TR Naval Programs

[dBSPL]

Turkish Navy: Hey komşi, no need to worry, it is just a patrol ship.

 

[Brave Janissary]

Behalf of Mar-d with Arda radar it would be very high potential to asw&asuw missions. When they focus with stm500 on east Mediterranean and Aegean our grand navy will set sail to open seas easily.

 

[Heartbang]

Can you redpill me on these ships? I am having trouble finding cohesive information on Hisar-class.

 

[uçuyorum]

Can you redpill me on these ships? I am having trouble finding cohesive information on Hisar-class.

Like an Ada class slightly weaker more fuel efficient propulsion but longer endurance and lighter sensor & weapon load, I guess

 

[UkroTurk]

Does Turkish Defense Industry produce synthetic aperture sonars or Multiple aperture sonars

Are there any plans in Turkish Navy employ SAS or MAS in the warships?

For instance Hisar Class, Ada Class, İ-Class and USWs could use MAS for ASW.

On the other hand Tuzla class patrol boats could use SAS..

MAS vs SAS - When should we use multiple aperture sonar?

An AUV with Solstice sees further and at higher resolution than traditional side-scans. However, compared to Synthetic Aperture Sonar (SAS) it’s shorter range and it offers less resolution.

geo-matching.com

 

[Heartbang]

Like an Ada class slightly weaker more fuel efficient propulsion but longer endurance and lighter sensor & weapon load, I guess

That's a given. I was confused about the "yerinde hazır" concept they're talking about when discussing this ship.

 

[uçuyorum]

That's a given. I was confused about the "yerinde hazır" concept they're talking about when discussing this ship.

Since it's almost same hull as Ada class, it will have open slots for same kind of weapons to be used if needed, but they will be left empty to reduce costs during peace time. So while it says it will have things like Hisar D or Atmaca these may be optional for that situation. It's almost like stripped down Ada class that can be converted to Ada, it will probably only have 76mm and other smaller cannons default

 

[TheInsider]

That's a given. I was confused about the "yerinde hazır" concept they're talking about when discussing this ship.

"Yerinde hazır"= plug and play it is one step further than "fitted but not with".

 

[Heartbang]

"Yerinde hazır"= plug and play it is one step further than "fitted but not with".

Gotcha, thank you.

 

[Strong AI]

F 515

 

[Afif]

It really is a shame they are making only 3x more of this beautiful ship.

8x Istanbul-class in total should have been the way to go.

 

[BalkanTurk90]

It really is a shame they are making only 3x more of this beautiful ship.

8x Istanbul-class in total should have been the way to go.

Noone knows perhaps navy can order more , 4x are nothing , exports are going great so another 4 or 6 istanbul class will be great knowing that there are mutiple opponents around our Mavi Vatan but navy perhaps is waiting for bigger frigate like tf 4500 who knows.

 

[Ripley]

It really is a shame they are making only 3x more of this beautiful ship.

8x Istanbul-class in total should have been the way to go.

I agree. It is a beautiful ship. and desperately needed by the navy. That’s why they’re building three at the same time. Never heard of in Turkish ship building history.
However, theres also a fact (never been admitted by officials, of course) that TN also needs a ship that would keep up with TF2000 and TCG Anadolu to perform independent fleet operations on a huge geography.
Such probable task profile would necessitate a new hull of around 4000 - 5000 tons with long endurance, quite beefed up fire power and EW suites. And as such, it should perform missions at sea state 6 which is way above Istif’s comfort zone.
As it’s been discussed at this forum before, Istif Class, unfortunately, don’t fit the bill.

 

[Fairon]

I agree. It is a beautiful ship. and desperately needed by the navy. That’s why they’re building three at the same time. Never heard of in Turkish ship building history.
However, theres also a fact (never been admitted by officials, of course) that TN also needs a ship that would keep up with TF2000 and TCG Anadolu to perform independent fleet operations on a huge geography.
Such probable task profile would necessitate a new hull of around 4000 - 5000 tons with long endurance, quite beefed up fire power and EW suites. And as such, it should perform missions at sea state 6 which is way above Istif’s comfort zone.
As it’s been discussed at this forum before, Istif Class, unfortunately, don’t fit the bill.

I completely agree.

On the other hand, 8 Istif, 8 4000-5000t frigate and 8 TF2000 would be my wet dream.

 

[Ripley]

I completely agree.

On the other hand, 8 Istif, 8 4000-5000t frigate and 8 TF2000 would be my wet dream.

Normally I would exclaim an “eew“ but must admit that I also find myself succumb to such wet dreams

 

[Afif]

@Ripley Hmm, i guess for now 4x Istif, 4x 5000t new Frigates and 4x TF2000s is a reasonable 'dry dream'.

 

[manifesto]

Why was PİRİ KATS removed? Will it be installed later?

 

[TheInsider]

Oiler. The first vessel of the navy oiler project. 4 will be constructed. Over %80 national contribution.

 

[No Name]

I agree. It is a beautiful ship. and desperately needed by the navy. That’s why they’re building three at the same time. Never heard of in Turkish ship building history.
However, theres also a fact (never been admitted by officials, of course) that TN also needs a ship that would keep up with TF2000 and TCG Anadolu to perform independent fleet operations on a huge geography.
Such probable task profile would necessitate a new hull of around 4000 - 5000 tons with long endurance, quite beefed up fire power and EW suites. And as such, it should perform missions at sea state 6 which is way above Istif’s comfort zone.
As it’s been discussed at this forum before, Istif Class, unfortunately, don’t fit the bill.

Do you mean something like DEARSAN Shipyard F 142.

Main specifications of F 142 frigate design:

• Length: 141.4 meters
• Beam: 18.5 meters
• Draft: 4.6 meters
• Displacement: 5,500 tons
• Max speed: 27 knots
• Endurance: 90 days at sea
• Range: 5,000 nm
• Hull: Steel
• Superstructure: Steel
• Crew: 188 sailors

 

[Ripley]

Do you mean something like DEARSAN Shipyard F 142.

Main specifications of F 142 frigate design:

• Length: 141.4 meters
• Beam: 18.5 meters
• Draft: 4.6 meters
• Displacement: 5,500 tons
• Max speed: 27 knots
• Endurance: 90 days at sea
• Range: 5,000 nm
• Hull: Steel
• Superstructure: Steel
• Crew: 188 sailors

No I don’t mean that because TN, AFAIK, is not considering the design to complement TF2000.

Is it endurance? hull design? sea keeping characteristics? lack of ocean worthiness (sea state 6)? Or is it maybe just an eagerness by the TN to continue the tested and proven MILGEM line by squeezing a 4-5K tons design as an organic follow up design?

Maybe @Anmdt and @Yasar could explain further.

Meanwhile, there is a previous series of posts you may wanna check regarding this 5000 tons hull.

There seems to be two types of arrowhead ships; arrowhead-120 and arrowhead-140
First one a 4000ton and the latter a 5700ton frigate. They are both classed as light frigates.
First one a 120m long ship while the latter is 140m long.
Very capable platforms.
The longer one is also classed as Type31 frigate, and named as “Inspiration class”.
At 330million dollars each, they seem like a snip.

But I had rather build 4 more longer I-Class ships with a heavier tonnage, nearing 4500tons, in Turkey than spend money on these UK built ships.
Even if they are, the more expensive 114metre current ones are a better investment than any purchased ship.
Keep our money in the country.
Let everyone wonder what is under that hull.
If anything needs to be upgraded or changed, let it be under our control.
If we can build 3 ships in 36 months, then we can surely build 4 more if push comes to shove.

View attachment 56847

The difference is merely the endurance and seakeeping of the AH140 design in comparison to I-class. Unfortunately I-class may not be stretched to the size of AH140 but the mast could be retained as whole that would reduce the design efforts. If happens, those would be built in TR under a license, modified according to the TN needs with Turkish components and weapons but still, certified by Turkish Loyd.Not to be misunderstood, I am mentioning of this as a better alternative than Type-23s if there is such an urgency.

4 AH140 could be made and commissioned in 4 years, which is the foreseen duration for preparation of Type-23s for transfer and training of the crew and maintenance personnel.

I would be all in favor of a Turkish design like F142 (merely as an example, i am not very fond of the design*) but that is yet to mature and move forward from conceptual design stage to preliminary design stage. STM also had such a frigate design that hasn't gone public (not talking about TF-4500). Armerkom has studied on feasibility of such a design but that is yet to proceed (see how long TF-2000 took).

Then it’s official now. Turkish Navy really needs a 4000 - 5000 tons ship between Istif and TF200.

If the TF2000 designed with the criteria of “Unconditional operation at sea state 5 and conditional operation with speed and heading limitations at sea state 6” then it’s fair to assume that required 5K ship should keep up with the former, hence an endurance around 5000 NM with operational capability at sea state 6.

And yet we can’t tweak around the Istif class hull anymore to meet such requirements.

The options are Type23, Arrowhead and it’s variant (type31), Dearsan F142 and STM design.

Type 23, with its strong suit, the sonar suite stripped off (no pun intended) indeed not attractive at all.
Arrowhead and its longer hull variant type31 not desired due to foreign designs rather than our own designs.
Dearsan F142 seem lacking TN requirements whereas STM is just a design study as I understand.

Wow! Though.