TR Propulsion Systems

[Zafer]

I know nothing about engines but. Why are we not doing what even GE is doing to get ahead: Working with Japan? Their XF9 engine's thrust is superior to F110 in a smaller diameter. While it's thrust is lower than F135 & F136 perhaps it's only because it 's diameter is %20 smaller than those 2. Just under 1m. Why not simply use XF9 in KAAN by procuring IP rights from IHI? Could speed things up a lot.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IHI_Corporation_XF9

We wanted to do just that for tank engines but they did not accept.

 

[DBdev]

IHI sharing ip rights or even selling an engine? Good one mate

They cancelled their fighter project and joined to GCAP with Britain and Italy. So they PROBABLY wasted billions in development on the engine they won't ever get to use. There could be an opportunity with IHI. Wouldn't hurt to ask.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/09/asia/japan-uk-italy-new-fighter-plane-deal-intl-hnk-ml/index.html

 

[DBdev]

Japan fearing China is seeking protection from USA. So they are sacrificing their own defense companies' interests by buying F35 and other weapons from USA as a global protection racket, instead of producing locally. I believe it makes perfect sense to at least try to make a deal that would help both nations.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Ae...se-equipment-supply-chain-is-in-a-predicament

https://interestingengineering.com/...ary-power-of-japans-sixth-gen-f-x-fighter-jet
"
With regards to propulsion, one of the main companies involved in the project, IHI Corporation, has been testing a new jet engine, the XF9-1 low-bypass turbofan engines since 2018. This engine includes some interesting "exotic" materials that will help keep its weight down while simultaneously increasing the engine's heat tolerance to as much as 3,272 degrees Fahrenheit (1,800 degrees Celsius).

This engine is capable of pumping out around 16.5 tons of thrust with afterburners. This is impressive but it is still slightly lower than the F119 engines currently installed on U.S. F-22 Raptors. That being said, the XF-9 is slimmer and can generate more power at around 241 horsepower (180 kW) apiece.

Japanese engineers have also been toying with thrust-vectoring nozzles for the XF9-1 engine which, if successful, could provide the F-X with some impressive mid-flight maneuverability. This kind of feature is currently an integral part of the F-22 and Russian Su-30 fighters. Allegedly, the Chinese J-10 and J-20 fighters also have this capability."

 

[Afif]

They cancelled their fighter project and joined to GCAP with Britain and Italy. So they PROBABLY wasted billions in development on the engine they won't ever get to use. There could be an opportunity with IHI. Wouldn't hurt to ask.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/09/asia/japan-uk-italy-new-fighter-plane-deal-intl-hnk-ml/index.html

That couldn't be more wrong. They always sought western collaboration on their 6th gen fighter program.
Previously it was thought to be NG or LM. But they got better offer from UK to directly merge their program with Tempset. It was win win for everybody.

And the expertise gain from XF9 develop would be used for next gen engine development with RR.

Japanese has 5th gen single crystal blades in working prototype. I am not sure if RR even has it at that point.

 

[DBdev]

That couldn't be more wrong. They always sought western collaboration on their 6th gen fighter program.
Previously it was thought to be NG or LM. But they got better offer from UK to directly merge their program with Tempset. It was win win for everybody.

And the expertise gain from XF9 develop would be used for next gen engine development with RR.

Japanese has 5th gen single crystal blades in working prototype. I am not sure if RR even has it at that point.

You are saying the exact same thing. Yes they got experience from XF9 but they also WASTED billions and have a perfect engine for us that they won't ever be using.

 

[Rodeo]

TF6000 to be fired in a few months.

(the photo is old)

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1731588520244904166

 

[Anmdt]

So they have produced and put into service engines that are not publicly announced due to, I assume, political reasons?
Nice, but curious what that might be.

PG115, what is more surprising despite of all these new drones, TAF still operating Herons (30k hours in 2020, now 55k), 6-7K on annual basis.

They are using any equipment to the last bit.

 

[boredaf]

TF6000 to be fired in a few months.

(the photo is old)

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1731588520244904166

So it got delayed, because it was supposed to get ignited before the year ends few months ago.

 

[Zafer]

So it got delayed, because it was supposed to get ignited before the year ends few months ago.

The year has not ended for the most of us.

 

[boredaf]

The year has not ended for the most of us.

Your reading comprehension needs some work mate. The post says "in a few months" and we are in December. That puts in the next year.

 

[Zafer]

Your reading comprehension needs some work mate. The post says "in a few months" and we are in December. That puts in the next year.

It says Dec on the post but what is the statement date, same date or not.

 

[Rodeo]

It says Dec on the post but what is the statement date, same date or not

I assume he made the statement on this symposium a few days ago.(From @Cabatli_TR post)

I haven't watched it yet.

 

[boredaf]

It says Dec on the post but what is the statement date, same date or not.

There is literally no point in trying to reason with you, you cannot even put down your rose tinted glasses for one second to admit something not going right. I think I'll simply ignore you from now, discussions need two people willing to discuss ideas, not one person and a pink painted brick wall.

 

[Zafer]

There is literally no point in trying to reason with you, you cannot even put down your rose tinted glasses for one second to admit something not going right. I think I'll simply ignore you from now, discussions need two people willing to discuss ideas, not one person and a pink painted brick wall.

You are going overboard as always.
You should have provided a definite proof instead.

 

[Yasar_TR]

I assume he made the statement on this symposium a few days ago.(From @Cabatli_TR post)

I haven't watched it yet.

@Rodeo , exactly at this time stamp (1.08.08) he says this picture is a month or two old. It is in much further stage now, close to soon being fired up. So this is old news.

I must ask our members to be more considerate when posting old content and to make sure it is duly dated to prevent any unnecessary arguments.

 

[Spitfire9]

The question is what stipulations are RR putting forward for being part of the deal?

I have no idea. I watched an RR video about Tempest before it became GCAP. It mentioned 2000 degree TIT. Whether that was Celcius or Kelvin I do not know. I don't think that RR is going to part with that level of technical know how. However TF35K is not looking at that level of technology so perhaps there won't be an IP problem.

About work being categorised into difficulty levels, I imagine that the hot section would be where RR would be most useful.

 

[Zafer]

I have no idea. I watched an RR video about Tempest before it became GCAP. It mentioned 2000 degree TIT. Whether that was Celcius or Kelvin I do not know. I don't think that RR is going to part with that level of technical know how. However TF35K is not looking at that level of technology so perhaps there won't be an IP problem.

About work being categorised into difficulty levels, I imagine that the hot section would be where RR would be most useful.

What I understand from the news is RR are not involved in the production of the engine but only in the design of it. So they will be given what thermal specifications the materials will handle and RR will work out what other parameters should be in order to ouput the desired power levels.

 

[Saithan]

https://x.com/gdhdefence/status/1731602868413579272?s=46&t=DEy7rapS0QQE2YE7LHul5g

so according to tweet domestic helicopter engine will enter serial production next year. But I find the test oføn 4,5 h too little. Doesn’t anyone know why he is saying those hours ?

 

[Ripley]

https://x.com/gdhdefence/status/1731602868413579272?s=46&t=DEy7rapS0QQE2YE7LHul5g

so according to tweet domestic helicopter engine will enter serial production next year. But I find the test oføn 4,5 h too little. Doesn’t anyone know why he is saying those hours ?

That 4.5 hrs of test, could he meant to say 4.5 hr nonstop flight test

 

[TheInsider]

That 15k-ton hydraulic press is for forging turbine disks. Bulkhead will be produced by 3D printer and production rate is not a problem TAI won't be producing thousands of Kaans in a year.