By the way, the Greek cost of 40 F-35s is not 9 billion dollars, but at least 40 billion dollars over life cycle. This does not include infrastructure, ground service equipment, documentation and training. The ceiling-price written to the Congress was found high by all of us. but when making the comparison, there is a weird propaganda on social media, as if the TAF will pay 20 billion for 40 naked jets while the F-35s only cost 8 billion for the Greek side.
This type of sales is not a new practice for Greece, of course, the Greek I linked below has explained the same thing in detail, even giving a few examples.
Η συνολική δαπάνη για τα 40 F-35 σε βάθος 25 ετών υπολογίζεται ότι θα φτάσει περί τα 40 δισ.! Σύμφωνα με τις επίσημες τιμές της Lockheed Martin και του Αμερικανικού Κογκρέσου 9 δις κοστίζει μόνο η πλατφόρμα των F-35 ΧΩΡΙΣ τα όπλα. Το κόστος των όπλων στοιχίζει 3 με 4 φορές περισσότερο από αυτό...
www.ieidiseis.gr
The present government, in order to show reduced costs for this particular supply, is following the path of previous governments by buying unarmed defence systems ! That is, it buys unarmed F-35s for parades and not for air combat!
The Greek Armed Forces have traumatic experience from the recent past:
- In 2000 the pzh guns were purchased without yet (24 years later) having acquired the 40km range missiles which was the reason for the procurement of this system.
- In 2002 the leopard-2 tanks were purchased without ammunition!
- In 2003, the ultra-modern submarines T Papanikolis were purchased, which after 20 years (they have exceeded the middle of their life span) still do not have the corresponding torpedoes!
- In 2005 the F-16s were purchased and the issue of self-protection of the F16s has not yet been resolved despite their upgrade to vipers.
The offer (LOA) coming from the US for the F-35 will NOT include new weapons because Athens simply did not ask for them to show lower costs, unlike Turkiye's corresponding request for the F16 which includes a long list of weapons systems.
Also despite the promises and announcements of the Defense Minister to strengthen the domestic defense industry the LOA coming to Athens from the US does not include any industrial returns (once called AO) because they have not been requested by the Greek side ! As a result Greece is not demanding any co-production or participation in any level of F-35 maintenance.
The cost of repair and maintenance of the "completely free" LCS frigates is prohibitive
As far as the "completely free" acquisition of frigates from the US is concerned, the reality is quite different.
The "coastal trawlers" (LCS) that...generously provided by the US, have already been deconstructed by the Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) Admiral Michael Gilday during his testimony to Congress: "I refuse - he said - to pay an extra dollar to a system that could not detect a high-tech submarine in today's environment. An LCS is as noisy as an aircraft carrier."
But U.S. Armed Services Committee Chairman Adam Smith has also said of LCSs, "We can't use them. First, because they can't do anything. Second, when they do operate they continue to fail. Their propulsion apparatus has been found to be unreliable."
The US in their effort to get rid of the LCS are trying to convince the Greek Navy that they are amenable to improvement interventions, the cost of which is some tens of millions of dollars that certainly exceed 50 million ! In addition to these costs, the maintenance costs must be added, which are considered unbearable as it is estimated that they correspond to more than one time of the total operational costs of the Navy.
9.4 Billion are the flyaway cost. So meaning no maintanence included, no armaments included, no infrastructure included, and the most important no training included. Add those costs on top and the sale would top out around 12-13 Billion dollars for 40 planes, depending on how many missiles and bombs they buy and which "tier" of maintanance package they order from LM. 1000 C8 Missiles alone would cost them 3 billion dollars.
It is also laughable that the greeks expected any industrial participation. They don't have the necessary sophistication to add anything to the F-35 program other than maybe deliver a panel here or there, if even that. If the americans trust them even with that, lets not forget Greece has a history of leaking military secrets to the Russians.
The LCS transfer is straight up just a scam from the Americans. They are gonna give them those ships "free" and then have them on the hook for decades of maintanance costs as well as MLU. All those they will be bound to order from the americans, maintanance duh cause no one else on the planet operates those shitcans. So "free" suddenly becomes over the next decade a 1-2 billion dollar investment into ships they don't need and that don't even work and if they do are pretty much useless in the modern combat theatre.
They are getting I believe free engines for their P-3 Orions which they actually wanted to replace but due to budget reasons decided to "modernize".
And the 2 C-130 are second hand aircrafts from the USAF inventory.
So If we actually take objective look here, it looks more like the Americans told the greeks "hey you wants this toy? How about you also take of 4 of those shitcans we don't want to use anymore cause they are useless and a moneypit of our hands too, huh how about it? *wink wink*"
The 40 number is nothing more than propaganda by Mitsotakis, pretty much a "Hey look we are buying FOURTY of those expansive jets, aren't we STRONG!"
In reality they will most likely order in the first place 12-16.
I expect them in the end to pay around 7-8 billion dollars for 12-16 planes+service+armaments.
Funny thing is since we left the program, or rather were kicked out the price of one F-35 went from 70-80 to now 200+ M for the greeks. But kicking us out had no negative effects am I right?
www.dw.com
www.thedrive.com
