Mongolians study traditional writing after China pushes language reforms in Inner Mongolia

[xizhimen]

Ethnic groups in Inner Mongolia, 2010 census

Ethnicity	Population	Percentage
Han	19,650,687	79.54%
Mongol	4,226,093	17.11%
Hui	452,765	1.83%
Daur	121,483	0.49%
Evenks	26,139	0.11%
Oroqen people	8,464	0.07%

 

[xizhimen]

And the western media didn't tell the whole story, First the cancellation of some Mongolian language classes information was from some unnamed local low level officials which can not be verified, second the source only said 3 courses would be changed from Mongolian into Mandarin, Politics, History and Chinese, not all the courses.
Last but not least, here is the government offical announcement on this issue on Sept. 4th 2020: The bilingual education won't be changed, the hours of Mongolian teaching in schools will remain unchanged for the coming new shool term.

8月底爆发​

2020年6月份，内蒙古通辽市一次教育部巡查中，巡视员透露出消息说9月份开始通辽市的蒙授学校民族学校进行全国统编《语文》教材课改试点[需要更好来源]，同时政治、历史和语文三科将被从蒙文改为普通话讲授。这引起当地蒙古族民众不满，当时有一些网上讨论相关话题的社群被关闭，亦有老师、学生和家长被告诫要谨慎发言

8月26日，内蒙古自治区教育厅发布《全区民族语言授课学校小学一年级和初中一年级使用国家统编语文教材实施方案》，要求从9月1日起，全自治区所有中、小学一年级新学期起中止使用蒙古族母语教学（非所有课程）。据英国广播公司报导，有鄂尔多斯市教育界人士指出，官方可能因事出敏感而只在口头传达相关文件，且不允许与会者记录。8月29日，内蒙古自治区教育厅厅长侯元宣布从2020年秋季学期起，内蒙古自治区蒙古语授课学校小学一年级和初中一年级将使用国家统编《语文》教材，但其他年级使用教材不变，授课语言文字不变，蒙古语文课时不变。

就内蒙古自治区现有双语教学体系是否改变，以及是否取消蒙古语文课程两个问题，当局于9月4日表示现有双语教育体系没有改变，与往年相比，将原来小学二年级起开设的《汉语》课程改为从小学一年级起开设国家统编《语文》课程，初中一年级将原来的《汉语》课程改为国家统编《语文》课程。其他学科和其他年级课程设置、使用教材、授课语言文字、蒙古语文和朝鲜语文课时皆不变。三科统编教材全面推开后，民族语言授课中小学其他学科课程设置、使用教材、授课语言文字、蒙古语文及朝鲜语文课时不变。

That' why I see people better have a balanced approach to an issue, not wholeheartedly just listen to one sided stories of each side, cause each side may just cherry pick what suits their own agenda and rarely tells you the whole shore and shows the whole picture.

 

[Nilgiri]

OK got it, its all much ado about nothing as usual. *Wink Wink*

SCMP is just another western media in the end....except when its pro-CCP in some content, then its great.

 

[xizhimen]

OK got it, its all much ado about nothing as usual. *Wink Wink*

SCMP is just another western media in the end....except when its pro-CCP in some content, then its great.

That incident was widely reported by many western media channels, not only by SCMP from Hong kong. I only suggest balanced approach, not just listen to either China's or western media's accounts uncritically, Chinese media also cherry picks and intends not to give a whole picture.

 

[Saithan]

Didn't this thread get sidetracked?

I think @Nilgiri has a point that because of Mongolia it may be easier to preserve language, but I do not see it ending well for Inner Mongolia. Because Mongolia is dependent of trade with China.

Also I have never met any China born/raise Chinese ever be critical of CCP, that imo is reason enough to doubt anything that comes out of their mouths.

 

[Turko]

strawman ---> strawman---->strawman = no consolidation, no logical debate...

My own darn fault to get into this time-waste again (I have a 10 person threshold requirement at very minimum to make this worthwhile I said earlier, I should stick to it).

Apparently there are local language classes in the US (say being conducted in Spanish or native american languages) that are now being taken over by English all of a sudden.

What is Ukraine's current reaction to prolonged russification during USSR, it remains a moral and effective policy? Maybe @UkroTurk can fill you in.

Or Russia today continues russification in tatar, siberian etc republics, intervening in russian-only policy (Where local languages allowed till now for classes) and changing earlier policy too?

Or will you come back to the "might = right" argument once more....i.e the japanese were correct to do what they did to China (nanjing etc) as long as they won in the end and established their overriding narrative?

Past that... the whole premise of the moral concept (identity within larger nation) underlying of the news story doesn't even exist apparently...so what's prompting the change if the glorious CCP policy worked fine for last 70 years or so?

Chauvinists literally don't get how own argument undermines earlier argument. Was CCP correct before or now? lol. Please you are putting on quite the show now....this is what blind unthinking might = right basis does. It strips the moral and logical basis bare....just march like a lemming left right left right....wherever the crowds headed....rather than is the direction valid or good?

After maidan revolution , russian language was forbidden on all broadcasts. Every tv show must be in Ukranian language however There are few schools in russian language.
But exams for enrollment university in ukrainian language. They also changed the name of streets which were pro-communist names.

 

[xizhimen]

Didn't this thread get sidetracked?

I think @Nilgiri has a point that because of Mongolia it may be easier to preserve language, but I do not see it ending well for Inner Mongolia. Because Mongolia is dependent of trade with China.

Also I have never met any China born/raise Chinese ever be critical of CCP, that imo is reason enough to doubt anything that comes out of their mouths.

I only suggest a balanced approach to every issue, not just being exposed to one narrative.

As for you never meeting any Chinese critical about China, probably you didn't meet many, I have some very good friends in Beijing and criticizing the government is their favorite hobby and pastime, and if you can read China , go to Weibo and Sina message board, tons of criticism against the government by the Chinese webusers.

Mongolians in the republic of Mongolia at least now don't preserve the old Mongolian culture as good as Mongolians in China do, they all adopted Russian style written language and Russian style names, as for what may happen in the future, we'll wait and see, some cultures once lost, would be hard to get them back.

 

[xizhimen]

The whole point is that nothing changed, Inner Mongolian still does bilingual education, the so called Inner Mongolian education reform never happened. End of the story.

 

[Saithan]

I only suggest a balanced approach to every issue, not just being exposed to one narrative.

As for you never meeting any Chinese critical about China, probably you didn't meet many, I have some very good friends in Beijing and criticizing the government is their favorite hobby and pastime, and if you can read China , to to Weibo and Sina message board, tons of criticism against the government by the Chinese webusers.

Mongolians in the republic of Mongolia at least now don't preserve the old Mongolian culture as good as Mongolians in China do, they all adopted Russian style written language and Russian style names, as for what may happen in the future, we'll wait and see, some cultures once lost, would be hard to get them back.

That is due to the old Soviet influence not having been rooted out.

I completely agree that you need to praise where praise worthy actions are made and criticize where that is needed.

I belong to the old school in that regard, I don't see a reason to praise people or governments for doing the right thing. Even though psychologically it's proven that, it's the best course of action.

So I criticize often, which isn't very good. But sometimes I remember to praise.

The whole point is that nothing changed, Inner Mongolian still does bilingual education, the so called Inner Mongolian education reform never happened. End of the story.

I'd like to point out that it'll come sooner or later, maybe even snuck in while no one notices.

Unless You have Mongolian ministers and cultural heritage groups keeping an eye on these things (even then it's not guarenteed).

 

[Nilgiri]

Didn't this thread get sidetracked?

I think @Nilgiri has a point that because of Mongolia it may be easier to preserve language, but I do not see it ending well for Inner Mongolia. Because Mongolia is dependent of trade with China.

Also I have never met any China born/raise Chinese ever be critical of CCP, that imo is reason enough to doubt anything that comes out of their mouths.

Yep it got sidetracked because there are several things I hold dear about China, that chauvinists just trample all upon on purpose or because they have no self-awareness. So I try to show the strawman tactic being used to audience etc.

I keep forgetting how much of waste of time it is...in the end everyone gets it or they dont get it anyway (I dont think there are many kids here)....how these "much ado about nothing" issues inevitably pan out downstream in authoritarian/totalitarian one-party state....of which PRC is by far the biggest one today.

We are just supposed to forget history I guess.

There is next to no regard given to is something fundamentally good or bad (supposing its happening)....compared to its collectivist "utility". This stuff makes my skin crawl.

This is not a "gee we are just the same as everyone else" "just balance it out!"....if everyone else comes from good faith moral basis (i.e what is done wrong in past at great lingering consequence, rather than justify doing it now just because others did it too)....but you precisely do not, simply to hold up the one-party state and neo-god-leaders that totally cannot be compared to winnie the pooh for a small joke even. This is the sensitivity and we are supposed to take this serious?

Then one such as this expects me to take words of "cowardly" "weak" "Poor" "underdeveloped" thrown my country way seriously. What's next? I am supposed to take some Nazi in 3rd reich super seriously too when he calls another something or looks down on somebody...simply because he can point to some number or asserted state of being in his country....all the while actively engaging or tolerating in most atrocious morally contemptible action on human beings?

This is all supposed to hold up some muster? It did for Tojo-Japan? This one even went so far to say as long as they won, it would. Might = Right...all about ultimate power to control history's narrative entirely. It is not surprising why every mass self-inflicted episode under Mao is similarly whitewashed away as "western propaganda".....because the narrative-control is the ultimate repository of the collectivist....rather than facts + logic + morality which form basis to help the individual.

These totalitarian apologists all think alike. I despise it in level that cannot be put into words.

Anyway, I have met lot of mainlanders critical of CCP actually (even within PRC), but you have to meet a good number of them I suppose.

China is not a unidimensional grey monolith on anything.

Given what CCP has done to China this long, I feel to hold China dear, I inevitably hate CCP (from a previous strong dislike).

To like/support CCP, I likewise have to hate China inevitably.

I made my choice on which to pick quite some time ago....I have Chinese friends, incl mainlanders.

What can I say, I grew up in HK and Singapore....I have been to Taiwan too. I know what China can be if it accepted a basic moral basis in political setup, its own balanced Confucian nature again at the highest realm.

A great pain and suffering was inflicted on this great country by others and by its own hand for couple centuries now. Sadly its political dispensation meets that with inflicting great pain and suffering in return...with all the amnesia and gaslighting short and long term that it requires. It has taken its toll on its defenders and they simply refuse to see, or they cannot see. They have no idea how they only make people despise their attitude more. It is why I "debate"this one sometimes when I see fit, he does most of my work for me.

@Madokafc

 

[xizhimen]

Yep it got sidetracked because there are several things I hold dear about China, that chauvinists just trample all upon on purpose or because they have no self-awareness. So I try to show the strawman tactic being used to audience etc.

I keep forgetting how much of waste of time it is...in the end everyone gets it or they dont get it anyway (I dont think there are many kids here)....how these "much ado about nothing" issues inevitably pan out downstream in authoritarian/totalitarian one-party state....of which PRC is by far the biggest one today.

We are just supposed to forget history I guess.

There is next to no regard given to is something fundamentally good or bad (supposing its happening)....compared to its collectivist "utility". This stuff makes my skin crawl.

This is not a "gee we are just the same as everyone else" "just balance it out!"....if everyone else comes from good faith moral basis (i.e what is done wrong in past at great lingering consequence, rather than justify doing it now just because others did it too)....but you precisely do not, simply to hold up the one-party state and neo-god-leaders that totally cannot be compared to winnie the pooh for a small joke even. This is the sensitivity and we are supposed to take this serious?

Then one such as this expects me to take words of "cowardly" "weak" "Poor" "underdeveloped" thrown my country way seriously. What's next? I am supposed to take some Nazi in 3rd reich super seriously too when he calls another something or looks down on somebody...simply because he can point to some number or asserted state of being in his country....all the while actively engaging or tolerating in most atrocious morally contemptible action on human beings?

This is all supposed to hold up some muster? It did for Tojo-Japan? This one even went so far to say as long as they won, it would. Might = Right...all about ultimate power to control history's narrative entirely. It is not surprising why every mass self-inflicted episode under Mao is similarly whitewashed away as "western propaganda".....because the narrative-control is the ultimate repository of the collectivist....rather than facts + logic + morality which form basis to help the individual.

These totalitarian apologists all think alike. I despise it in level that cannot be put into words.

Anyway, I have met lot of mainlanders critical of CCP actually (even within PRC), but you have to meet a good number of them I suppose.

China is not a unidimensional grey monolith on anything.

Given what CCP has done to China this long, I feel to hold China dear, I inevitably hate CCP (from a previous strong dislike).

To like/support CCP, I likewise have to hate China inevitably.

I made my choice on which to pick quite some time ago....I have Chinese friends, incl mainlanders.

What can I say, I grew up in HK and Singapore....I have been to Taiwan too. I know what China can be if it accepted a basic moral basis in political setup, its own balanced Confucian nature again at the highest realm.

A great pain and suffering was inflicted on this great country by others and by its own hand for couple centuries now. Sadly its political dispensation meets that with inflicting great pain and suffering in return...with all the amnesia and gaslighting short and long term that it requires. It has taken its toll on its defenders and they simply refuse to see, or they cannot see. They have no idea how they only make people despise their attitude more. It is why I "debate"this one sometimes when I see fit, he does most of my work for me.

@Madokafc

Can we go back to talk about Inner Mongolia instead me and CCP again?

 

[Madokafc]

Yep it got sidetracked because there are several things I hold dear about China, that chauvinists just trample all upon on purpose or because they have no self-awareness. So I try to show the strawman tactic being used to audience etc.

I keep forgetting how much of waste of time it is...in the end everyone gets it or they dont get it anyway (I dont think there are many kids here)....how these "much ado about nothing" issues inevitably pan out downstream in authoritarian/totalitarian one-party state....of which PRC is by far the biggest one today.

We are just supposed to forget history I guess.

There is next to no regard given to is something fundamentally good or bad (supposing its happening)....compared to its collectivist "utility". This stuff makes my skin crawl.

This is not a "gee we are just the same as everyone else" "just balance it out!"....if everyone else comes from good faith moral basis (i.e what is done wrong in past at great lingering consequence, rather than justify doing it now just because others did it too)....but you precisely do not, simply to hold up the one-party state and neo-god-leaders that totally cannot be compared to winnie the pooh for a small joke even. This is the sensitivity and we are supposed to take this serious?

Then one such as this expects me to take words of "cowardly" "weak" "Poor" "underdeveloped" thrown my country way seriously. What's next? I am supposed to take some Nazi in 3rd reich super seriously too when he calls another something or looks down on somebody...simply because he can point to some number or asserted state of being in his country....all the while actively engaging or tolerating in most atrocious morally contemptible action on human beings?

This is all supposed to hold up some muster? It did for Tojo-Japan? This one even went so far to say as long as they won, it would. Might = Right...all about ultimate power to control history's narrative entirely. It is not surprising why every mass self-inflicted episode under Mao is similarly whitewashed away as "western propaganda".....because the narrative-control is the ultimate repository of the collectivist....rather than facts + logic + morality which form basis to help the individual.

These totalitarian apologists all think alike. I despise it in level that cannot be put into words.

Anyway, I have met lot of mainlanders critical of CCP actually (even within PRC), but you have to meet a good number of them I suppose.

China is not a unidimensional grey monolith on anything.

Given what CCP has done to China this long, I feel to hold China dear, I inevitably hate CCP (from a previous strong dislike).

To like/support CCP, I likewise have to hate China inevitably.

I made my choice on which to pick quite some time ago....I have Chinese friends, incl mainlanders.

What can I say, I grew up in HK and Singapore....I have been to Taiwan too. I know what China can be if it accepted a basic moral basis in political setup, its own balanced Confucian nature again at the highest realm.

A great pain and suffering was inflicted on this great country by others and by its own hand for couple centuries now. Sadly its political dispensation meets that with inflicting great pain and suffering in return...with all the amnesia and gaslighting short and long term that it requires. It has taken its toll on its defenders and they simply refuse to see, or they cannot see. They have no idea how they only make people despise their attitude more. It is why I "debate"this one sometimes when I see fit, he does most of my work for me.

@Madokafc

The case in which happened in Indonesia, a country who hold dear Bhineka Tunggal Ika as a motto, and set example on how majority of the population doesn't set their ego as fundamental principle to build a Nation Building programme (in which Javanese and Sundanese who hold sway of largest population among other Indonesian ethnic) never in Indonesia Central Government policy to promoting Javanization in the way likes Han Chinese suppress other culture of many minority ethnic in China in which very disgusting as they often said we in Indonesia suppress their culture here. Indonesian using National Language, Bahasa Indonesia in which derived from Malay ethnic language groups, in which a minority in Indonesia. Indonesian allow other ethnic groups and culture to thrive and developed in accordance with our own value and only ever excluding Chinese culture in which had major reason to be suppressed during New Order but after reformation era their is as free as other ethnic groups in Indonesia.

I am always despise Chinese who said Indonesia today suppressing minority here and doesn't allow freedom of religion or expresssion or becoming fundamentalis Islam, but never take a look on how today Commies Chinese treat other ethnic or even foreigner in which they deemed as lesser than them (like Viet, Pakistani and African people). Actually they are comparable with the Arabs supremacist in middle east or White supremacist in western countries .

 

[xizhimen]

Inner Mongolia​

Ethnic Mongolian population: 4,226,093
GDP USD : 264.60 billion
GDP per capita : US$13,000 (2019)


Mongolia
Population: 3,057,778
GDP USD : $13.7 billion
GDP per capita : $4,151

 

[xizhimen]

The case in which happened in Indonesia, a country who hold dear Bhineka Tunggal Ika as a motto, and set example on how majority of the population doesn't set their ego as fundamental principle to build a Nation Building programme (in which Javanese and Sundanese who hold sway of largest population among other Indonesian ethnic) never in Indonesia Central Government policy to promoting Javanization in the way likes Han Chinese suppress other culture of many minority ethnic in China in which very disgusting as they often said we in Indonesia suppress their culture here. Indonesian using National Language, Bahasa Indonesia in which derived from Malay ethnic language groups, in which a minority in Indonesia. Indonesian allow other ethnic groups and culture to thrive and developed in accordance with our own value and only ever excluding Chinese culture in which had major reason to be suppressed during New Order but after reformation era their is as free as other ethnic groups in Indonesia.

I am always despise Chinese who said Indonesia today suppressing minority here and doesn't allow freedom of religion or expresssion or becoming fundamentalis Islam, but never take a look on how today Commies Chinese treat other ethnic or even foreigner in which they deemed as lesser than them (like Viet, Pakistani and African people). Actually they are comparable with the Arabs supremacist in middle east or White supremacist in western countries .

I think China's ethnic problems do exist but had been played way up out of proportion by the foreign media from day one, China is almost a single nation state which Han population are of over 92% and all 55 ethnic minority groups all together account for less than 8%, the biggest minority group, ethnic Zhuang only account for a little bit over 1%, almost all their groups are less than 1% each.
So minority issues are never a significant one in China.

 

[xizhimen]

Where Is Inner Mongolia/ What Is The Difference Between Inner Mongolia And Outer Mongolia​

 

[xizhimen]

Trilingual Subway in Huhhot, Inner Mongolia, China​

It feels odd when I go somewhere else from Inner Mongolia, cause I can see and hear Mongolian language most of the time when I’m in Inner Mongolia. And I’m happy to see that the Huhhot subway has Mongolian reports and at the same time it’s a bit sad that my language doesn’t “exist” in other areas in China.

 

[Saithan]

Where Is Inner Mongolia/ What Is The Difference Between Inner Mongolia And Outer Mongolia​

Even though Mongolia is much bigger, the land itself is harsh, like coldest areas of Siberia, where Yakut Turks live. Interesting to note that I understand quite a bit of what they're saying.

Anyway to develop, grow and expand Mongolia needs money, they need to export. and Since they really don't have any of the means to do so, the process takes very long time.

I will not rule out that China might invade Mongolia at some point because of resources and such.

As you pointed out the population is like a drop of water in a bucket compared to many nations in the world.

 

[xizhimen]

Interesting to note that I understand quite a bit of what they're saying.

You can understand Mongolian...?

 

[Saithan]

You can understand Mongolian...?

No, I was refering to Yakut Turks in Siberia. I can understand what they're talking about in general.

 

[xizhimen]

Trilingual Subway in Huhhot, Inner Mongolia, China​

It feels odd when I go somewhere else from Inner Mongolia, cause I can see and hear Mongolian language most of the time when I’m in Inner Mongolia. And I’m happy to see that the Huhhot subway has Mongolian reports and at the same time it’s a bit sad that my language doesn’t “exist” in other areas in China.

Same is also true in Xinjiang and all minority regions, Subway and all signs in Xinjiang are also bilingual or trilingual

Xinjiang subway

URUMQI | Public Transport

www.skyscrapercity.com