TR TF35000 Turbofan Engine

[Quasar]

the statment is ''Our plan is to develop 6th generation features as quickly as possible'' eventhough it sounds a bit obscure still no need to OVERINTERPRET

 

[Oublious]

Well, the TS1400 has first been ignited in 2018! Not yet in serial production!!! It is planned in 2026, probably later. So how come a much more complex motor which has not yet been ignited, will go in serie in in less then 7 years? I'd rather say in the period 2035-2040. And 6th gen version probably five years later. So what Görgün is doing just enticing people with the false promise of 6th gen motor to justify all the wrong project management steps. These people including Ismail Demir and other responsibles should be held accountable. We will live another episode of Altay, welcome to Altay 2.0 fiasco!

TS1400 is ready to go, only thing what keeps stopping was certification and thats almost finished. TF35000 will not used in civilian airplanes so it will not be certifated.

 

[I_Love_F16]

Well, the TS1400 has first been ignited in 2018! Not yet in serial production!!! It is planned in 2026, probably later. So how come a much more complex motor which has not yet been ignited, will go in serie in in less then 7 years? I'd rather say in the period 2035-2040. And 6th gen version probably five years later. So what Görgün is doing just enticing people with the false promise of 6th gen motor to justify all the wrong project management steps. These people including Ismail Demir and other responsibles should be held accountable. We will live another episode of Altay, welcome to Altay 2.0 fiasco!

Count between 7 to 10 years after the TF-35000 first ignition to be completely ready. So yeah, more like between 2035-2040 as you stated above.

 

[Ripley]

KAAN will be fully ready in 2032

KAAN will be fully ready in 2032 with features that we can truly call 5th generation, powered by our own engine. The temporarily used F-110 engine can also be considered 5th generation. So, we're not too far off, but for it to be a complete 5th generation aircraft, we'll wait for our own engine. Once it enters service with our own engine, we'll call it a 5th generation, or perhaps even 5.5 generation KAAN.

By that time, we will have already acquired many features of the 6th generation. If you ask what the newly defined 6th generation is — well, everyone may define it differently. Our plan is to develop 6th generation features as quickly as possible using the platforms we already have, and apply them to KAAN.

So, the 6th generation project is not something that will start after KAAN reaches a certain point — it’s a set of parallel ongoing efforts. We’ll all be seeing these developments unfold in the coming months and years.

TUSAŞ Genel Müdürü Demiroğlu: KAAN ile 6’ncı nesil birlikte gelişiyor

Endonezya’nın 48 adetlik KAAN siparişi, Türkiye’nin 5. nesil savaş uçağı üretimindeki başarısını ve TUSAŞ’a duyulan güveni pekiştirdi. TUSAŞ, KAAN ile

haber.aero

Strong AI, the 6th gen was an eventuality we all hoped for, even prayed for in my case.


Post in thread 'TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet'
https://defencehub.live/threads/tf-x-kaan-fighter-jet.18801/post-254009

Good to know they’re moving the right direction, and yet what is the purpose this statement? The timing, I question like Boredaf. Right after The recent turmoil created by the statements from top echelons of the government. That’s all.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

The ground tests alone are expected to take at least two or three years. Realistically, the first airworthy prototype is not expected until 2029/30.
Extensive validation and testing will then be carried out until around 2032+ and beyond, followed by an additional phase of certification testing lasting around one year.
Series production is therefore not expected to begin until 2033/34+ at the earliest.

 

[Shtr]

How long will it take to create first prototype after completing critical design phase? Is there any blind guess?

 

[IC3M@N FX]

At least one year, as we are talking about a significant amount of manual work. Therefore, we can only expect the first tests in the middle/end of next year, assuming they decide to start building the prototype in the next two to three months.

 

[Zafer]

With the TF6000 engine it didn't take too long to get to the edge of the targeted thrust power value. It is not flying yet but it is supposed to be close to flying. The next test to confirm that TEI is learning fast from experience is the TF10000 scoring some points. That's when we will know how fast the TF35000 will go through its paces with some degree of credibility. Any guess before that will be largely unfounded.

On the other hand some of the earlier design frozen parts could have already been in the manufacturing process so they are not completely starting production right now. Per Mr Mahmut Akşit every next engine takes a shorter time to make, I just wish this holds right this time around.

 

[hugh]

Mahmut Akşit has shared a new rendering of TF35K

For reference, below is the rendering that is on TEI's website for a long time now.

 

[Afif]

Mahmut Akşit has shared a new rendering of TF35K

For reference, below is the rendering that is on TEI's website for a long time now.

View attachment 79624

The nozzle looks less stealthy.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

The situation surrounding the TEI TF-6000 and TF-10000 remains strikingly unclear. Whilst there is talk of hundreds of test runs for the TF-6000, reliable technical details or clear milestones are still lacking.
We have seen a few short test run videos, but that is all.
The situation with the TF-10000 is even more critical: apart from the statement that it is being ‘developed in parallel’, there is virtually no tangible information whatsoever – neither on testing nor on a specific stage of development.

Is licensed production of the AI-322F even realistic or possible? Or will we remain dependent on Ukrainian supplies, which are unreliable due to the war and will likely only be available in very limited quantities?

The situation is extremely unsatisfactory; the Middle East is in turmoil, whilst France, Greece and Israel are seizing the opportunity to heavily arm the Aegean under the pretext of the Iran war in order to push through the pipeline they wish to build. We should not remain passive and must finally accelerate our projects.

We need at least 20 Kizilelma and 20 Anka 3 drones by 2026/2027 to build up pressure with our existing F-16s. As things stand, we can forget about the Eurofighters from Qatar and Oman – they need them themselves now, and no one is going to give them to us.

 

[Zafer]

The situation surrounding the TEI TF-6000 and TF-10000 remains strikingly unclear. Whilst there is talk of hundreds of test runs for the TF-6000, reliable technical details or clear milestones are still lacking.
We have seen a few short test run videos, but that is all.
The situation with the TF-10000 is even more critical: apart from the statement that it is being ‘developed in parallel’, there is virtually no tangible information whatsoever – neither on testing nor on a specific stage of development.

Is licensed production of the AI-322F even realistic or possible? Or will we remain dependent on Ukrainian supplies, which are unreliable due to the war and will likely only be available in very limited quantities?

The situation is extremely unsatisfactory; the Middle East is in turmoil, whilst France, Greece and Israel are seizing the opportunity to heavily arm the Aegean under the pretext of the Iran war in order to push through the pipeline they wish to build. We should not remain passive and must finally accelerate our projects.

We need at least 20 Kizilelma and 20 Anka 3 drones by 2026/2027 to build up pressure with our existing F-16s. As things stand, we can forget about the Eurofighters from Qatar and Oman – they need them themselves now, and no one is going to give them to us.

Saha Expo is around the corner, 43 days to go

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Savunma, Havacılık ve Uzay Sanayisinin Buluşma Noktası

sahaexpo.com

 

[Yasar_TR]

The nozzle looks less stealthy.

What makes you say that?
Are you comparing it to the picture that is on TEI’s website?
Only the people who design these nozzles would know if it is stealthy or not.

Yes , there are few specific points that we all know about, regarding what contributes to a good stealthy nozzle. There is IR stealthiness and radar stealthiness. First is related to heat management and the latter is to do with the management of radar scattering and absorption.

These all relate to the design of the nozzle also it relates to the material science applied to the nozzle. And of course the use of bypass technology to improve stealthiness.

Serrated edges : we don’t have a good enough picture to know if the edges of the nozzle serrated or not.

Rectangular nozzle design : it does not look like it. But this is really good for TVC capable nozzles.

Airflow management : Again not enough info at hand.

Materials that insulate the engine and the nozzle: this is particularly important to suppress IR signature. Use of ceramic materials, especially CMC (ceramic Matrix Composites) materials is vital to suppress the IR signature.

Radar absorbent materials : we don’t know how well this is applied to the engine parts and to the nozzle.

It has to be remembered that the nozzle will have to be in closed in (converging) position during subsonic flight. But open up wide during supersonic flight (diverging). So without seeing the actual nozzle from the back angle it is difficult to guess.

If this engine is designed to be a stealthy engine to give thrust to a stealthy KAAN, it is only logical to assume that TEI has designed it to be commensurate with the plane.

 

[Lool]

The situation surrounding the TEI TF-6000 and TF-10000 remains strikingly unclear. Whilst there is talk of hundreds of test runs for the TF-6000, reliable technical details or clear milestones are still lacking.
We have seen a few short test run videos, but that is all.
The situation with the TF-10000 is even more critical: apart from the statement that it is being ‘developed in parallel’, there is virtually no tangible information whatsoever – neither on testing nor on a specific stage of development.

Is licensed production of the AI-322F even realistic or possible? Or will we remain dependent on Ukrainian supplies, which are unreliable due to the war and will likely only be available in very limited quantities?

The situation is extremely unsatisfactory; the Middle East is in turmoil, whilst France, Greece and Israel are seizing the opportunity to heavily arm the Aegean under the pretext of the Iran war in order to push through the pipeline they wish to build. We should not remain passive and must finally accelerate our projects.

We need at least 20 Kizilelma and 20 Anka 3 drones by 2026/2027 to build up pressure with our existing F-16s. As things stand, we can forget about the Eurofighters from Qatar and Oman – they need them themselves now, and no one is going to give them to us.

For your information, Israel and Greece arent arming the Agean to build their pipeline but to try and seige Turkey. The sole reason for the existence of nations like Greece and Cyprus is this. Imo, Turkey should sooner or later retake all of Cyprus and kick the radical Greek Cypriots back to Greece (if Turkey really cares about its national security or else there will always be knife ready to stab Turkey at anytime). Moreover, If Turkey controls whats rightfully theirs in the Agean and Med Sea, then Turkey will not only have decent R&D capabilities but the necessary financial capabilities and raw resources to back their untapped potential and that will make Turkey soar which Israel fears the most

Finally, I do remember Mahmut Aksit mentioning before that they wanna share more information about their progress but the government is implementing a strict ban on anything related to the defence industry; i-e, whatever will be shared to the public must first get govt approval

 

[Huelague]

For your information, Israel and Greece arent arming the Agean to build their pipeline but to try and seige Turkey. The sole reason for the existence of nations like Greece and Cyprus is this. Imo, Turkey should sooner or later retake all of Cyprus and kick the radical Greek Cypriots back to Greece (if Turkey really cares about its national security or else there will always be knife ready to stab Turkey at anytime). Moreover, If Turkey controls whats rightfully theirs in the Agean and Med Sea, then Turkey will not only have decent R&D capabilities but the necessary financial capabilities and raw resources to back their untapped potential and that will make Turkey soar which Israel fears the most

Finally, I do remember Mahmut Aksit mentioning before that they wanna share more information about their progress but the government is implementing a strict ban on anything related to the defence industry; i-e, whatever will be shared to the public must first get govt approval

This is the problem of most conflicts.
Finish them, once and for all, or fight them later, again.

 

[Zafer]

Curious if the engine will first run as an afterburner engine or a version of it that will run without an afterburner will precede the afterburner engine.

With the smaller TF6000 series the TF10000 engine only emerged after the TF6000 engine was made. It made sense as the slower engine would be used on a slower plane like the Anka3. But with the TF35k engine there is no slower plane in sight so the engine will probably emerge as the final product from the getgo. An engine without an afterburner is expected to be lighter too so it can power a smaller plane if there was one.

The configurations below can be considered for various uses

• TF35k no AB > ???
• TF35k no AB twin engine >>>> stealth bomber ?
• TF35k AB > ???
• TF35k AB twin engine > Kaan

 

[Spitfire9]

https://en.topwar.ru/264744-obespechit-nezavisimost-ot-kapriznogo-zapada-turcija-pokazala-nacionalnyj-dvigatel-dlja-istrebitelja-kaan.html

That article sounds like the writer is uninformed about Turkish turbofan development programmes. I note the writer gives an incorrect figure of 26,000 lbs thrust for EJ200. Perhaps he/she knows Russian military aircraft but not much about others.

I forget, what is the current target year for production TF35000 engines to start delivery?

 

[Zafer]

That article sounds like the writer is talking in general terms but is uninformed about Turkish turbofan development programmes.

I forget, what is the current target year for production TF35000 engines to start delivery?

There isn't an official date as it is a development project but we can work around dates that can be derived from some given dates. If the delivery to Indonesia is for 2032 it makes sense to think delivery to the TurAF would be around 2030 and a couple dozen be delivered before Indonesia order is processed. This is for both the maturity of the engine to world standards and for the production slot reservation.

On the other hand 2028-2029 is when the first 20 Kaan will be delivered to TurAF which is when the TF35k engine delivery is unofficially slated to match Kaan delivery in an effort to de-risk the missed delivery of engines by GE. Arguably the TF35k engine can be made available by this date in terms of delivered power and reliability to match GE engines.

 

[Spitfire9]

There isn't an official date as it is a development project but we can work around dates that can be derived from some given dates. If the delivery to Indonesia is for 2032 it makes sense to think delivery to the TurAF would be around 2030 and a couple dozen be delivered before Indonesia order is processed. This is for both the maturity of the engine to world standards and for the production slot reservation.

On the other hand 2028-2029 is when the first 20 Kaan will be delivered to TurAF which is when the TF35k engine delivery is unofficially slated to match Kaan delivery in an effort to de-risk the missed delivery of engines by GE. Arguably the TF35k engine can be made available by this date in terms of delivered power and reliability to match GE engines.

I think those given dates are not realistic. KAAN has flown for 30 minutes. P1 has not flown yet. TF35000 has not run yet. Turkiye may be developing TF35000 as fast as it can but I do not see development of production engines being linked to when KAAN is delivered to TuAF.

 

[Zafer]

I think those given dates are not realistic. KAAN has flown for 30 minutes. P1 has not flown yet. TF35000 has not run yet. Turkiye may be developing TF35000 as fast as it can but I do not see development of production engines being linked to when KAAN is delivered to TuAF.

Because it is really not easy to do that; it is only an intention and nothing is guarantied therefore it was only mentioned once or twice and was not dwelled on.