TR Turkish Air Forces|News & Discussion

[BalkanTurk90]

According to information received by @TurDef, Regardless of 40 F16V + 79 F16V upgrade kit purchase, Turkiye will purchase Eurofighter jets from UK.

Thats just what i post above
Than better to cancel 40 new f16 of US cos will take alot of time to produce and jusy go ahead with upgrade and 80 Eurofighters

 

[Fighter_35]

According to information received by @TurDef, Regardless of 40 F16V + 79 F16V upgrade kit purchase, Turkiye will purchase Eurofighter jets from UK.

This is what İbrahim sünnetçi means in the below tweet as an answer to someone saying ahh that would be good to have Euro fighter typhoon after getting news of f-16s.bad news we will not have typhoons most probably.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580110881236865024

 

[Lool]

According to information received by @TurDef, Regardless of 40 F16V + 79 F16V upgrade kit purchase, Turkiye will purchase Eurofighter jets from UK.

If such news is true, then that is good

Erdogan seems to be learning from his previous mistake of depending way too heavily on one nation

 

[godel44]

Turkiye is planning to create a similar F16/F4 duo fighter/bomber fleet with F16V/Eurofighter and in this way, total dependence on the US source and congress approvals will be avoided and the capabilities of a twin-engine delta wing plane will be utilized.

According to @DefenceTurkey, Turkiye is negotiating and UK is offering 20 Eurofighter Tranche-1 second hand with source codes + 60 Tranche-3/4 brand-new fighters + TEMPEST cooperation. If it happens, an enormous fleet structure will be created until TFX reach full operational capabilities by 2035-2040

You had me at Tempest cooperation. Normally I would not want Eurofighters on top of the F-16V deal and Ozgur, but Tempest cooperation on its own would make that deal worthy. I just hope if this happens, MMU program doesn't suffer.

 

[Heartbang]

You had me at Tempest cooperation.

hope it doesnt end up like the JSF program (aka F-35)

 

[dBSPL]

This is what İbrahim sünnetçi means in the below tweet as an answer to someone saying ahh that would be good to have Euro fighter typhoon after getting news of f-16s.bad news we will not have typhoons most probably.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580110881236865024

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1578115940268507138

If the mission computers of T1s (and if T2s are included in this second purchase package) will be fully opened to TAF, may create an important opportunity that will invalidate many previous assessments on this subject. As it is known, at the beginning of the EF project, the consortium offered important opportunities to Turkish companies in a participation plan of 120 aircraft and full access to the source codes was offered. We were not involved in the production of these jets, but it may be an interesting coincidence to acquire these aircrafts with full authorization after decades.

Most important part is that the ready supply from the RAF inventory and being included in the T4' order book will showing where UK-TR relations evolve. Establishing a maintenance, overhaul and spare parts center for the EJ-200 surely will reinforce RR's priority position in the ongoing jet projects in Turkiye, the presence of UK companies within the MMU project will become stronger, and even Turkish companies may participate in Team Tempest. This strategic cooperation in aviation will inevitably contribute to the parallelization of the foreign policies of the countries.

 

[Nilgiri]

You had me at Tempest cooperation. Normally I would not want Eurofighters on top of the F-16V deal and Ozgur, but Tempest cooperation on its own would make that deal worthy. I just hope if this happens, MMU program doesn't suffer.

Why would MMU suffer. Tempest cooperation would offer a sound pathway to develop and implement next iterations of MMU in 6th gen.

 

[Afif]

Why would MMU suffer. Tempest cooperation would offer a sound pathway to develop and implement next iterations of MMU in 6th gen.

But now it is not possible to merge the MMU in tempset at this stage. It is already in the production.
And also there is serious doubt if rolls royce will give the next gen engine's IP rights to turkey. Or BAE system will give the tempset's source codes.
It is better for turkey to go on its own. And if it can develop a fifth gen fighter now on its own, why not a sixth gen two decades later ? May be turkey will need some funding partners to bear the cost but the technological development will be possible indigenously within turkey.

 

[godel44]

Why would MMU suffer. Tempest cooperation would offer a sound pathway to develop and implement next iterations of MMU in 6th gen.

Indeed it would present a great opportunity to gain know-how. That is why I view the deal so positively. But it would also be a resource drain and a temptation to cancel the MMU project and continue with Tempest, which itself may not materialize until too late due to the UK having F-35s and not being in a hurry.

 

[I_Love_F16]

a temptation to cancel the MMU project

I don’t think they will cancel the project with MMU currently being at an advanced stage. In fact it will pave the way for future 6th Gen functionality into the MMU.

 

[Cypro]

When Greece ordered Rafales 2 years ago, this exact scenario was on my mind, Viper upgrade, additional Vipers and Eurofighter for Superiority role until MMU matures (which will take another 10-15 years) then only missing thing will be F35Bs for navy..

But:
"The United States Department of State approves the Typhoon sale, required because of a certain technology governed by the ITAR process which was incorporated into the MIDS of the Eurofighter"

"German arms sanctions implemented in November 2018 in response to the assassination of Jamal Khashoggi prevented UK - Saudi Arabia Eurofighter deal."

 

[Nilgiri]

But now it is not possible to merge the MMU in tempset at this stage. It is already in the production. And also there is serious doubt if rolls royce will give the next gen engine's IP rights to turkey. Or BAE system will give the tempset's source codes. It is better for turkey to go on its own. And if it can develop a fifth gen fighter now on its own, why not a sixth gen two decades later ? May be turkey will need some funding partners to bear the cost but the technological development will be possible indigenously within turkey.

Once bitten twice shy, I think TR has learned from this and will incorporate its approach suitably.

To me MMU is larger ecosystem (to take forward, maybe the name will alter later) and TF-X is the specific 5th generation fruit within it.

i.e MMU is larger and there are lot of areas to cooperate with a sound capable partner for 6th generation evolution (And any potential backworking into 5th gen once you get there)....past whatever the partner wants to leave out of it once you set up cooperation terms very securely.

These will be hedged and organised suitably by those in the know in TR without too much risky macro-committal (with the hindsight of F-35).

You can be as transactional as possible on matters (companies do this all the time) from the get go.... without leaving too much to a grey trust buffer that opens up potential for broken promise and abuse later from more political realm...just like TR has experienced already.

If technological pathway is hypothetically secured for 6th gen in TR (it isn't, these are very early days and there are a great deal of many conceptual things in their infancy), cost-sharing is no where near a priority to focus on right now...it is simply way to early to get into that.

 

[Boz]

He now wants pinky promises. Clown show.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580319046196613120

 

[Nilgiri]

Indeed it would present a great opportunity to gain know-how. That is why I view the deal so positively. But it would also be a resource drain and a temptation to cancel the MMU project and continue with Tempest, which itself may not materialize until too late due to the UK having F-35s and not being in a hurry.

TR I feel can organise and hedge this properly. Simply has to soundly know where it stands and cost/benefit ratio of (local RnD versus foreign cooperation) various items of difference (between 5th and 6th gen).

These have to be worked out and you need the right set of people to work them out of course. "Tempest cooperation" is just very vague term for now....it can take a multitude of forms compared to what F-35 panned out to be with too much grey trust + money-invested first. There is no reason why TR has to just do that approach and hope for different result. Lessons can simply be incorporated instead this time.

 

[Boz]

I do wish Fidel Castro purged this piece of shit and his family.

If USA allows its foreign policy to be dictated by Ethnic groups.

No wonder they are in decline.

Empty rhetoric. He gotta give some brownie points for all the groupies in Greece (and Armenia) after the Senate dropped the amendments, that news dropped like a bombshell in Greece.

The deal will go through, with him or without him. Hell, most likely they are not going to keep the Senate come the midterms.

 

[Ryder]

He now wants pinky promises. Clown show.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580319046196613120

Tell this piece of shit whats the use of having military hardware if its not used to defend interests and fight off terrorists?

Should these planes be used in a fcking museum?

We need the MMU artik seriously we need it now!!

 

[dBSPL]

He now wants pinky promises. Clown show.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580319046196613120

We trust Menendez, who built a political career with Armenian diaspora funds and was eventually given a woman as a gift. He is our biggest assurance on the way to EF.

But on the other hand, Senator Graham offered Erdogan almost a guarantee. Graham's role in Republican party and national security politics is another debate, but more importantly, this man is a South Carolina senator. In other words, the state where the Greenville facilities, (where the F-16s are producing) are located.

We always tend to read the issue with Turkiye's disputes and the activities of the lobbies that use it. However, I would like to remind you again that there is the other side of the coin. At least 40 new built jets and at least 80 Viper modernization kits are not a sale to be underestimated. Especially when the US economy is rapidly drifting into recession decades later. The issue that senators should think about is not just employment and company profitabilities, but also the possible regional consequences(East-Europe, Caucasus, Middle East, Eastern Mediterranean) of breaking the ties with Turkiye completely, despite all kinds of disagreements.

My personal opinion is that the USA will continue to stall this issue as much as possible and push it beyond the elections. In the same period, it will further strengthen its military build-up on Greece and an attempt will be made to create a fait accompli. To take this trump card from the USA, we need to take an unexpected step.

 

[Cenkcnk]

Menendez is a corrupt politician. He gets paid by lobbies. There are many news on internet about this.
He married an Armenian woman also. So there is no way he would defend USA interests at all

 

[Yasar_TR]

ABD'nin F-16 kararı senatoyu karıştırdı: 'Veto edeceğiz'

ABD'de New Jersey Senatörü Bob Menendez ve Maryland Senatörü Chris van Hollen’ın sunduğu ve Türkiye’ye F-16 satışını sınırlandırıcı koşullara bağlayan eklemeler önceki gün kaldırılırken, durum senatoda krize yol açtı. Tasarının fikir babası Menendez, Türkiye'ye satışı veto edeceğini açıkladı.

www.sozcu.com.tr

Unfortunately Menendez has the power to veto this sale. So without him on Turkish side the sale of F16 package is a nonstarter.
We should immediately purchase 20-40 Typhoons from UK and place an order for 60 new T4 Typhoons with an option for a further 20-40.
Let USA sort out their internal politics themselves.
The Ozgur modernisation should gain momentum immediately in line with this and block 40 planes should also be included in the modernisation, in a move to show we mean business. Our only stumbling block at the moment is the Aselsan’s Aesa radar. They have been moving the goalpost for delivery on that for too long now. They need to get a move on!

 

[Cypro]

This guy is the NR1 enemy of Turks, he will do whatever he can. Greek and Armenian combined behind him

"The Senator met with Nikos Anastasiadis where the latter honored him with the Grand Cross of the Order of Makarios III. The couple had moved to Athens before visiting Cyprus. The 54-year-old businesswoman accompanied the chairman of the Senate Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee to the Athens city hall where the mayor Kostas Bakoyannis awarded him the Medal of the City of Athens.

A love story

" I didn't know he was a senator. He was very intelligent and had a great sense of humor," she had characteristically said, referring to their acquaintance as emphasized by the New York Times. For his part, the American senator had stated that she was " beautiful and bright and had such a great personality. There was just that aura about her."

After years they met again and started dating. "Bob told me that I'll know when he's going to propose because of a certain song he's going to sing when the time comes," the 54-year-old businesswoman said, according to the New York Times.


"Will you marry me" , the senator asked her. Nadine Arsalian with tears in his eyes answered in the affirmative and then Robert Menendez took out a ring and told her that "if you keep crying I won't be able to wear it" . Immediately after that he kissed her while the people who watched this particular scene burst into applause. The couple got married on October 3, 2020. It should be noted that the New York Times included this particular marriage proposal in their " favorite " stories.