras should also provide adequate deterrence. So we had at least five years of time to reveal Tayfun to deter greece when they get some marginal air superiority. In that sense not sure about this revelation. Of course we dont want a war it will be costly and you dont need deep state knowledge for this. And not revealing does not mean we want war. Finally, I dont believe there is a deep state making perfect decisions. Looking at the last 15 years evidences this, except some improvement in defence industry that period was lost.

You completely misunderstood the issue or you read what I said totally wrong and responded in this direction or you consciously twisted the sentences by attributing other meanings to what I said. However, I tried to explain the issue in detail but obviously you have a problem with not about subject but because of your deleted message by "Admins" Let me explain it again for you if you are still in subject, but not with other problems related with your message.

It is not a question of wanting or not wanting a war. I am not talking about this. I am telling someone is making plans of a war with daily provacations/threatens and fully backed by his bosses. We are in a period when the Greeks under the leadership of obsessive Turk hater management dream of fighting with Turks under the support and protection of other states. To gain this support, they opened their country to foreign powers. They don't care how many Boras do we have or How strong our Land Forces are because they are in psychological preparations to unleash the nation of 10 million on the 85 million Turkiye with their air superiority tales and trust on support they receive so It was required a new shock wave and Tayfun was used for this

Revealing Tayfun is not a weakness but continuation of deterrance and stability to show them who is the boss in this region and play the geopolitic strength chess to gain more time because Turkiye will confront with them in place and time that state will determine, not in time they want. I'm talking about deciding when and how to wage war if it is unevitable and under what conditions the national interests will be most effectively protected against Greece and the block supporting them. The calculation of what we have to sacrifice and what we have to give up and gain is well calculated by the state mind and risk analyzes and likely industrial zones that will be affected are drawn to the finest detail and logistics and shipment are arranged accordingly. Measures are taken according to the scenarios studied and alternative plans for changing conditions are always on the table. A comprehensive war between two states is not a PS game to determine the results with simple comparisons.

That's why I'm talking about the fact that Turkiye needs time for the continuation of perfect deterrence, solving the geopolitic problems/disagreements in region, melting majority of terrorism problems in South and complete major strategic programs for the most effective/short result as a result of these risk calculations. Tome is with the nations who develop its own technology, not with the one who is begging left and right. it is a situation I mention that no Turkish citizen would want his country to be put in a position like they did to Russia. Greece constantly patted on the back under the solidarity of the Union and has the international and equipment support behind it, they may plan the energy of Turkiye in its rising trend being absorbed while lots of defence projects are proceeding and its industrial development interrupted and falling into an inextricable situation like they did to Russia.

 

[GoatsMilk]

The main issue here is what state mind or military planners of our state wants. If you cannot find the right answer to this question, all your analyzes will be meaningless.

Do you think Turkiye would like to take the risk of a war economy imposed lots of sanctions at a time when it started to deliver billion-dollar new products to new markets with its efforts to take advantage of the gap created by current crises at a time when Turkiye made some economic reforms and revived production to reach 300 billion $ annual export? Or do you want to focus your only concentration on the war with Greece while creating new perfect alternatives to EU market under leadership of Turkiye, together with the partnerships established with new emerging union, Central Asian Turkic Republics in order to benefit from this crisis in a time when the EU will have a difficult times in terms of energy? At a time when the most critical and most serious strategic investments are made in the name of production, when talking about establishment of our own chip factories, PV cells, giant battery factories, turbine factories, automobile initiatives... and exploring big gas reserves in Blacksea or when the most strategic defense projects that will create Turkiye's main striking and defensive power are implemented one by one, does the Turkiye want to enter a war with Greece at the expense of stopping these perfect projects worth more than 70 billion $ ? No way.

What Turkey is doing now is to show its deterrence and determination. The other side, on the other hand, is provoking us and forcing us to make a first move in a time and place that they together with their bosses have determined, relying on the protection of the USA and France at the expense of destroying itself. They are taking this risk because this is the time when Turkiye is demonized, surrounded with terrorist organisations from the South thanks to US and relations with the USA are at their worst and fighting with France in African influence.

We, on the other hand, give the message Greeks that we will finish them at a time that we will determine the place and time, not now. We are finishing the terrorists in Iraq and Syrian problem will be partially solved with Assad, and the relations with hostile Arab states are perfectly normalized and Israel will be a trusted friend state again before totally concentrating and targetting the Greece to finish them. That's why some unknown products had to appear NOW in order to continue the deterrence and the Greeks had to be woken up from their wet dreams and that's what happened with Tufan. If they want more, Be sure that Turkiye will give more powerful medicine that will make perfect effect for their bodies.

This is what i think, politically we have been a shambles. Syria is a good example of this.

We dived head first into the Syrian quagmire, we screamed for years that we can come suddenly one night only for the americans and russians to move into northern syria and build up their bases and proxies against us. Now we have to beg for years to see if we can get some minor agreement to clear out some minimal area. Meanwhile the PKK problem persists and grows.

We are doing the exact same thing concerning the islands. Tomorrow those islands will become American bases and no amount of Turkish technology is going to close the gap on US power. Its a big big mistake to sit back and allow that to happen, a massive one.

Now the argument that we should give ourselves another decade or two before we move isnt without merit, but that doesnt mean we give our enemies free hand.

As for the greeks giving messages is not enough, it never has been with them. They must be crushed on the battlefield. The more we talk the more hostile they become.

 

[TR_123456]

There are weapons that will destroy humanity in the inventory of the so-called most humane and democratic Western countries of the world which are leading the so-called modernity in the world. Those who distribute freedom through democracy are countries that exploit the world for their own benefits and never pay any price and these men are the reason why hundreds of millions of people are killed with conventional and nuclear weapons.
If someone is looking for an excuse for the embargo, they will look in mirror first. Those who want to demonize Turkiye already find an excuse, even if there is no Tayfun or others, so there will be missiles with much much higher range of course, and whatever technology is owned by those who shake fingers or threaten us, those technologies must be developed in Turkiye and we will put them in their eyes when necessary. Someone will have to pay the price for threatening Turks with "Nuclear France" in future. At this time, the Tayfun had to be known and It has been revealed and now they are thinking about this missile even in bed at night with fear. There will be sleepless nights too.

I wonder what happens when the Gezgin is revealed?

 

[Cabatli_TR]

This is what i think, politically we have been a shambles. Syria is a good example of this.

We dived head first into the Syrian quagmire, we screamed for years that we can come suddenly one night only for the americans and russians to move into northern syria and build up their bases and proxies against us. Now we have to beg for years to see if we can get some minor agreement to clear out some minimal area. Meanwhile the PKK problem persists and grows.

We are doing the exact same thing concerning the islands. Tomorrow those islands will become American bases and no amount of Turkish technology is going to close the gap on US power. Its a big big mistake to sit back and allow that to happen, a massive one.

Now the argument that we should give ourselves another decade or two before we move isnt without merit, but that doesnt mean we give our enemies free hand.

As for the greeks giving messages is not enough, it never has been with them. They must be crushed on the battlefield. The more we talk the more hostile they become.

Then you say, without wasting time, we must crush Greece on the battlefield. Of course, this is also a solution but I believe that Turkiye's state mind does not want this right now. But In all aspects, the state should think about the results we will encounter, what will be the benefit and harm to Turkiye in terms of possible consequences, will the loss be worth the gain we will get in this time conjuncture? Will the isolation and economic collapse we will experience before the TFX fly, before the engine projects are finished, before the TF2000s, sOM, Gezgin, Submarines come into operation, will it be worth the risk we take before and after those projects get matured?

Or Instead, for example, if we put full pressure on Greece and continue to keep its international violations hot on the world's agenda, develop strategies that will most effectively explain to the world that the cause of the insolubility is Greece and try to find a solution to improve relations with partners that Greece trusts, we will express our determination regarding Greece's illegal actions. Don't you think it would be more logical if we stated that we have the right to self-defense and not leave room for action in Greece in this way and reach our target point in this way?

We all know that Greece will not be able to hold out long against Turkiye in the arms race. That's why they're begging for second-hand weapons from everywhere. Don't you think it would be a more effective way to push them into dissolution in this way and to have the Greeks suffer mental collapse as in the Tayfun example with the time to be gained and to complete our preparations in the meantime?

 

[dBSPL]

I have an impression from some twitter accounts that 2023 will reveal much more projects.

I assure you, for the next 15 years, each new year will overshadow the previous one.

We laid the foundations for this major breakthrough in the 70s and 80s, we entered a new phase in terms of core system design and systems engineering capabilities from the early 2000s, and probably we are in the third phase with the 2020s. We can say that this phase of completion of vertical specializations, self-powered independence and regional power projection capability aim will be completed in the 2030s.

Again, in relation to this issue, one side of the coin is the completion of the technical infrastructure, but the other side is the creation of the political/regional conditions.

 

[Altay2071]

Just want to ask something and not challenge any opinion. Gezgin will of course be a serious threat for Russia, Iran, France, and probably american carriers. But since greece is so close, dont we already have certain deterrence from our SOM missiles? Also arent cruise missiles easier to take out, even with gattling guns like Korkut? So it seems it is certainly good to have them but they are not the most formidable weapons.