India Coffee House

Gessler

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The reality is sadly very complicated.

The situation in Kashmir is indeed India's fault and a living and breathing monument of the country's incompetency to provide basic human rights.

However, if I had to choose between India and Pakistan, I would select India over Pakistan in a heartbeat when it comes to security, living standards and upholding the rule of law. Me being a Muslim doesn't change the reality of India being simply in a better overall constitution.

Furthermore, as long as Pakistan supports the erasing and killing of the Uygur minority, Turkey should reserve its criticism of the Kashmir conflict solely to bilateral meetings with the Indian side behind closed doors.

Fair enough - though I must say that if India were to withdraw forces from Kashmir (as per what Pakistan demands), there is very little stopping Kashmir from devolving into another Afghanistan post-US withdrawal. Radicalism is a real threat - and there is a history of such in this place, where all non-Muslims were persecuted, subjected to geocide and/or ethnically cleansed as late as the 90s. That was the civil war/insurgency that brought Indian forces into the valley in the first place.

End of the day, Afghanistan is not a US territory and they could pick & leave whenever they please, only thing they had to lose was face. But as India considers this as its sovereign territory (and rightfully so, as the erstwhile Monarch of the land acceded his Kingdom to the Republic of India), leaving is not an option for us.

As much as I dont like India, I dont like Pakistan as much as it; if not even more. However, for Turkey, Pakistan is more crucial than India. Rumors indicate that Pakistan is providing long range ballistic missile technology as well as nuclear technology to Turkey; something which India would never give as they are too controlled by the West.

Ah, I see - the same carrot Pakistan showed to the Saudis for over 20 years, took billions as aid/grants, and gave zilch in return.

Two things:

1) Pakistan's nuke or missile technology is not Pakistan's, but Chinese. Even if one thinks Pakistan can act as a conduit for Chinese tech to flow to a third party...

2) ...why would Pakistan let that happen? You must look at it from Pakistani perspective: What does Pakistan have?

It is not sitting on immense Oil wealth like the Gulf states, it does not have a relatively large diversified economy like Turkey at least, neither does it have immense influence over either of the two main Islamic sects (like Saudi has over Sunnis or like Iran has over Shias). The ONLY thing Pakistan has is the "Bomb". It's only claim to fame among the Muslim world is simply that its the only Islamic country with nuclear weapons.

Why would it want to dilute its unique position by giving away the 'Bomb' to a stronger economy like Turkey? If anything Pakistan might be more comfortable with Iran acquiring nuclear weapons, as this will terrify the Sunni countries and likely increase Pakistan's importance among them....but by giving away the Nuke to a Sunni state like Turkey, Pakistan has very little to gain - but everything to lose.

They will milk Turkey like they milked the Saudis for money. From Turkey, they might seek other things - like a route to acquire Western technologies as Turkey has been NATO member for long. But I suspect they will run out of things to milk far sooner than was the case with Saudi due to Turkey's worsening relations with the US, not to mention CAATSA and all that.
 
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Nilgiri

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This is the Indian section. It is the Indian members and mods that will decide here what is on and off topic.

Pakistani members can present their highlight reel in their section of the forum or in the already existing threads they have created in number of areas on whatever "India bad!" topic.

The reply from a troll that was being responded to can be seen left in the quote in #6 for reference as to why the hypocrisy from that had to be illustrated efficiently.
 

Nilgiri

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The first tweet thing just had to be fawad chaudry.

The guy is a living meme himself. ISRO dekhoooo
 

Jackdaws

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New Delhi: Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB) has recently faced a severe blow after New Zealand and England cancelled their respective tours. The Kiwis cited security as a reason whereas England stated the 'mental and physical well-being' of the players was an issue.

The cancellation of the tours has affected Pakistan financially and 'morally' as well. The newly appointed chairman of PCB Ramiz Raja lambasted the two nations for abandoning their respective series.

However, now some of the Pakistan ministers and former cricketers have started 'dragging India's' name in their statements. They are also allegedly blaming the Indian cricket board (BCCI) for the cancellation of their tours.

To this, a senior BCCI official told IANS that Pakistan has an old habit of 'using' India's name in all their 'big or small news' that too without any proof. "We wish Ramiz Raja good luck…Pakistan cricket reaches new heights under him. We want to clear one thing that the BCCI has no role in the cancellation of England and New Zealand tours to Pakistan."

"We don't have time for all this…And also, I don't know why some ex-Pakistan players are cursing the IPL (Indian Premier League) for no reason? I read somewhere that Raja said that the Aussie players have even changed their DNA for the sake of the money they make by playing in the IPL. He accused Aussies of playing happily against India without their usual aggressive approach.

"Now from where the IPL came here? What kind of frustration is that? We understand that you are feeling bad but there is no need to drag India everywhere," the official added.

New Zealand abandoned their tour hours before the first ODI was scheduled to take place in Rawalpindi on September 17, because of a security threat. Days later, the England team pulled out, citing the mental and physical well-being of players.

Pakistan's information minister Fawad Chaudhry had said the "e-mail was generated from India through a VPN showing the location of Singapore".
 

Jackdaws

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I am surprised they haven't blamed India for shooting Sri Lankan cricketers in Lahore or that it was RAW which was hiding Osama in Abottabad.
 

Lonewolf

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Last time they pointed a lake as isis training camp in India ,as they saw a bsf camp near it , I mean really 😑😑😑😑😑.

This is the new low for Pakistan or campaign .

@VCheng looks like Pakistani establishment ,now act for their personal gains not for national gains , they try to fool some gullible people and garner support for their political shit show .

They have dropped themselves to the level or indian media , meanwhile they should compete with government .
 

VCheng

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I mean back in the day their propoganda was well prepared,now they just don't pay attention to the details .


It is the "vision" thing by the Great Khan, who cannot be bothered to fret about the details. :D
 

Nilgiri

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If the thread doesn't have an original article to start it (just your own words + tweets etc), please start it in this coffee house thread or an existing thread. Its banter/humour stuff in this case so I moved it to coffee house.

Let us have as few non-serious titles from indian subforum pop up in shoutbox etc.
 
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