TR Navy Naval Programs

[Sanchez]

@Kaan Azman why did you prefer LEVENT/Hisar combination rather than Hisar/Gökdeniz CIWS?

What would be the advantage of LEVENT + Hisar over Hisar + Gökdeniz combination?

IMHO Gökdeniz would be better as it could stop rapid missiles as well as tiny drones , ATGMs etc.

Hisar plus Levent would not make difference . No offense bro. I appreciate your works.

So we are looking forward to seeing Hisar plus Gökdeniz combination on ada Class.

If the RIM-116 sale that passed DSCA few weeks ago happens, don't expect the RAM to be changed on Ada Class ships. It would simply lower the costs to keep it.

 

[UkroTurk]

If the RIM-116 sale that passed DSCA few weeks ago happens, don't expect the RAM to be changed on Ada Class ships. It would simply lower the costs to keep it.

I totally agree. But he put especially LEVENT not RIM-116 on ADA class so he must have created the new combo for future ships.

 

[Kaan Azman]

Its more like an upgrade but sure, I have to remake my GÖKDENİZ that looks like shit compared to my current standards though

 

[dBSPL]

View attachment 70725

Well, I didn't and I saw the opportunity hehehehe
View attachment 70726

Great illustration. Thank you again for all of these great works @Kaan Azman . These brainstorms show us again and again that a little version of MIDLAS that allows peripheral installation would fulfill many needs, really well. It would be a system with a very serious export potential to other countries, as well as for our own needs starting with the ADA class.

 

[Sanchez]

I totally agree. But he put especially LEVENT not RIM-116 on ADA class so he must have created the new combo for future ships.

Apart from keeping RIM-116; I think jury is still out on which CIWS system is more viable: Gun or missile based. Americans are going with RAMs and SeaRAMs on their new ships for example. Navy is going for missiles in front, gun at the back on TF-2000. They must have more data then we do.

 

[Quasar]

For TF 2000 we have crazy&innovative ideas as well... 30-40 rotary wing UAVs to form a shield to protect the ship from anti-ship missiles...

guns, missiles and rotary wing UAVs+ NAZAR

 

[Yasar_TR]

US/German collaboration RAM System costs in excess of 25 million dollars. There are 21 missiles in a launcher with each costing 1 million dollars.
There are two blocks of RAM missiles: RAM Block 2 missiles are 2.5 times more manoeuvrable and have 1.5 times the range of Block 1 missiles.

Although the Block 2 missile is a bit longer and heavier than the Block 1 missile, the MK49 launcher has room and is capable of handling the 20kg or so extra weight per missile; provided a software update is applied to the system.

Our first two ADA Corvettes have the RAM Block 1 missiles. The last two ships have the Block 2.
The recent 90 million dollar purchase of 94 missiles were all Block 2.

RAM Block 2 has a maximum effective range of 15km. It is the ideal interceptor for sea-skimming anti ship missiles with a claimed success rate of 95%..

Our Levent missile‘s range is given as 11+ km. Knowing our specification release stinginess, we can assume that Levent‘s + value could bring it to be around RAM’s. (We know that recently, Sungur’s original altitude of 4km, now has been corrected as 6km)
How manoeuvrable Levent is when compared to RAM Block 2, we will not know. Neither will our adversaries.
We should be able to produce these missiles cheaper than the US is selling us for.
As there are less missiles in a Levent system, they can be employed in tandem on bigger platforms and single on smaller vessels.

 

[UkroTurk]

@Kaan Azman kisacasi bizim @UkroTurk diyo ki, "ben de isterem, benim ki ni de ciz"

BTW It is not just a my fantasy, it was already drawn)



You can see Gökdeniz plus MİDLAS-Hisar combination

Hisar-class offshore patrol vessel - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Sanchez]

....with the expected announcement soon of the construction start in the Istanbul navy shipyard...

Well, here we go!

Tomorrow the first steel cutting ceremony for TF-2000 will be held at Istanbul Shipyard Command. TCG Savarona will be (officially) delivered at the same ceremony.
---------
False Alarm, ceremony was postponed to next week due to Erdogan's scheduling conflicts...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1839257602573689008

 

[dBSPL]

The start of project construction activities in calendar year 2024 is the product of a truly extraordinary effort. I would like to express my gratitude to all the unsung heroes behind the scenes. The vision and hardwork of our navy should be an example for all defense and national security institutions. In particular, while the naval forces make us proud with their achievements, the situation of the coast guard unfortunately casts a shadow over these achievements.

***

In recent days, the most important issue highlighted in the content and comments in the written and visual media regarding the TF-2000 project is the integration of unmanned systems on an unprecedented scale in an air defense destroyer. As far as we understand, the ship will have the infrastructure to meet the needs that will arise with the placement of many different unmanned systems on the ship in the future, or with the development activities that will further increase the effectiveness of the concepts currently under development. In particular, the fact that the ship will born-naturally allow the operation of USV systems may be a more important detail than thought. In the first stage, there may be kamikaze systems that can be considered ready and can be transported by container in terms of size, but there may be configurations other than kamikaze drones that will support the ship's activities in boats of this size.

The most important idea that comes to my mind is that these boats can also serve as active RF+acoustic decoys that can actively mimic the maneuvering of a combatant navy vessel. I mean pseudo, dummy-combatant ships capable of maneuvering to appear in the foe's tactical picture. Or, even if it has limited power, it can also serve as a kind of forward patrol by approaching the coasts with some electro-optical systems it will carry. Examples can be multiplied, there is a very serious potential and a huge area of work in terms of system development.

 

[Anmdt]

Don't want to break your hopes but steel cutting is merely ceremonial, or procedural so it means a little for the actual progress. There is a lot to be done on the design level, and i will begin the hype when the structure starts to take form.

In case of emergency remember first I-class. The steel cutting was too early again for ceremonial purposes and we waited a long time for structure to take a form and even after that, we waited for years for completion of the construction.

 

[uçuyorum]

Don't want to break your hopes but steel cutting is merely ceremonial, or procedural so it means a little for the actual progress. There is a lot to be done on the design level, and i will begin the hype when the structure starts to take form.

In case of emergency remember first I-class. The steel cutting was too early again for ceremonial purposes and we waited a long time for structure to take a form and even after that, we waited for years for completion of the construction.

But it means the funding is there and such at least, doesn't it? Like it's at least a commitment

 

[dBSPL]

Don't want to break your hopes but steel cutting is merely ceremonial, or procedural so it means a little for the actual progress. There is a lot to be done on the design level, and i will begin the hype when the structure starts to take form.

In case of emergency remember first I-class. The steel cutting was too early again for ceremonial purposes and we waited a long time for structure to take a form and even after that, we waited for years for completion of the construction.

Wasn't a significant part of the delays in TCG Istanbul the problems in system procurement? We couldn't get MK41 from LM for example. And if I'm not wrong, Hisar-D RF firing tests started towards the end of 2022. 76/62 mm naval gun, close-in defense systems... Not just weapon systems but also we could not buy ASIST from Curtiss-Wright, a local equivalent was developed. In fact, I think that due to these embargoes, we have the largest non-US subsystem catalog in NATO for the operation of ship-based aviation. These are the ones reflected in the media, I am sure you were aware of other problems such as these. I wish that MILGEM-I had enabled some of these processes to be overcome earlier in terms of the TF-2000 project.

 

[UkroTurk]

@Anmdt Dear Could you please enlighten us, Will Hisar Class OPVs have Gökdeniz CIWS , Hisar missiles and one cell VLS?

 

[Sanchez]

Don't want to break your hopes but steel cutting is merely ceremonial, or procedural so it means a little for the actual progress. There is a lot to be done on the design level, and i will begin the hype when the structure starts to take form.

In case of emergency remember first I-class. The steel cutting was too early again for ceremonial purposes and we waited a long time for structure to take a form and even after that, we waited for years for completion of the construction.

Agreed, but the real life construction, as in design mostly leaving the desk and lab test phase to real world starting is something we have been waiting for nearly 2 decades now. Let us have our fun

 

[Anmdt]

But it means the funding is there and such at least, doesn't it? Like it's at least a commitment

The funding has been available for awhile, i see no issues there.

@Anmdt Dear Could you please enlighten us, Will Hisar Class OPVs have Gökdeniz CIWS , Hisar missiles and one cell VLS?

It will have Gökdeniz but Hisar could be for experimental uses. I am certain they will use one of the two ships as a testing platform for brief time to study modularity.

Wasn't a significant part of the delays in TCG Istanbul the problems in system procurement? We couldn't get MK41 from LM for example. And if I'm not wrong, Hisar-D RF firing tests started towards the end of 2022. 76/62 mm naval gun, close-in defense systems... Not just weapon systems but also we could not buy ASIST from Curtiss-Wright, a local equivalent was developed. In fact, I think that due to these embargoes, we have the largest non-US subsystem catalog in NATO for the operation of ship-based aviation. These are the ones reflected in the media, I am sure you were aware of other problems such as these. I wish that MILGEM-I had enabled some of these processes to be overcome earlier in terms of the TF-2000 project.

It wasn't only that, the project had two large gaps and first one was for design part. Specifically canadian embargo was issued later, in which the purchases should have been done already. 7 years and one major design revision after the construction began is unexplainable just via embargoes.

 

[Brave Janissary]

By the way we are talking about using drones for defensively in our destroyers, Why we not use him for aggressively?

İt could be one carrier missile who carry 2-4 drones to target like that ;

Or

Rocket asisted(m-36 kind small ones) six-packed(or quadpacked) in vls kind kamikaze drones ;

just establish hims in 16 vls of tf-2000 16x6= 96 drones or 64 in quadpack condition.

Send them half of them or quarter of them in a target are same time, and see the coordinated swarm kamikaze saturation strike.

Yes we build a capable anti ship missiles like atmaca but saturation drone strike cheap and more effective.

A one small drone can deactive a battleship easily. Just they need to hit bridge or cic or radar mast or vls of enemy ship.

Warships are very open to fires if they small drone can hit ammo, fuel tank or etc. And we talk in about send them many more drones.
-------
When I'm young watch the stargate series and see the alien drone weapon I was think about its very intresting and high tech.

But in the in nowadays seems humankind start to build of this technology.

 

[uçuyorum]

Well if somebody had done their job and finished the loitering, rocket launched munitions maybe we would have added them

 

[No Name]

Well if somebody had done their job and finished the loitering, rocket launched munitions maybe we would have added them

wait what are you talking about?

 

[uçuyorum]

wait what are you talking about?

Kargı, in response to brave janissary