Indonesia Casual Discussion Warkop Indonesia

[Gary]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787179026085200188

 

[Zapper]

@Zapper
Does 4x4 MArG and 8x8 MGS use same gun system and just being put on different platform?

8x8 MGS is 155mm 52 cal whereas MArG is 39 cal

 

[Zapper]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787346456845967755

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787395335289253891

Can anyone elaborate what's going on here? Did Kalyani pitch MArG or MGS to you guys?

 

[NEKO]

8x8 MGS is 155mm 52 cal whereas MArG is 39 cal

View attachment 67786

ATAGS gun system right?

 

[Zapper]

ATAGS gun system right?

Yep, the guns used on both MGS and ATAGS are similar 155mm 52 caliber gun with the same barrel diameter and length, breech, recoil system etc but I'm unsure if they're exactly identical, some components might differ

 

[this is crunch]

Bro @this is crunch, ada pr baru nih ....

I'm actually not really worried about Phil Navy Second Batch order of 2x LPD, PT. PAL getting so good at building this type of ship they really did it in the matter of below 15 months per ship (from keel laying to launching). The one that worries me is actually is the UAE 163-meters LPD, that is something really new, not just simple modification or jumbofication, but entirely new design. It gonna took quite some loooong time. and the AH140 delays

with this data, let's make it clear to read

Note: the 2nd AH140 is unclear, there is no publication for her first steel cutting, but if we look at the contract, the 2nd AH140 expected to be constructed for 69 months (almost 6 years), if it were to begin the first steel cutting in 2024, it is expected for her to be commissioned in latter 2029 or first half 2030, then it took another 12 months for the final fitting and sea trials, then the navy would have it in 2031



OOT
There is funny thing about Phillipine navy, in 2017, they ordered 2 warship to HHI, it's 107 meters long and 2600 tons heavy and they called it Frigate, the BRP Jose Rizal class.

But then in 2021 they ordered another batch of ship, to the same shipbulder, the HHI, but now it has 118 meters long and 3200 tons displacement. This time they classified it as Corvettes haha

 

[NEKO]

Yep, the guns used on both MGS and ATAGS are similar 155mm 52 caliber gun with the same barrel diameter and length, breech, recoil system etc but I'm unsure if they're exactly identical, some components might differ

How about MaRG? Is it also ATAGS but just with shorter barrel?

 

[chibiyabi]

8x8 MGS is 155mm 52 cal whereas MArG is 39 cal

View attachment 67786

njiir, beli M777 gerak sendiri kw, tapi klo soal perbajaan mah yakin lah india bisa bikin barang bagus asal DNA M777nya jangan dioprek oprek

 

[Zapper]

How about MaRG? Is it also ATAGS but just with shorter barrel?

ATAGS was always designed to be a 52 cal in the first place.

Regarding MaRG, there was an initial request from our late CDS post Doklam standoff with China to build a truck mounted 155m/39 cal to maneuver around the narrow mountain roads of Sikkim which is when Kalyani decided to integrate the cost effective ULH's gun on a wheeled platform like Tata LPTA but later went on to develop their own 4x4 HMV resulting in the birth of MaRG

Kalyani also offers a more expensive significantly lighter titanium version for many of it's offerings

Bharat ULH-ER 155mm/52 cal: Kalyani's equivalent of M777 and there's a 39 cal version (steel 6.9T & titanium 4.8T) offered as well. 52 cal weighs <8 ton, ~45km range, gun speed is 60 km/h on asphalt and 24 km/h on rough terrain, capable of operating at elevation of -3° to 70° and can traverse at +/-23°, rate of fire is 12 rounds in 3 minutes in intense mode and 42 rounds in 60 minutes in sustained mode and 3 rounds in 30 seconds in burst mode. Can be lifted by a Chinook

MGS: 155mm/52 cal and uses ATAGS's gun, max range of 48-50 km (60+km using the newly developed ramjet propelled shells) and has a max speed of 80 km/h. The elevation angle of the gun ranges from 0° to +72°. MGS has ammunition-carrying capacity of 24 projectiles. It can fire 3 rounds in 30 seconds in burst mode & 12 rounds in 3 minutes in intense mode

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1742593033789469012

MaRG: 155mm/39 cal, gun and HMV together weigh 18 tons, gradient negotiation of 30 degree and elevation from -2 to + 72 degrees, on board ammunition carrying capacity of 18 rounds with Zone 5 charge. The gun can quickly be deployed and can be brought into action in just 1.5 minutes in daytime and 2 minutes during night, sustained rate of fire of 42 rounds in 60 minutes, an intense rate of 12 rounds in 3 minutes and a burst rate of 3 rounds in 30 seconds

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1633494184912093184

Garuda 105: 105mm/37 cal with 360 deg range, ~5 ton, 30 degrees gradeability,

 

[schuimpjes]

Few years after, Anni di Piombo went brrrr. Both extremes doing terror attack, wild time Cold War era for Italy. Unofficial Freemason lodge and influential people (White Coup) tried to get rid of the extremists and made Italian politics moderate with alleged strategy of tension.

 

[NEKO]

ATAGS was always designed to be a 52 cal in the first place.

Regarding MaRG, there was an initial proposal to integrate the cost effective ULH's gun on a wheeled platform like Tata LPTA and that's how MaRG was born where Kalyani developed their own 4x4 HMV and mounted the ULH's gun on it

Kalyani also offers a more expensive significantly lighter titanium version for many of it's offerings

View attachment 67810

View attachment 67812

Bharat ULH-ER 155mm/52 cal: Kalyani's equivalent of M777 and there's a 39 cal version offered as well. 52 cal weighs <8 ton, ~45km range, gun speed is 60 km/h on asphalt and 24 km/h on rough terrain, capable of operating at elevation of -3° to 70° and can traverse at +/-23°, rate of fire is 12 rounds in 3 minutes in intense mode and 42 rounds in 60 minutes in sustained mode and 3 rounds in 30 seconds in burst mode. Can be lifted by a Chinook

View attachment 67808


MGS: 155mm/52 cal and uses ATAGS's gun, max range of 48-50 km (60+km using the newly developed ramjet propelled shells) and has a max speed of 80 km/h. The elevation angle of the gun ranges from 0° to +72°. MGS has ammunition-carrying capacity of 24 projectiles. It can fire 3 rounds in 30 seconds in burst mode & 12 rounds in 3 minutes in intense mode

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1742593033789469012

MaRG: 155mm/39 cal, gun and HMV together weigh 18 tons, gradient negotiation of 30 degree and elevation from -2 to + 72 degrees, on board ammunition carrying capacity of 18 rounds with Zone 5 charge. The gun can quickly be deployed and can be brought into action in just 1.5 minutes in daytime and 2 minutes during night, sustained rate of fire of 42 rounds in 60 minutes, an intense rate of 12 rounds in 3 minutes and a burst rate of 3 rounds in 30 seconds

Garuda 105: 105mm/37 cal with 360 deg range, ~5 ton, 30 degrees gradeability,

View attachment 67811

Does Armenia also bought ATAGS?

 

[Zapper]

Does Armenia also bought ATAGS?

Yes, total 90 ATAGS on order to be delivered over 3 years. 6 have been delivered so far

Below video (kinda grainy) shows the ones painted in their camo prior to shipment

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1701635160620556491

 

[satria]

Kemhan tegaskan RI sesuaikan pembayaran KF-21, bukan minta pemotongan

Kementerian Pertahanan menegaskan pemerintah Indonesia meminta penyesuaian pembayaran (payment adjustment) kepada pemerintah Korea Selatan atas kerja sama ...

www.antaranews.com

bagaiman nih @NEKO, apa kita goreng Tejas /Jitenbi biar tuntas

 

[NEKO]

Namanya juga cuman numpang proyek orang. Btw, ane juga mulai eneg sama drama kasel dan pespur dengan korsel.

Kalau dilihat tren kerjasama dengan korsel nampaknya memburuk, mungkin kedepannya banting setir fokus kerjasama ke negara lain, apalagi abis ini prabs yang jadi presiden.

Jangan tejas/pespur china dong.

 

[satria]

PAL dan LUNAS Malaysia MoU bidang teknologi di DSA 2024

PT PAL Indonesia menyepakati Memory of Understanding (MoU) dengan Lumut Naval Shipyard (LUNAS) Malaysia dalam bidang pembuatan kapal baru, peningkatan ...

www.antaranews.com

ambil alih mbalela, apa bikin MRSS neudesain ...

 

[Lordimperator]

Namanya juga cuman numpang proyek orang. Btw, ane juga mulai eneg sama drama kasel dan pespur dengan korsel.

Kalau dilihat tren kerjasama dengan korsel nampaknya memburuk, mungkin kedepannya banting setir fokus kerjasama ke negara lain, apalagi abis ini prabs yang jadi presiden.

Jangan tejas/pespur china dong.

Btw 6 unit T50I repeat order kemarin belum kelihatan ya?

Nah ini dia, TNI AU akan dapat tambahan enam jet latih T-50i

Perusahaan Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) mengumumkan pada 20 Juli 2021 bahwa mereka telah menandatangani kontrak pasokan tambahan T-50i

www.airspace-review.com

 

[NEKO]

MRSS masih adakah requirement buat RAS + Oiler, padahal kalau desainnya untuk LPD juga ntar buat nyimpan BBM dimana? Simpen di truk tanki?

Kalau tanker kek buatan KAB kan hull isinya fokus untuk ngangkut BBM makanya bisa muat banyak, lha kalau itu desain juga buat LPD terus juga oiler, gak bakal efektif kan oilernya?

 

[norman88]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787795370271244537

 

[this is crunch]

MRSS masih adakah requirement buat RAS + Oiler, padahal kalau desainnya untuk LPD juga ntar buat nyimpan BBM dimana? Simpen di truk tanki?

Kalau tanker kek buatan KAB kan hull isinya fokus untuk ngangkut BBM makanya bisa muat banyak, lha kalau itu desain juga buat LPD terus juga oiler, gak bakal efektif kan oilernya?

menurutku ngga efektif dalam fokus tugasnya kalo gini, walau sebenernya ada yang udah submit design serupa

PACIFIC 2019: Navantia Australia Unveils Joint Support Ship Design - Naval News

At PACIFIC 2019, the naval defense exposition held last week in Sydney, Australia, Navantia Australia, the local branch of Spanish shipbuilding group Navantia, unveiled a new Joint Support Ship (JSS) design for both the domestic and export market.

www.navalnews.com

Landing Platform Dock fokus tugas harusnya hanya untuk gugus amfibi dan misinya ya untuk bawa pasukan, ranpur pendaratan dan heli. soal logistik lebih baik di kapal terpisah.

Banyak yang keliru kalo sebenernya ketika kapal dalam misi ekspedisi / jarak jauh, yang mereka butuhin itu bukan hanya fuel buat kapalnya doang, tapi juga logistik berupa makanan dan munisi. Tapi yang TNI-AL punya baru cuman kelas Replenishment/ Bantu Cair Minyak (BCM), yang mana fungsinya ya cuman transfer minyak doang.

Hal lain yang orang sering lupa tentang logistik kapal adalah mereka ngga melulu stacked containerized kaya konteiner std 20ft - 40ft. Tapi lebih ke palletized, dry cargo, dan refrigerated cargo.

Makanya kalo mau yang lengkap dan berfungsi maksimal sebagai kapal bantu suplai / Auxiliary Oiler Replenishment ya minimal kaya Navantia Cantabria class atau Royal Navy Solid Support Ship

Juga sebenernya cuman masalah waktu sampe angkatan laut minta kapal sekelas itu, KRI Bontang sama Tarakan mana cukup buat AH140, PPA, dan fregat sekelas.

 

[Lordimperator]

Pal rumoured to be the winner for supplying 3 RMN MRSS.
Source:
Malaysia Military Review Facebook