TR TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

Radonsider

Contributor
Messages
1,467
Reactions
14 2,802
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Bosnia & Herzegovina
Shall we try to guesstimate TFXs RCS from that?
Probably we cannot, we need someone that can model TF-X with all the details and run EMW simulation in Ansys.



But -30dBsm means if we apply this to a flat surface that has 1m² RCS for a given direction, it would have 0.001m² with ASELSAN's RAM applied over it.


Of course effectiveness depends on RADAR wavelength/frequency but i am assuming all of these are for X band
 

Afif

Experienced member
Moderator
Bangladesh Correspondent
DefenceHub Diplomat
Bangladesh Moderator
Messages
4,748
Reactions
94 9,070
Nation of residence
Bangladesh
Nation of origin
Bangladesh
Probably we cannot, we need someone that can model TF-X with all the details and run EMW simulation in Ansys.



But -30dBsm means if we apply this to a flat surface that has 1m² RCS for a given direction, it would have 0.001m² with ASELSAN's RAM applied over it.


Of course effectiveness depends on RADAR wavelength/frequency but i am assuming all of these are for X band
And also, likely to include S band like f35s RAM.
 

Radonsider

Contributor
Messages
1,467
Reactions
14 2,802
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Bosnia & Herzegovina
E5MZ908XwAI1-Vy
This number is possibly outdated now, keep in mind that lots of things were not finalized at that time, i expect it to be better now, around -30 levels
 

Afif

Experienced member
Moderator
Bangladesh Correspondent
DefenceHub Diplomat
Bangladesh Moderator
Messages
4,748
Reactions
94 9,070
Nation of residence
Bangladesh
Nation of origin
Bangladesh
This number is possibly outdated now, keep in mind that lots of things were not finalized at that time, i expect it to be better now, around -30 levels
You mean, similar to f22?
but f22S visible angles are sharper than TFX.
 
Last edited:

Radonsider

Contributor
Messages
1,467
Reactions
14 2,802
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Bosnia & Herzegovina
You mean, similar to f22?
but f22S angles are sharper than TFX.
Depends on where you look, sections are important, at some F-22 will be better and at some TF-X will be better probably, we can't exactly know without running an Ansys sim
 

Bogeyman 

Experienced member
Professional
Messages
9,192
Reactions
67 31,255
Website
twitter.com
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
National platforms become invisible with ASELSAN


Haluk Görgün, Chairman of the Board of Directors and General Manager of ASELSAN, made a statement to the AA correspondent regarding their work on radar absorbing technologies and low visibility.

Emphasizing that "radar absorption" is among the subjects they attach importance to, Görgün stated that the scattering surfaces and areas of the existing platforms should be well determined, so that it should be well understood how the enemy radars can detect the platform, from what distance and in what way.

Görgün said that they developed a software called RAPID, which can be used only in ASELSAN, that can help detect this and then develop materials and dyes related to its treatment. Görgün made the following assessments:

"With this software, platforms that need radar absorption may have an aircraft wing, a part of its ammunition, nose, tail, we can analyze it and analyze what part should be prevented from appearing on the radar the most. Local and national, our engineers have developed and continue to develop. , we have software that gives talent.

After that, there is the issue of preparing the recipe for those regions and applying the materials and paint according to the recipe. Again, we can do this with our own analytical work. It requires a very serious talent, good material knowledge, optimization and engineering knowledge, chemistry knowledge, informatics and software knowledge. We have a unit where we collect all of these. A 109 man/year experience is throughout ASELSAN. 25 full time people have been working for this job for a long time. We are working with 5 different universities while making developments in this field. There are also about 10 companies that we are responsible for the development of paints and various chemicals and that we purchase services from.

We are progressing very well in making these analyzes for air, sea and land platforms, and in the development of materials and paints that reduce scattering surfaces. We are working on this for the National Combat Aircraft, and we continue. Similar studies continue for all other manned and unmanned platforms.

Working in NATO with few countries

Görgün also gave information about the works carried out in NATO in this field and said that a working group was formed to bring together the capabilities of a few countries.

Stating that ASELSAN also supports this working group, Görgün said, "Our competence and talent are also known in this working group. We take part in the working group with in-depth knowledge in this field, with experience starting from materials science and the ability to analyze it." said.

Görgün pointed out that these capabilities were used starting from the design stage of the National Combat Aircraft, "Because the platform may need some changes on its structural surface or the structural surface is okay, what will be applied there, what material will be applied? Because when you apply the material, you need to apply several layers. They also have paint, weight and budget. Works that need to be optimized together. As ASELSAN, we take responsibility for domestic and national platforms." he said.

In NATO project with special permission

ASELSAN takes part in the NATO working group carried out between the Netherlands, Germany, Spain, Italy, Sweden, Norway and Turkey for the development of the low visibility design processes of the Unmanned Combat Aerial Vehicle.

Within the scope of the studies, the model production of the vehicle has been completed, and radar absorbing material application activities continue. In the next 3 years, radar cross-sectional area measurements of the radar-absorbing material model, produced by establishing a new NATO working group, will be made by various countries. It is planned that ASELSAN will contribute to these studies, representing Turkey. In addition to the existing countries, the participation of England and Poland in these studies is on the agenda.

ASELSAN plays an active role in determining the scattering centers of the human aircraft with high precision with the RAPID software it has originally developed, and applying radar absorbing materials to the said areas. With the export permit obtained from the Ministry of National Defense, radar absorber material was developed by ASELSAN specifically for the studies. It has been shown that if the material is applied to the scattering centers of the platform, the radar cross-sectional area value can be reduced to one thousandth.
 

Quasar

Contributor
The Post Deleter
Messages
734
Reactions
51 3,280
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
This number is possibly outdated now, keep in mind that lots of things were not finalized at that time, i expect it to be better now, around -30 levels
frankly speaking by time I am also quite confident that MMU will exceed the initial operational requirements set by Air force since neither operational requirements itself, nor the technological progress is a constant.
 
Last edited:

TheInsider

Experienced member
Professional
Messages
4,066
Solutions
1
Reactions
34 14,482
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
This number is possibly outdated now, keep in mind that lots of things were not finalized at that time, i expect it to be better now, around -30 levels
It is not outdated. This is what Airforce accepts as a minimum baseline. I told this in the past those are airforce requirements. Airforce won't accept a product that doesn't satisfy those requirements. Airforce requirement doesn't mean the end product will have exactly the same performance.
 

Tsenal

Committed member
Messages
276
Reactions
1 714
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
Can someone translate this video?
It's overall a decent video and not overly critical like many other foreign reports.

He gives general information about the program. Mentions the uncertainty of the engines but doesn't give a definitive opinion whether we will manage to develop the engine or not.

Says Turkey is not just developing a fighter jet but also a family of missiles, training aircraft and loyal wingman drones to support TFX

Comments on the canopy size calling it very large, says it's difficult to comment on the pilot's visibility since the cabin is not finished.

Comments the air intakes are very large.

Comments on the large size of the possible engines and the distance between the engine is likely to reduce heat signature. Also mentions the possibility of placing EW or radar in the space between the engines and that it can increase the heat signature of the aircraft.

At the end he says Turkish economy may not be great, but they are a country of 85 million and they invested heavily in the defense sector.
 

I_Love_F16

Contributor
France Correspondent
Messages
812
Reactions
10 1,699
Nation of residence
France
Nation of origin
France
It's overall a decent video and not overly critical like many other foreign reports.

He gives general information about the program. Mentions the uncertainty of the engines but doesn't give a definitive opinion whether we will manage to develop the engine or not.

Says Turkey is not just developing a fighter jet but also a family of missiles, training aircraft and loyal wingman drones to support TFX

Comments on the canopy size calling it very large, says it's difficult to comment on the pilot's visibility since the cabin is not finished.

Comments the air intakes are very large.

Comments on the large size of the possible engines and the distance between the engine is likely to reduce heat signature. Also mentions the possibility of placing EW or radar in the space between the engines and that it can increase the heat signature of the aircraft.

At the end he says Turkish economy may not be great, but they are a country of 85 million and they invested heavily in the defense sector.

And to further add to your post, ‘’Até Chuet’’ (his callsign) is a retired french naval fighter pilot and flew the Rafale M.
At the end of the video he said that he will make a video in the future about unmanned fighter jets (Kizilelma).
 

MADDOG

Contributor
Türkiye Correspondent
Professional
Messages
1,220
Reactions
31 8,007
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Cyprus
TASECS will implement the environmental control system they developed to platforms such as Hürkuş-2, Gökbey, ATAK, Hürjet and the National Combat Aircraft (TF-X).

1672730481566.jpeg
Screen Shot 2023-01-03 at 19.21.49.png
 

Follow us on social media

Top Bottom