TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

[Iskander]

I see that you should first know a few terms:

TOW = Take-off weight
MTOW = Maximum Take-off weight
PL = Payload
FOB = Fuel on Board
OEW = Operating Empty Weight
ZFW = Zero Fuel Weight
MZFW = Maximum Zero Fuel Weight

look easily :

View attachment 70578

OEW + PL +FOB = TOW

ZFW + FOB = TOW

MZFW - OEW = PL

ZWF must not be higher than MZFW before flight.
TOW must not be higher than MTOW before flight.

sorry very roughly so that everyone understands....


BAYKAR has measured and evaluated all its data on land. But data taken at sea will result in a new hull and wing design
and new landing gear, and other tires with different inflation dates.
If BAYKAR does not do this, then there is no operational safety.

It is also quite possible that BAYKAR does not think about landing ANADOLU. They see TB3 only as ammunition. Launch from the ship, landing on land. TB3s are then always added by logistics as building kits on the ship. Such construction kits will be always present on the ship???

TB3 would be able to start either way, with tricks for Turkish people. The thing will never be able to land on ANADOLU.

You are right, I have problems with the English language and especially with technical terms. And in general, I am not an aviation specialist.
Maybe that's why everything seems easier to me
Why did you decide that Bayraktar did not provide for TB3 to land on the deck? Strange.
Imagine that somewhere in the Indian Ocean TB3 takes off from the deck and after bombing, say, Australia or India
And so poor TB3 flies back to Turkey, covering... 10,000 km.
Can you imagine it?
I can't do this. Yes, this is impossible. Moreover, it is simply absurd.
So obviously, knowing technical aviation terms won't help you much

On TB3 the chassis is reinforced. The wings are 2 meters longer than those of the TB2, and the engine is more powerful.
What else don't you like?
Well, yes, after many takeoffs and landings (sorry ) on deck, some changes will probably have to be made.
But the fact that it will take off from the deck with the prescribed maximum load and return there - there cannot be two opinions on this matter.

 

[Anmdt]

TCG Anadolu is essentially and primarily an amphibious assault ship.
It can achieve it’s intended potential potential, without UAVs or UCAVs. It just needs navalised helicopters. It will also need, Unmanned Sea Vessels to improve its combat capabilities, now that we have them available.
If we can ever get our hands on a dozen f35Bs then it will jump to a totally different level. But that is another scenario.

Having TB3 operate from it’s deck will certainly make it even more capable and potent than what it already is today.

Bayraktar as a company and Selcuk Bayraktar as it’s owner, has got too much riding on this TB3 project to let it falter. He has already mentioned that on computer simulations they can land and take off with a TB3. So let the guy prove his words.
As per my previous posts on the matter, TB3 should have no difficulty in taking off from TCG Anadolu. It has a powerful engine. It has long enough wings to provide more lift. How much of the full payload it has to sacrifice, should be known to Baykar before they start the sea trials. But all will be tweaked further once sea trials start when they have to negotiate real life sea state conditions. One thing that TB3 has on it’s side, is the fact that it will have approximately 20+ knots extra take off speed due to Anadolu’ s own speed.
Problem is in the landing; and it is in two folds: First of all it has to stop within a 150m distance. Secondly it has to somehow prevent itself from damaging that big lift at the back of the ship.
There are some “mobile aircraft arresting systems” (MAAS) like the ones Curtis Wright manufacture, that can be of some use, not just for TB3 but for KE too; if their use on a sea platform is even at all possible, especially for stopping a 1.5 ton UCAV.

Curtiss-Wright EMS - Arresting Systems / ESCO - Mobile Arresting Systems

www.cw-ems.com

At the end of the day, proof of the pudding is in the eating. Sea trials are starting. We will shortly see if Selcuk Bayraktar’s statement was true or not.

There is a lot to improve on the go, we have no chance or oppurtunity to get an input from trained pilots or AC operator technicians.

Evidently the first protype has been through excessive stress levels (mechanically speaking) during the first ski-jump trials. They should be examining wings and patching remakes on PT-3/4. We have mininum of years before we can operate TB-3 carefree on Anadolu as we operate TB2, Anka, Akıncı on Land.

GA-ASI has a strong lead in here, it is not even a competition in my terms, all they need to do prove the CONOPS and integration. Those people have access to the resources that we may possibly may access versions as old as dating back to WWII or pre WWII.

Let's accept a fact guys, USN's annual carrier based flight time and landing - take off counts may surpass of what NATO do, in sum. From tip to toe, this provides an unmatching input, feedback and resources through people on field and through documentation.

Partly speaking based on real life experiences, some informatio is invaluable. That's why Baykar makes a new prototype to each iteration and maybe the one that goes actual ship based tests / qualification tests will be PT-4 or 5. Baykar does not worry to burn cash here since this project is promising, and like Mojave will be marketed to the countries who might be interested in unpaved runway operations.

 

[TheInsider]

Even if the TB-3 manages to take off and land on Anadolu, it will still be underpowered compared to the Mojave UAV. We need much more powerful turboprop engines.
View attachment 70612
View attachment 70613

No, the Combat load of naval TB3( Empty UAV+fuel+280kg payload=1450kg) is lighter than the useful payload capacity(1542kg) of Mojave UAV. Aerodynamic design of TB3 is far superior to Mohave. They are not in the same class. TB3 has a take-off /stall speed of ~70knots 20knots of which will be provided by TCG Anadolu itself. PD-222 will also be available for TB3. Anyway, you will see it with your own eyes soon.

 

[Quasar]

 

[Sanchez]

They are not in the same class.

Except they pretty much are. STOL UAVs. They will be competitors along with Sea Protector STOL. One being a much lighter model doesn't mean they wont compete.

I really wish Baykar came up with a turboprop TB2 or a single engine Akıncı.

 

[dBSPL]

Except they pretty much are. STOL UAVs. They will be competitors along with Sea Protector STOL. One being a much lighter model doesn't mean they wont compete.

I really wish Baykar came up with a turboprop TB2 or a single engine Akıncı.

While the tests of the TB-3 on the TCG Anadolu continue, I'm guessing a new family member of Bayraktar will be shared with the press, around end of 2025 or 26. A STOL naval aircraft with a take-off power of about 450+ shp. Baykar may start under-license production of this engine by then. So a sort of single-engine AKINCI. However, the airframe will probably similar to tactical blocks instead of AKINCI. 2 years ago, an illustration was published in the Ukrainian press, it could be something similar. Maybe Baykar will use the experience gained from the KE to do innovative work on maximum RCS optimization in turboprop MALE class.

 

[OPTIMUS]

No, the Combat load of naval TB3( Empty UAV+fuel+280kg payload=1450kg) is lighter than the useful payload capacity(1542kg) of Mojave UAV. Aerodynamic design of TB3 is far superior to Mohave. They are not in the same class. TB3 has a take-off /stall speed of ~70knots 20knots of which will be provided by TCG Anadolu itself. PD-222 will also be available for TB3. Anyway, you will see it with your own eyes soon.

You are writing things here that you have no idea about, although I have already written some terms explanatory. they still confuse terms. There is no combat load. See = page 626 No. 12513.

Correction step by step :

1) The term combatload does not exist.

2) empty flying object (here UAV) is also non-existent term. There isn't. Every flying object has an unusable amount of fuel. This fuel always stays in. If you start consuming this fuel, you risk Materilan and humans. So there is no empty plane, UAV etc... Apart from other liquids on the aircraft

3) Carrier ship does not help the flying object at its own speed. to be able to take planes off the deck more easily, driving faster means nothing. What counts is the wind speed and the amount that is taken under the wings. That's why the carrier ships turn against the wind. with their own speed, wind volume and wind speed are increased. Do you think Anadolu is a slingshot????

4) TB3 is aerodynamically very very behind the Mojave. Mohave wings are enlarged and equipped with "high-lift devices", including slats on the leading edge, double-slotted flaps and suspended ailerons.

im general: I have been observing wing constructions by Turkish engineers for a long time. my firm opinion is that their work is below standard. Very often they move in grey areas and this leads to faulty constructions like ANKA, HÜRKUS, AKSUNGUR and TB3. Thank God they have enough adhesive tape.

I have no negative rating on the wing design and construction of the AKINCI and TB2. Akinci wings in particular are well done

 

[TheInsider]

You are writing things here that you have no idea about, although I have already written some terms explanatory. they still confuse terms. There is no combat load. See = page 626 No. 12513.

Correction step by step :

1) The term combatload does not exist.

2) empty flying object (here UAV) is also non-existent term. There isn't. Every flying object has an unusable amount of fuel. This fuel always stays in. If you start consuming this fuel, you risk Materilan and humans. So there is no empty plane, UAV etc... Apart from other liquids on the aircraft

3) Carrier ship does not help the flying object at its own speed. to be able to take planes off the deck more easily, driving faster means nothing. What counts is the wind speed and the amount that is taken under the wings. That's why the carrier ships turn against the wind. with their own speed, wind volume and wind speed are increased. Do you think Anadolu is a slingshot????

4) TB3 is aerodynamically very very behind the Mojave. Mohave wings are enlarged and equipped with "high-lift devices", including slats on the leading edge, double-slotted flaps and suspended ailerons.

im general: I have been observing wing constructions by Turkish engineers for a long time. my firm opinion is that their work is below standard. Very often they move in grey areas and this leads to faulty constructions like ANKA, HÜRKUS, AKSUNGUR and TB3. Thank God they have enough adhesive tape.

I have no negative rating on the wing design and construction of the AKINCI and TB2. Akinci wings in particular are well done

The body of the Mohave doesn't produce lift, body of the TB3 produces lift. Mohave is an inferior design to TB3 because it is take-off/stall speed is higher compared to TB3 that is also why it needs a longer air strip to take off.
Empty weight and fuel load is a thing in aerospace. Learn your facts.
Speed of TCG Anadolu helps take-off learn Newtons laws.

 

[OPTIMUS]

The body of the Mohave doesn't produce lift, body of the TB3 produces lift. Mohave is an inferior design to TB3 because it is take-off/stall speed is higher compared to TB3 that is also why it needs a longer air strip to take off.
Empty weight and fuel load is a thing in aerospace. Learn your facts.
Speed of TCG Anadolu helps take-off learn Newtons laws.

sure?? As far as NEWTON LAWS are concerned; centrifugaldynamic, aerodynamic and hydrodynamic are different effects. What applies to one cannot apply to the other

Memories with Sener KOLTUK (R.I.P TAI testpilot.)

Dogfight on F16 => don't lose your energy. Height DOWN !!

Emergency at F 16 = > immediately lose energy, height UP !! FLAP 20° !!

As I said, Dynamic is not always the same. Always depending on the element ; where you are right now.

 

[Oublious]

tb2 still active duty in Ukraine, it being used for targeting and ISR missions. Much important then hitting tanks.

 

[somegoodusername]

tb2 still active duty in Ukraine, it being used for targeting and ISR missions. Much important then hitting tanks.

They are fulfilling the original purpose they were bought for. In addition to that, they humiliated Russian air defense systems, likely causing billions of dollars in export deals to fall through. Quite a treat for a small price of 4 million dollars.

Does anyone have the tweet of Ukrainians using MTS-B on TB-2?

 

[dBSPL]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1836390829868376090

There is an noteworthy detail about the targeted fleet structure between the lines of the article shared by Hayrani Öz hoca about the US (CCA-Collaborative Combat Aircraft) Program: Two CCA-Collaborative Combat Aircraft will accompany each of the 6th generation manned aircraft and the F35A. This means that roughly +1000 unmanned CCA aircraft will join the inventory.

These CCAs promise innovations that will maximize the tactical capabilities of air forces capable of collaborative use in network-centric warfare doctrines. 1 manned combat jet to 2 unmanned jets may become the accepted ratio in the future. From this point of view, some predictions can be made on the fleet structure of the Turkish Air Force in the future. In short, the total production numbers targeted for KE-1, KE-X, ANKA-3 and ANKA-X may be in the triple digits for each. And for smaller wingman UAVS, the production numbers may reach four digits.

Another conclusion to be drawn from this is that the development of unmanned systems will lead to a platform-based inventory expansion of the air forces in the coming period. Thousands of flying systems, large and small, and mostly unmanned, will be kept in active inventory. This situation makes the domestic production of propulsion systems, starting from small diameter and weight propulsion systems to more advanced and large turbofans, even more essential.

 

[Sanchez]

First short take off test from PT-3. See the canards being used to force the nose down.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1836437832048513366

First actual flight can't be too long now.

 

[Saithan]

Is that good or bad, that the cannards are being used to force the front landing gear down ?

Or is it being done just for this occasion ?

 

[Sanchez]

Is that good or bad, that the cannards are being used to force the front landing gear down ?

Or is it being done just for this occasion ?

Using canards as airbrakes is pretty normal. It's a bit more aggressive here because they didn't want it to get airborne any longer than it didn't need to.

 

[Ştutgart]

Bayraktar reddened the night red

 

[Strong AI]

Pods are fine and all but as said, its a third party solution to a greater issue. We'll still need a tailor made UAV for the role. And indeed, SAR pods seem too specialized and not enough in service.

Of course, but a solution is better than no solution. And a tailor made UAV probably will use SAR of MURAD AESA Radar.

 

[Strong AI]

Bullseye in the 12th sortie!

ANKA III, the hero of the sky, crowned its first shot with victory!

Our unmanned combat aircraft ANKA III, a marvel of national engineering and the pride of the Turkish defense industry, has successfully completed its first firing test.

The test conducted by ANKA III, equipped with an AF500 Electro-Optical camera (@aselsan), was carried out using the Teber-82 Guidance Kit developed by
@roketsan.

The superior performance of ANKA III in the tests is an indication that it will make a great contribution to our country's operational capabilities and defense capacity in the future.

We will continue to serve our rapidly developing defense industry day and night in the Turkish Century.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1837028345483034686

EDIT:

Aircraft Systems Integration of Air-Launched Weapons

From the earliest days of aviation where the pilot would drop simple bombs by hand, to the highly agile, stealthy aircraft of today that can deliver smart ordnance with extreme accuracy, engineers have striven to develop the capability to deliver weapons against targets reliably, safely and with...

books.google.com

 

[Kaan Azman]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1837067624108183991

TOLUN will be next, the most rhyming munition for ANKA-3 probably

 

[Strong AI]

Since Türkiye's twin-engine UCAVs (in development) will hit supersonic speeds, would it make sense to implement Divertless Supersonic inlet (DSI)?