TR Air Forces|News & Discussion

[Nutuk]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

 

[boredaf]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

No way. Not only that is Chinese plane but also it is not even close to F-16 block 70 or Eurofighter in any way.

 

[YeşilVatan]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

That would still take 2 years to configure, test etc. in a best case scenario. But if everything goes south, I believe it would be a solid alternative actually.

 

[Nutuk]

No way. Not only that is Chinese plane but also it is not even close to F-16 block 70 or Eurofighter in any way.

True, but we could make it more up to date with Turkish avionics, radar etc.


I mean as thought we should be open for this.

US kicked us out of the F35 program, is everything but clear on the sale of F16.

I did not make a study out of it and am just dropping the idea of JF-17 as discussion starter. That said being fully aware that we are still dependent on US engines regarding to Hurjet and TFx.

I personally am totally against the idea of EF2000 (which is replacing dependency on the US with dependency on EU, a no go IMHO)

 

[boredaf]

True, but we could make it more up to date with Turkish avionics, radar etc.


I mean as thought we should be open for this.

US kicked us out of the F35 program, is everything but clear on the sale of F16.

I did not make a study out of it and am just dropping the idea of JF-17 as discussion starter. That said being fully aware that we are still dependent on US engines regarding to Hurjet and TFx.

I personally am totally against the idea of EF2000 (which is replacing dependency on the US with dependency on EU, a no go IMHO)

It is lighter/smaller than F-16 and iirc it's payload is 3 or 4 tons lesser than F-16.

And sanctions and roadblocks we face right now would be nothing compared to what would happen if we went with a Chinese plane, otherwise I'd much rather we go after FC-31 instead of F-16 or Eurofighter. But JF-17 is not an answer to any of our questions.

However, we do need an interim solution because we are at best a decade away from our own jets taking to the skies in meaningful numbers. Unlike you, I'd much rather deal with UK and get Eurofighters, if they are willing to do the leg work for us in taking care of any problems with the purchase. And I think they might be simply because they need partners, now that they fucked themselves by leaving the biggest economic zone on the planet.

 

[Heartbang]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

If it came to that kind of a solution I'd prefer it we do that with Flankers.

 

[Nutuk]

Well you know the EF is not only dealing with England, just saying.

 

[YeşilVatan]

If it came to that kind of a solution I'd prefer it we do that with Flankers.

Technically, yes. Politically, suicide move. Russia is the current great evil. Also, our geostrategic interests are conflicting.

Plus they bombed our soldiers.

 

[boredaf]

Well you know the EF is not only dealing with England, just saying.

That's why I said if they are willing to help us with that. Just about 10 days ago there was a meeting regarding Eurofighter among the defence ministers from countries in EF program and discussions was about upgrade to EF and exports. They might be more open to exports to bring the cost down and UK might be willing to help us with others since they need not only the money but also more trade partners of all kinds.

 

[boredaf]

If it came to that kind of a solution I'd prefer it we do that with Flankers.

Worst idea ever, not just because of Russia's current position in global stage but also because they are barely able to build enough plane for themselves. And I'd rather keep flying our F4's than trust their build quality.

 

[Quasar]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

our problem will be always the same for a while... American,Russian or Chinsese engine...

if engine was not a problem guess instead of JF 17 we may even come up with a Hürjet on steroid as a stop gap solution.

 

[Afif]

Whether it's f16 or EF you are not getting anything before 2027 and delivery will very well continue in to 2030s. So, in my opinion given the circumstances it is better to focus on KE and modernization of other F-16s blocks with ozgur.
Besides, this year you guys just lost 10 percent of your GDP due to earthquake. Right now you can't just pull billions of dollars out of the nowhere.

 

[UkroTurk]

Guys something else, suppose the US declines F16 sale how do you guys regard the Pakistani JF17?

A "Turkified" version of JF-17, with Aselsan radar, Aselpod, Ozgur mission computer, avionics, communications, self protection system and of course Turkish missiles and bombs?

Kinda like empty shell JF-17 with Turkish electronics and missiles.

Just give it a thought as stopgap until TFx in numbers

The Chinese can produce high-end electronics currently.

if purchase didn't make Türkiye leave NATO,as stopgap solution, I would go for turnkey J10C with adaptation of Turkish missiles/weapons.
Because adaptation of Turkish AESA radar, mission computer, avionics would take too long. Don't forget we have MMU project.

Turkey to Drop Plans For F-16s: Chinese J-10C Fighters Hinted as Choice to Modernise Fleet

A member of the Turkish Presidency’s Security and Foreign Policies Council, Cagri Erhan, has announced that the country is expected to drop its requests to acquire

militarywatchmagazine.com

F-16 jetleri için J-10C geliyor! Türkiye'den dengeleri alt üst edecek hamle... | STAR

Haberin detayları için tıklayınız

www.star.com.tr

J10c is superior then jf17.

 

[boredaf]

In the context of the latest discussion, you might like this radar scattering simulation comparison between F-35, Su-57 and J.20

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Russian or Chinese equipment should be out of question.
JF-17, don't know maybe as a last resort.
My choice for a stop gap would be FA-50 from Korea albeit could be subject to sanctions due to their GE engine.

 

[AzeriTank]

The Chinese can produce high-end electronics currently.

if purchase didn't make Türkiye leave NATO,as stopgap solution, I would go for turnkey J10C with adaptation of Turkish missiles/weapons.
Because adaptation of Turkish AESA radar, mission computer, avionics would take too long. Don't forget we have MMU project.

Turkey to Drop Plans For F-16s: Chinese J-10C Fighters Hinted as Choice to Modernise Fleet

A member of the Turkish Presidency’s Security and Foreign Policies Council, Cagri Erhan, has announced that the country is expected to drop its requests to acquire

militarywatchmagazine.com

F-16 jetleri için J-10C geliyor! Türkiye'den dengeleri alt üst edecek hamle... | STAR

Haberin detayları için tıklayınız

www.star.com.tr

J10c is superior then jf17.

i dont understand what stop gap you guys look for. Look at Iran, they dont have jets for years now but who could attack them? You could simply push the productions of Khan, cruise missiles and nobody would dare to attack you. simple as that, especially when you locally make air to air, air defence, cruise missiles, ballistic missiles, local mini submarine and so on..

 

[AzeriTank]

Look at s400. you payed 2.5 billion$ and it looks pointless after 5 years. hell knows how many project that money could push further. i could understand at that time as Turkey was not totally ready, but now, just go for TF 10000, kizilelma, TFX and so on. Also, Russia has the same engine technology Kizilelma use, so west wouldnt risk as it will push Turkey towards east blog. Sometimes you have to give up to gain something bigger and thats what Turkey needs to do now. i believe government also knows it. The whole f16 negotiation is just to show Turkish voters that they did their best to purchase and its the US found an excuse like in f35.

 

[Afif]

Look at s400. you payed 2.5 billion$ and it looks pointless after 5 years. hell knows how many project that money could push further. i could understand at that time as Turkey was not totally ready, but now, just go for TF 10000, kizilelma, TFX and so on. Also, Russia has the same engine technology Kizilelma use, so west wouldnt risk as it will push Turkey towards east blog. Sometimes you have to give up to gain something bigger and thats what Turkey needs to do now. i believe government also knows it. The whole f16 negotiation is just to show Turkish voters that they did their best to purchase and its the US found an excuse like in f35.

Only 1.2 billions package has been implemented. Looks like Turkey is never going to buy the second batch.

 

[Manomed The Second]

Look at s400. you payed 2.5 billion$ and it looks pointless after 5 years. hell knows how many project that money could push further. i could understand at that time as Turkey was not totally ready, but now, just go for TF 10000, kizilelma, TFX and so on. Also, Russia has the same engine technology Kizilelma use, so west wouldnt risk as it will push Turkey towards east blog. Sometimes you have to give up to gain something bigger and thats what Turkey needs to do now. i believe government also knows it. The whole f16 negotiation is just to show Turkish voters that they did their best to purchase and its the US found an excuse like in f35.

Goverment crippled our ability to modernize the air force with their useless S400 purchase. we are looking for 10 maybe 15 years to see fully fledged MMU a jet thats not even entered serial production and we don't know how it will perform.

We are betting everything on MMU and that is not good not good at all I've seen people here saying Its better than F22 or F35 these jets are proven in combat and are in serial production we should not kid ourselves

 

[Manomed The Second]

Also why are we even testing the aesa on akıncı It doesn't have sufficent power to test or use the radar Looks like a cheap pr for baykar again.

C-295 is a better contender to use for AESA testing not some drone with insufficent power supply.