TR UAV/UCAV Programs | Anka - series | Kızılelma | TB - series

[fushkee]

For aggressive manoeuvres, you have to have titanium structure in the aircraft. I don’t remember that KE has a titanium body structure.

 

[IC3M@N FX]

For more than a year, they’ve been tinkering with these config – but a Kızılelma with just a single engine makes no sense, especially with the one currently installed. Even a TF-10000 as a standalone engine wouldn’t make much of a difference.
From the very beginning, a twin-engine concept would have been the logical choice because thrust-to-weight ratio. After all, the drone is meant to serve both the land and naval forces – so why limit it in this way is beyond me.

It feels like a flying concrete block, you can tell that the drone is underpowered.

 

[Yasar_TR]

For more than a year, they’ve been tinkering with these config – but a Kızılelma with just a single engine makes no sense, especially with the one currently installed. Even a TF-10000 as a standalone engine wouldn’t make much of a difference.
From the very beginning, a twin-engine concept would have been the logical choice because thrust-to-weight ratio. After all, the drone is meant to serve both the land and naval forces – so why limit it in this way is beyond me.

I understand your dissatisfaction. But if we have to go by your logic then f404 on a heavy -14000kg- Gripen shouldn’t work either. Yet it can easily do +9g and -3g manoeuvres. Also flies at 2mach.
If the airframe is designed properly, KE with “composite” main structure and 5-6000lbf dry thrust and/or 9-10000lbf wet thrust engine, can do what we are all expecting from it. Increasing engine quantity will only facilitate longer range and more payload plus a bigger plane. Not necessarily its agility. In fact it can be the other way round. (F16 is more agile than f15).

 

[Zafer]

I think they want to expand maneuvering agility envelope incrementally, why risk a crash rushing testing.

 

[BalkanTurk90]

For more than a year, they’ve been tinkering with these config – but a Kızılelma with just a single engine makes no sense, especially with the one currently installed. Even a TF-10000 as a standalone engine wouldn’t make much of a difference.
From the very beginning, a twin-engine concept would have been the logical choice because thrust-to-weight ratio. After all, the drone is meant to serve both the land and naval forces – so why limit it in this way is beyond me.

It feels like a flying concrete block, you can tell that the drone is underpowered.

İ dont support drone with 2 engines , it will be too expensive and maintenance headache even f35 and f16 have 1 engine . Kizilelma just need more powerful engine and tf 10k is enough.
Aslo Kizilelma but aslo Anka 3 needs to be more steathy perhaps Anka 3 it is but at rear its not . We hear all kinds of test about kizilelma but never agaist a modern Radar. From how far can it be spotted ?
So basically Kizilelma needs stealth & more powerful engine with stealth design, or against powerful opponents it will be downed like a fly from the sky.

 

[MonteCarlo]

İ dont support drone with 2 engines , it will be too expensive and maintenance headache even f35 and f16 have 1 engine . Kizilelma just need more powerful engine and tf 10k is enough.
Aslo Kizilelma but aslo Anka 3 needs to be more steathy perhaps Anka 3 it is but at rear its not . We hear all kinds of test about kizilelma but never agaist a modern Radar , how far can it spotted ?
So basically Kizilelma needs steath & more powerful engine with steath design or agaist powerful opponets will be downed like a fly from the sky

I don't think they will ever publish stealth tests because there isn't much to show and it is one of the more guarded topics. But Ahmet Akyol has said that they are collabarating with Baykar on things like sensors but also on the stealth. I would guess that includes testing against best radars Aselsan got. Kubilay Yıldırım had a nice Twitter thread about how each prototype has improved on the stealth features

 

[IC3M@N FX]

I don’t see a problem here: two AI-322F engines are cheaper than most other engines worldwide. This is a Soviet-era design from the 1980s, and if produced under license — for example, with a 10-year contract — the costs could be reduced even further. By 2032, the TF-10000 would also be ready and in serial production.
There is therefore no reason why costs should spiral out of control with two of these Ukrainian engines.

A single engine of this class only provides a thrust-to-weight ratio of about 0.30–0.40 (dry) or 0.50–0.60 (wet). That is not competitive for a loyal wingman concept — it is simply underpowered.

With two engines, however, the ratio would reach around 0.70–0.80 (dry) and 1.0–1.10 (wet).
A drone powered by just one AI-322F or TF-10000 would be at a clear disadvantage — lacking the kinetic performance for BVR engagements in Mid Range and offering virtually no agility in a dogfight.

The drones should operate like a wolf pack – fast, agile, and in coordination. Light, highly maneuverable drones take on the role of scouts and first-contact assets in air combat. They disrupt the enemy, force defensive maneuvers, and simultaneously act as forward sensors.

Kızılelma functions as a combat drone in the front and mid-range, capable of employing its own air-to-air missiles. Anka-3, operating from greater distance, serves both as a “stealth bomber” and, more importantly, as an AAM truck. Carrying a large payload of long-range missiles (e.g., Gökhan, Gökbora, six to eight units), it amplifies firepower while remaining concealed further back.

The KAAN fighter jet acts as the command and data-fusion hub. It deliberately holds its own missiles in the internal bays until the decisive moment. This layered approach forces adversaries into a defensive posture: they must constantly react to swarming drones and BVR (beyond visual range) threats, while KAAN remains in control and chooses when to strike.

The synergy of these systems – swarm drones in close/mid range with Kızılelma as a flexible combat drone, and Anka-3 as a long-range missile carrier – creates a distributed and resilient air combat ecosystem. The opponent loses initiative, while the Turkish side maximizes its striking power through networking, sensor fusion, and tactical layering.

This is the air combat doctrine of the 21st Century, System of Systems in Network.

 

[Pokemonte13]

As far as i remember baykar will make its own 20.000 Lbs engine similar to a f414 but im guessing(hoping) a bit more advanced reduced ir signature more efficient. So maybe single engine will be that and twin engine the tf10000. Also kizilelma will be more stealthier that any 4/4.5 gen aircraft maybe not as stealthy as 5th gen aircraft but against an f16 or an f15 it could probably engage it earlier than vise versa. And a more powerful engine is needed for the aircraft carrier

 

[Huelague]

Can we expect some (significant) design changes? A more matured stealth design.