TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

[Yasar_TR]

This uav thing is going great but I feel very anxious about Greece's new generation of jet fighters. They literally sold their future(that was already sold) to possess the air superiority against Turkey.
I hope they dont try sth stupid in Aegean sea or Cyprus. It seems like they laid all theur bets on Mediterranian natural gas. J wonder how much can it help Greece so that they do this much for it.

First of all you need to look at the capabilities of the TuAF with respect to web based warfare. So Rafale and V70 modernised f16 have Aesa radars. They can see our planes before our planes see them. But we have “Baris Kartali” (peace eagle) planes way back in mainland that can see all those planes before they can see our fighter planes. While our fighters are passive with radars off, our peace eagles lock on to those V70 and Rafale planes and let the TuAF f16’s fire their amraam missiles. Missiles are guided by the peace eagle planes. Now this capability is not present in the Greek Airforce.
Then of course there is the matter of airspace over the Aegean. By 2022 with all of hisars A+, O+ and U in service with the S400 missile systems creating a layered air-defence, the airspace over the Aegean becomes a no fly zone to Greek Airforce.
Thirdly there is the matter of “Ozgur” project and Aselsan Aesa radar. Once this is implemented you will find that with a lot more modules on our GaN based Radar it has more than 30 km advantage over the an/apg83 radar of f16V70 which in itself is a better radar than the RBE2 radar on Rafale.
So keep cool!

APG68 is the current radar we have on our f16’s.
APG83 is the Aesa radar V70 modernised f16 has
APG80 is the Aesa radar that is used on regular block 60 f16
our Aesa radar is expected to surpass all these.

 

[AzeriTank]

That is how it works. Yes. But in reality; destroying an airbase is not that straight forward. You could bomb the runways to make them unusable. But they are usually quickly repaired. Usually within hours. (US and Allies bombed Syrian base. Next day it was back in business)
There are special munitions that is peculiar to this sort of attack. These can be runway penetration bombs or submunitions that have delayed action to make it difficult to mend runways.
The other way to attack, is to target the bunkers protecting the aircrafts. There is also the enemy Air-Defence systems you have to overcome to allow your missile to reach their targets.
Yes there are certain motorways and highways that are designated as replacement runways. But you have to bring logistic support to these locations in order to service modern jets.
It is easy to say “we will bomb their bases so that they will not have a runway to land on.” But reality is different. But it is not impossible!

With Ballistic missile's kinetic energy, you are able to destroy any hangar.. also, lets say their jets are back from mission, how will they land if the airbases are bomb? so they need to keep additional fuel just in case, which will lower their capabilities again...
Also, just recently, Armenian general accepted that those 2 Iskender missiles they fired, actually landed on Armenian forces near Shusha.. ))) so keeping Armenian at the same basket with Turkish capabilities? Come onnnn, are you serious????

 

[AzeriTank]

If the annual production rate is 46 TB2's then Baykar could've produced more than 180 TB2's by now.
View attachment 12962

imagine Turkey will be able to make 2 AKinji and 3 MIUS every month just by Bayraktar, add Gokdogan missiles, plus TAI projects.. if there is no war net 2-3 years, There would be no way to stop Turkey militarily.. I think its already late... especially with new Submarines and air defense missilse...
only way left is economy like they did to USSR.. but doing it also means falling eonomy for EU.. i dont think they agree to that. also Turkey able to make chaos in EU, they would loose the most, so i dont think it will happen openly like we all think. the question is then how?

 

[Yasar_TR]

With Ballistic missile's kinetic energy, you are able to destroy any hangar.. also, lets say their jets are back from mission, how will they land if the airbases are bomb? so they need to keep additional fuel just in case, which will lower their capabilities again...
Also, just recently, Armenian general accepted that those 2 Iskender missiles they fired, actually landed on Armenian forces near Shusha.. ))) so keeping Armenian at the same basket with Turkish capabilities? Come onnnn, are you serious????

We are not talking about Armenian capabilities. We are talking about a military like Greece or like Turkey. Bombing of logistic centres, refuelling depots, is more productive than just bombing the runways. Besides I don’t understand what you are “come onnn” ing about. Have you read what I have written properly and understood it? Armenian tech is dated and waaay beyond Turkish capabilities. We are talking about military force furnished with modern technology. But even that would find it difficult to completely destroy an airfield as we have seen in Syria. Over 100 very accurate tomahawk and scalp missiles were thrown at the base. It still survived. It is not as straight forward as you make it out to be. Normal ballistic missiles have large CEP values. Turkish and Israeli SRBM’s can hit their targets with pinpoint accuracy. But even that is not enough to completely destroy a runway or airbase. Runways can be repaired within hours of an attack.
Please read what I have written properly!

 

[adenl]

But even that would find it difficult to completely destroy an airfield as we have seen in Syria. Over 100 very accurate tomahawk and scalp missiles were thrown at the base. It still survived. It is not as straight forward as you make it out to be.

It is not the goal to destroy an enemy air base 'completely' (what constitutes completely anyway?), but to render it inoperable for the longest time possible. The most effective way to do this is by targeting the fighter aircraft themselves, either parked in the open or in shelters. This severely degrades the enemy's aerial fighting capability. Extend this to all of the enemy airbases which house fighter aircraft and you have basically secured air-supremacy.
Turkey has this capability vis-a-vis Greece with Bora ballistic missiles and SOM. Turkey has enough of these munitions to theoretically destroy the entire Greek fighter inventory multiple times. The Bora and SOM-B2 have enough kinetic energy to penetrate the standard HAS and SOM-A can blast though the doors of a HAS.

You are confusing the 7th april 2017 Shayrat missile strike with the 18th of April 2018 missile strike on research- and chemical centers. During the attack on Shayrat airbase, 59 Tomahawks were launched of which 58 Tomahawks hit their target. Up to 20% of the SyAAF operational aircraft where destroyed and it lost the ability to refuel and rearm. Yes flights resumed afterwards because the run- and taxiways where not targeted. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Shayrat_missile_strike

With up-to date intel of enemy fighter aircraft positions, a mass first strike using ballistic and/or cruise missiles on these positions will severely degrade the fighting capability of the enemy. No matter how much realistically speaking the Greeks can get Rafales and F-35's, these aircraft need bases to operate from which are easily targeted.

 

[Yasar_TR]

It is not the goal to destroy an enemy air base 'completely' (what constitutes completely anyway?), but to render it inoperable for the longest time possible. The most effective way to do this is by targeting the fighter aircraft themselves, either parked in the open or in shelters. This severely degrades the enemy's aerial fighting capability. Extend this to all of the enemy airbases which house fighter aircraft and you have basically secured air-supremacy.
Turkey has this capability vis-a-vis Greece with Bora ballistic missiles and SOM. Turkey has enough of these munitions to theoretically destroy the entire Greek fighter inventory multiple times. The Bora and SOM-B2 have enough kinetic energy to penetrate the standard HAS and SOM-A can blast though the doors of a HAS.

You are confusing the 7th april 2017 Shayrat missile strike with the 18th of April 2018 missile strike on research- and chemical centers. During the attack on Shayrat airbase, 59 Tomahawks were launched of which 58 Tomahawks hit their target. Up to 20% of the SyAAF operational aircraft where destroyed and it lost the ability to refuel and rearm. Yes flights resumed afterwards because the run- and taxiways where not targeted. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Shayrat_missile_strike

With up-to date intel of enemy fighter aircraft positions, a mass first strike using ballistic and/or cruise missiles on these positions will severely degrade the fighting capability of the enemy. No matter how much realistically speaking the Greeks can get Rafales and F-35's, these aircraft need bases to operate from which are easily targeted.

Total destruction or completely destroying an airbase can only occur if you nuke it. Otherwise there will still be enemy assets no matter how much bombing you do. The idea is to bomb the right positions to destroy the enemy’s core fighting force to make them lose air superiority. What you are suggesting is going to do exactly that.
The air attack I was thinking about was the 2018 strike with US, UK and French missiles. There were 105 missiles fired. But you are right the Shayrat airbase attack was done with 59 US tomahawks. I got them mixed up.
If Greeks try a preemptive strike they will have a portion of their airforce on air. I agree that best way is to target aircrafts on the ground. But also if the runways are loitered with delayed action bombs and damaged so that the airborne planes have nowhere to land; then this too will be a great way to destroy their planes.
I know that there is 500+ SOM on order. Bora as you say are very accurate missiles. They too will devastate Greek air bases.
All their airbases are within our firing range. For the islands closer to us we don’t need to use Bora. Trg300 will do the job as well.

 

[Ardabas34]

Total destruction or completely destroying an airbase can only occur if you nuke it. Otherwise there will still be enemy assets no matter how much bombing you do. The idea is to bomb the right positions to destroy the enemy’s core fighting force to make them lose air superiority. What you are suggesting is going to do exactly that.
The air attack I was thinking about was the 2018 strike with US, UK and French missiles. There were 105 missiles fired. But you are right the Shayrat airbase attack was done with 59 US tomahawks. I got them mixed up.
If Greeks try a preemptive strike they will have a portion of their airforce on air. I agree that best way is to target aircrafts on the ground. But also if the runways are loitered with delayed action bombs and damaged so that the airborne planes have nowhere to land; then this too will be a great way to destroy their planes.
I know that there is 500+ SOM on order. Bora as you say are very accurate missiles. They too will devastate Greek air bases.
All their airbases are within our firing range. For the islands closer to us we don’t need to use Bora. Trg300 will do the job as well.

The problem is Greece is going for a total modernisation including their entire arsenal. So they may get the same capability soon. Ofc I think any smart person must have understood by this point it isnt actually Greece we are dealing here.
Just like how in Turkish War of Salvation we were actually dealing with British under Greek mask same applies for today. We actually deal with France, US and Israel this time. The list may expand further in the future for other EU countries. Thank god we have Germany on our side at least for now. We also have Italy but only partly, they arent to be trusted a bit. Our interests only allign for Libya and thats it. If pressure only rises a bit, they will also turn on us without doubt and the pressure will rise.

Remember: What Greece does, serves to entire EU and even US. Of course they would want an already buried to debts, dependent, totally controllable, small Greece over a strong, independent, large Turkey to control the newly found natural gas of the Mediterranian Sea.

This will end Russian energy monopoly over Europe.

Greeks really could not afford a multi billion dolar modernisation project on their arsenal, impossible with that economy. Why would any bank give them debts? Who would think they actually can pay them in the future? They arent US, they cant just press dollars to get away.
So international banks are behind them, US is behind them, many EU countries are behind them.
They laid all their cards on an all out attempt for Mediterranian energy. They trust on that to save their country. They seem to be willing to do anything. If they feel strong they may even wage war(even try to free Mediterranian Sea).
Remember: if they fail they will be totally obliterated with all those debts as a nation. If they succeed it will cover all their economic troubles. Right now they along with Spain with their debts came to the position of destroying EU. This is why they are so maximalist. I indeed think that they can rise the tensions even to war if needed. It is their great great great grandchildrens future that is at stake.

Now you may think they will still be way behind Turkey militarily. True but if Israel, US and France join them it will be disasterous for us.
Of course right now this is a far fetched risk and I am just bringing the worst possibility ever on the table.
Dont forget, for the last few years an incredible demonification process has been happening against Turkey all over the media. You see those rascals on reddit. West has lost its virtues like freedom of speech and human rights and they are taking a very centralised, authoritarian stance. We must think as a great conspiring is being set against Turkey.

 

[Combat-Master]

Dawn and Night - TB2S training

 

[BordoEnes]

YALL KNEW ABOUT THIS?!

 

[King_West]

Akinci entered mass production

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1357285714443042816

Selçuk Bayraktar açıkladı! Türkiye'nin gururu Akıncı TİHA'da heyecanlandıran gelişme | STAR

Baykar Teknik Müdürü Selçuk Bayraktar, Akıncı TİHA'da seri üretime geçildiğinin müjdesini verdi. Bayraktar, Türkiye'de milli olarak geliştirilen hava-hava füzeleriyle donatılacak Akıncı'nın yakın zamanda teslim edileceğinin altını çizdi.

www.star.com.tr

 

[Fuzuli NL]

YALL KNEW ABOUT THIS?!

After TB2's crushing success during recent conflicts, especially Karbagh, it's very natural that we'd see clones and copies of them sprouting from everywhere.
The important thing is to keep developing and producing high-tech UAVs using experiences gained on the battlefield.

The TB2 is/has been a quick, safe, and effective sollution in Karabagh, Syria, Iraq, and Libya which drew some attention resulting in export deals with four countries so far and a few interested ones.

That in itself is a great achievement but since its in the limelight, it means that it's going to be copied and more importantly, counter measures are going to be developed against them sooner or later, and at some point we may witness an effective anti drone system for drones of this size.

 

[Ryder]

After TB2's crushing success during recent conflicts, especially Karbagh, it's very natural that we'd see clones and copies of them sprouting from everywhere.
The important thing is to keep developing and producing high-tech UAVs using experiences gained on the battlefield.

The TB2 is/has been a quick, safe, and effective sollution in Karabagh, Syria, Iraq, and Libya which drew some attention resulting in export deals with four countries so far and a few interested ones.

That in itself is a great achievement but since its in the limelight, it means that it's going to be copied and more importantly, counter measures are going to be developed against them sooner or later, and at some point we may witness an effective anti drone system for drones of this size.

Always be ahead of the competition never let your guard down.

 

[Yasar_TR]

TB2 has had great success against forces that did not have western tech at their disposal. Also it was used in a medium where there were no enemy jet fighters.
We need to focus on a stealthy jet UAV with supersonic speed. This will be the game changer against conventional western armies.
The grapevine is whispering something called Goksungur and smaller jet drones. This is the next stage and way forward as mentioned earlier by @Cabatli_53 !

 

[Yasar_TR]

Akinci entered mass production

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1357285714443042816

Selçuk Bayraktar açıkladı! Türkiye'nin gururu Akıncı TİHA'da heyecanlandıran gelişme | STAR

Baykar Teknik Müdürü Selçuk Bayraktar, Akıncı TİHA'da seri üretime geçildiğinin müjdesini verdi. Bayraktar, Türkiye'de milli olarak geliştirilen hava-hava füzeleriyle donatılacak Akıncı'nın yakın zamanda teslim edileceğinin altını çizdi.

www.star.com.tr

Do we know which version/versions are being produced? There were different engine configurations; 2 x 750HP engine version, 2 x 450 HP engine version and the 2 x PD220 version. They will all serve a different purpose. Also the much publicised Aesa radar for this UAV, I believe, is still not ready! Do we know when it will be available? I guess it will be on the most powerful engine configuration.
It would be interesting to see how this UAV will fare against many different obstacles it will be presented with, during the tests in the days to come.

 

[Tonyukuk]

Time for mass produced Akincis baby

 

[Zafer]

450hp and 220hp engines are available and the production should start with them. We do not know much about the ready status of the 750hp engine and it should be the last one to enter production. It may as well be prepared already. Baykar has been quick in making progress so there shouldn't be much waiting time anymore. However there are several variations for payloads too, so they should be rolling out in phases. I think the highest value EASA variant should be the last one to roll out.

 

[Blank1]

Dawn and Night - TB2S training
View attachment 13049 View attachment 13050

OH COME ON! Just 4 racks ? i was expecting at least 6.

 

[Fairon]

OH COME ON! Just 4 racks ? i was expecting at least 6.

Satcom upgrade most likely effected the payload. TB2 is very weight restricted.(naturally) When you add something, you must sacrifice something else.

 

[adenl]

450hp and 220hp engines are available and the production should start with them. We do not know much about the ready status of the 750hp engine and it should be the last one to enter production. It may as well be prepared already. Baykar has been quick in making progress so there shouldn't be much waiting time anymore. However there are several variations for payloads too, so they should be rolling out in phases. I think the highest value EASA variant should be the last one to roll out.

I think the AI-450C-2 is more ready than the TEI-PD-222.

OH COME ON! Just 4 racks ? i was expecting at least 6.

Perhaps the TB-3 will come with a larger payload capacity.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Perhaps the TB-3 will come with a larger payload capacity.

Otherwise there'd be no point in making it IMO.