TR Turkiye's F-35 Project and Discussions

[TR_123456]

I wasn't thinking of fighterjets, but more like armaments, ammo, bombs and such. It would be suicide to try buy anything but US jets, and such.

Germany,France,UK under the table.

I never said anything about Israel needing 4th og 4,5 gen. It's for EU and Türkiye mostly as well as other countries that can't immediately buy 5th gen.

This is what happens when we start replying to several different things in one post

Bro,this your post 895,


''It doesn't change the fact that in this high tech era, it's necessary to have a fighter jet that can perform crucial tasks without being interrupted. Also it's become important for countries to diversify their defence procurement.

Israel is most definitely going to diversify and has been working steadily towards fostering relations with countries that has production power and can supply Israel in case the US gives it the cold shoulder. India, China, (Russia), and most likely UAE from backdoors. And most likely some EU countries as well.

I believe F16 V, and EF T3-4 could very well be the fallback solutions.''


My answer was to this.

 

[guest12]

UK joined killswitch bandwagon too , they reallly pissed about Trump's Pro-Putin decisions.

F-35 ‘kill switch’ could allow Trump to disable European air force

Germany fears US president could u-turn on multi-billion-dollar arms deal after decisions on Ukraine

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[Huelague]

If everyone is afraid about an F35 kill switch than it is something more than speculation.

As I wrote before, if US can cut of a targeting system on a missile. What do you think, which capabilities they have on a strategic weapon like a F-35.

 

[Kaan Azman]

Well, as a person in the community that I respect once said "The world is becoming a one big Turkiye"

We are witnessing the subjects from 4-5 years ago brought up in European countries regarding F-35, and this honestly makes me think silently at this point.

and oh, India's S-400 is the cherry on the cake I guess, some tried to lynch me when I said that S-400 is not the real reason back in the day

Europe wants to act more independently from the US and is taking its steps and now trust issues have flared up, ring any bells?

If you ask me, I don't support being a part of the EU military but I view this situation as a chance to form a solidarity in military industry which will be beneficial for everyone. They have been asleep despite their vast resources while we have been scraping around with significantly less. Our will and their resources, it could be something to shoo the US influence. This is what Spain and Italy see and why they are eager for cooperation. Let's see who else boards the train.

 

[hugh]

The idea of a software defined kill-switch has always seemed dumb to me. If you "put" that on the jets, no amount of security will be able to protect you 100% from your adversaries' cyber-attacks. They would pluck your jets out of the sky at the click of a few buttons. Why would you take such risks when you could ground the aircrafts just by not supplying certain parts? I don't understand why people keep fixating on a supposed kill switch but not on safety of the supply-chain, which is certain and would ground your fleet in a few months at most.

And who would buy any American weapon once they pushed that "kill-switch"? It would literally be pushing the kill-switch of their defence export.

 

[Huelague]

Why would you take such risks when you could ground the aircrafts just by not supplying certain parts?

The answer is very easy. It’s all about timing. You can wait until the jets need spare parts, which could take times (weeks, months or years). Or you can do it immediately by the „backdoor“. Where only you have the access.

 

[Yasar_TR]

All off topic posts have been moved to

Israel apartheid consequences for the colonial state and geopolitics

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20220111-israels-apartheid-should-have-consequences-for-the-colonial-state/ Israel's apartheid should have consequences for the colonial state January 11, 2022 at 12:23 pm | Published in: Blog, Blogs - Politics, Israel, Middle East, Opinion A participant...

defencehub.live

 

[Rooxbar]

For anyone who knows who Justin Bronk is, this is the last thing you need to hear about kill switches:

 

[Iskander]

Following Portugal, Canada is also considering abandoning American fighters

The new head of the Canadian government, Mark Carney, has ordered a review of the country's contract with the American defense corporation Lockheed Martin for the supply of F-35 fighters. This was reported by the Bloomberg agency, citing a representative of the country's Ministry of Defense. According to him, a few hours after taking office, he instructed the Minister of National Defense William Blair to review the contract and determine "whether it is the best investment for Canada in its current form, and whether there are other options that could better meet Canada's needs." According to the agency, Carney's decision was "a new twist in the dispute between the two countries" after US President Donald Trump imposed customs duties on Canadian imports in early March.
According to Bloomberg, Lockheed Martin won the tender for the supply of F-35s in 2023, beating out the American aircraft manufacturer Boeing and the Swedish concern Saab. The deal involved the delivery of 88 fighter jets to Canada for a total of C$19 billion (US$13.2 billion).

Focus: What Could Be the Option for Canada to Replace F-35 Fighter Jet Acquisition After Political Tensions with US?

Focus: What Could Be the Option for Canada to Replace F-35 Fighter Jet Acquisition After Political Tensions with US?

armyrecognition.com

 

[Huelague]

For anyone who knows who Justin Bronk is, this is the last thing you need to hear about kill switches:

Interesting is the Jewish software on F-35.

 

[Turkic]

For anyone who knows who Justin Bronk is, this is the last thing you need to hear about kill switches:

I don't know who he is and I will try to drop a neutral comment for his statements.

What he says is the F-35's can't be taken off by a so called "kill-switch" but if you pay attention to the way he says, the meaning will particularly change. He states that the F-35's can't be grounded immediately by such a system/code. But this doesn't answer the question. Can the so called "kill-switch" limit the capabilities of the aircraft and if yes, how limitations we're talking about ?

Most aircrafts can operate with their computers off other than the flight computer and those other computers can be switched off manually by the pilot for emergencies like the B737 Max incidents. I don't know if the F-35's advanced computer and softwares prevents it but I never thought the kill-switch as something directly kills all systems of the aircrafts. So hearing that it can't be, did not change anything to me.

Again, I don't know who this guy is but your saying shows he is a reliable one. Hearing puns from a reliable person brings more question marks to my paper instead of answering them.

 

[Nutuk]

You just have to look what ALIS is. Taken from open source internet:
"ALIS receives Health Reporting Codes while the F-35 is still in flight via an radio frequency downlink."


Now if an aircraft can downlink data, it can also uplink data. Just think what Israel could do with stuxnet and the pagers.

You can manipulate operations of an aircraft if you can uplink instructions, that simple.

You do not need a physical on / off button as "Kill switch", a few codes can do the job. US does not allow partners to have a peek into the computer, they do not even allow to do maintenance to certain areas of the aircraft. Something that remains a "black box" is a reliability risk. One and one makes two!

 

[mohammadtd]

You just have to look what ALIS is. Taken from open source internet:
"ALIS receives Health Reporting Codes while the F-35 is still in flight via an radio frequency downlink."


Now if an aircraft can downlink data, it can also uplink data. Just think what Israel could do with stuxnet and the pagers.

You can manipulate operations of an aircraft if you can uplink instructions, that simple.

You do not need a physical on / off button as "Kill switch", a few codes can do the job. US does not allow partners to have a peek into the computer, they do not even allow to do maintenance to certain areas of the aircraft. Something that remains a "black box" is a reliability risk. One and one makes two!

Why country like Turkey wanted to buy F35 then?

 

[Sanchez]

Why country like Turkey wanted to buy F35 then?

Because it is simply the most capable fighter aircraft on offer in existence.

 

[Nutuk]

Why country like Turkey wanted to buy F35 then?

Technology transfer.

The time we've produced F35 parts we did improve our machine parks, we did produce at high quality level. We did apply composite structures.

Our experiences in building F16's and F35 sections brought us the technology to develop Kaan. These knowledges don't fall from the sky.

 

[mTT]

Turkey wants to rejoin the F-35 programme

In his telephone conversation with US President Donald Trump, President Erdoğan stated that steps are expected from the US in the new period in the fight against terrorism with an understanding that respects Turkey's interests, and that in order to improve the cooperation of the two countries in the field of defence industry, it is necessary to end CAATSA sanctions, finalise the F-16 procurement process and finalise the issues of Turkey's re-accession to the F-35 programme.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1901273626348777753

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1901272258695348730

 

[Khagan1923]

Soo, how fast do we think yandas "reporters" and "experts" who have trashed the F-35 for the last 7 years will now turn around and hail it as the best aircraft in the world?

 

[Nutuk]

It is a good aircraft, that is not the problem.

The problem is the US control. What if the US turns it unusable at a time we are at war?

The enemy would not even have to take any effort to cope with your air force.

Now some of you would say, why would our "ally" US do such. What if the enemy is Israel? (just a hypothetic question)

It is never wise to put your fate into the hands of others, even if it is an ally

 

[Sanchez]

Turkey wants to rejoin the F-35 programme

In his telephone conversation with US President Donald Trump, President Erdoğan stated that steps are expected from the US in the new period in the fight against terrorism with an understanding that respects Turkey's interests, and that in order to improve the cooperation of the two countries in the field of defence industry, it is necessary to end CAATSA sanctions, finalise the F-16 procurement process and finalise the issues of Turkey's re-accession to the F-35 programme.

This is nothing new and is the Turkish position for years, but still.

F-35 might be problematic for a country that would only operate one type, like say Denmark, but not for us. For us, there's only the positives, in a world where HvKK operates F-16 Özgürs, Vipers, Eurofighters, Kaans and F-35s. It would also make us the largest and most capable air force in our region, easily.

F-35 brings unmatched capability. Kaan for example isn't planned to have the same level of sensor fusion F-35 has.

Using F-35 makes it easier to implement designing, building and operating advanced fighter aircraft, as we've seen in the case of building Kaan.

And operating F-35 means we would have more options on how to fight against another F-35s as we would know its capabilities first hand.

Very simple...

Moreso regardless, Eurofighter procurement must continue as planned. We must never again be stuck with one supplier. A HvKK with 40 F-35s, 40 Eurofighters and 40 Kaans by 2035 would make it the prime air force in the region.

 

[TheInsider]

We should buy 40 F-35s instead of 40 F-16s if possible.