TR Missile & Smart Munition Programs

[UkroTurk]

If Umtas is laucned vertically its range will be reduced by 2/4.

So what? Still it will have 2 of 4 which would be enough against USVs

 

[Afif]

So what?

Nothing, chill out.
it is just that at this range it is more economical to shoot your 76mm main gun.

 

[UkroTurk]

Nothing, chill out.
it is just that at this range it is more economical to shoot your 76mm main gun.

No worries, I'm cuull but you have always a pretence. More economical will be when you don't stop the threats which attack Off boreside of main gun.

 

[Afif]

No worries, I'm cuull but you have always a pretence.

What pretence?

If laucned vertically, Umtas range will be reduced. It is a fact.

 

[UkroTurk]

What pretence?

If laucned vertically, Umtas range will be reduced. It is a FACT.

Ok we will consider it.THX for precious information.

 

[Yasar_TR]

"Off-Boresight" missile technology means that before launch the missile's radar or IR sensor can be cued to a target considerably off the nose of the launcher"

My question is : Could UMTAS and SUNGUR be cued to target before launch just with the software upgrades? İf yes , Turkish Navy's warships could launch UMTAS as well as SUNGUR vertically using data from Radars, isn't it?

Or the missile needs onboard inertial navigation system (INS) to navigate towards the target?

I don't think Hellfire has INS but somehow it can be vertically launched.

How Hellfire can be launched from VLS, crazy.
@Yasar Dear again me asking

Umtas specifications indicate a flight envelope that covers wide off boresight target acquisition.
Our new longer range version of this missile, most likely, will also have the same capability. These missiles are fire and forget type missiles.
Sungur is also a fire and forget type missile, specifically designed against aerial threats with very high manoeurability.
A missile's/projectile's range is longest when launched at 45 degrees. Any deviation from this angle will decrease range. Hence vertical launching is detrimental to range.
Umtas and Sungur are missiles that are designed for launching at an angle. In fact Umtas is also designed to be launched from helicopters against land targets. But they can be launched vertically too if the kinematics and the design will permit. At worst it is a matter of re engineering to serve that purpose.

 

[Oublious]

Umtas in a VLS is waste of space, you need that for important missile like HISAR defending the ship.

 

[Sanchez]

You would use a different, much smaller launcher for missiles that small, not MIDLAS or Mk-41.

 

[Osman]

We have yalman for that kind of missiles. It is possible to carry 4 umtas, umtas gm and kuzgun with 1 yalman and I think there shoukd be enough space for at least 2 yalmans in our frigates and corvettes

 

[UkroTurk]

Umtas in a VLS is waste of space, you need that for important missile like HISAR defending the ship.

Hisar against Unmanned Surface Vessels? Why not, if you don't bother spreading limited numbers of Hisar in the ship? İ-Class have just 16 cell VLS. ADA class zero
Are you going to add MİDLAS which cost more than SAM missiles.

Amerikans know their shit.

Must be Vertically launched !

 

[boredaf]

Must be Vertically launched !

Why? Why does it precisely have to be vertically launched?

 

[Heartbang]

Hisar against Unmanned Surface Vessels? Why not, if you don't bother spreading limited numbers of Hisar in the ship? İ-Class have just 16 cell VLS. ADA class zero
Are you going to add MİDLAS which cost more than SAM missiles.
View attachment 59380
View attachment 59381

Amerikans know their shit.

Must be Vertically launched !

Containerize this launcher and stack a few on the back of the Ada class.

Boom, fixed your situation.

Hell, containerize it and put it to ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING!

 

[UkroTurk]

Why? Why does it precisely have to be vertically launched?

Ask to Americans VLS gives 360cover with limited numbers of missiles in case of swarm attack. Otherwise you have to put every corner UMTAS launcher so you are wasting limited space of your warships. VLS enables limited missiles using effectively. When the target is USV slower than Antiship missiles you don't have to worry about reaction time.

 

[boredaf]

Ask to Americans VLS gives 360cover with limited numbers of missiles in case of swarm attack. Otherwise you have to put every corner UMTAS launcher so you are wasting limited space of your warships. VLS enables limited missiles using effectively. When the target is USV slower than Antiship missiles you don't have to worry about reaction time.

I also don't understand why you are stuck on Umtas. Just because Americans are doing it that way, we don't have to copy them. Hellfire has around 10kms of range and is about 50 kgs, iirc. Instead of Umtas, we can put Kuzgun on our ships with 1 or 2 launcher, depending on the ship. Kuzgun turbojet have range of over 100+ kms, Kuzgun-ky has 40+, kuzgun-ss has 100+ (with booster obviously). All of them have bigger warheads as well, we can easily hunt USV's with them. Not to mention we have other missiles we can use as well.

And this is just off the top of my head. We can find other solutions that can work for us, instead of trying to copy a country with around 60-70 times our defense budget.

 

[UkroTurk]

I also don't understand why you are stuck on Umtas. Just because Americans are doing it that way, we don't have to copy them. Hellfire has around 10kms of range and is about 50 kgs, iirc. Instead of Umtas, we can put Kuzgun on our ships with 1 or 2 launcher, depending on the ship. Kuzgun turbojet have range of over 100+ kms, Kuzgun-ky has 40+, kuzgun-ss has 100+ (with booster obviously). All of them have bigger warheads as well, we can easily hunt USV's with them. Not to mention we have other missiles we can use as well.

And this is just off the top of my head. We can find other solutions that can work for us, instead of trying to copy a country with around 60-70 times our defense budget.

I

I also don't understand why you are stuck on Umtas. Just because Americans are doing it that way, we don't have to copy them. Hellfire has around 10kms of range and is about 50 kgs, iirc. Instead of Umtas, we can put Kuzgun on our ships with 1 or 2 launcher, depending on the ship. Kuzgun turbojet have range of over 100+ kms, Kuzgun-ky has 40+, kuzgun-ss has 100+ (with booster obviously). All of them have bigger warheads as well, we can easily hunt USV's with them. Not to mention we have other missiles we can use as well.

And this is just off the top of my head. We can find other solutions that can work for us, instead of trying to copy a country with around 60-70 times our defense budget.ı

İf Kuzgun KY is available why not. I don't have any obsession. I am just trying to show the new era of USVs.

 

[Quasar]

frankly speaking US navy considers hellfire for asymmetrical treats like iran or USVs. Turkish navy is not facing a similar asymmetrical treat from sea yet! However, what concerns me is Air i.e our lack of or limited protection of our navy's smaller combatants against loitering munition and small drones

 

[boredaf]

I

İf Kuzgun KY is available why not. I don't have any obsession. I am just trying to show the new era of USVs.

We also have options like Alpagut loitering munition, which has a warhead about as powerful as a Hellfire and longer range. We can use loitering munitions like that to hunt USV's as well.

 

[Heartbang]

I'd also like to remind yall that the US has literally millions of Hellfire missiles sitting on some hangar somewhere. Therefore the 1st order of business is to use those in novel new ways.
We don't have millions of Hellfires in stock. I reckon we don't have millions of UMTAS missiles in stock as well.
Therefore we can afford to think outside the box and be innovative.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Roketsan, Mr Ikinci: "We will introduce longer range UMTAS GM-Block 2 with a hybrid seeker head"

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Mr Ikinci: "Tests of MAM-L and MAM-T with IIR seeker have been successfully completed."