TR Economy & Updates

[Tornadoss]

Ottoman language was Arabic-Persian not alphabet. There no such thing as Persian alphabet. They use Arabic too.



It is a sign of dyslexia mostly. I was able to write before we had writing lessons in primary school. Almost any friend of mine were. Every normal kid can write what they learned to read.



Mahmut the Second. 1824. Talim-i Sıbyan Fermanı. Meclis-i Maarif-i Umumiye. There was a ministery for it and they were responsible of it. They were checking it but I'm not surprised for you didn't even google what I said. There are researches from western researchers that proves me. I could send you the link but maybe you should learn how to search and learn things. Start from here.



That's why illiteration rate was smth from ten percent to fifty percent. It would be around 10 if everyone did. It is at most 50.

Do not dispute me again if you don't have any arguments.

I confuse the language and alphabet, Persian has few more letter and have different pronunciation. It's my bad.

Indeed, Mahmut II. made changes regarding the many area of the Ottomans, but how it's followed in the and how it's applied it's another question. Also need to take into account reading was only limited to religious studies for most who can get it. No higher education possible for most only for the elite classes, such as the military and bureaucratic officers. In urban areas, where there were more schools, literacy rates were somewhat higher among the elite and the educated. In rural areas, however, education was not as accessible, and literacy rates were lower. And most of population in Anatolia was living in rural areas. In the end according to the census in 1927 literacy rate was around 10%.

At the end of empire, there was no heavy industry, no scientific background to back the industry. It was lost the edge due to missing the Industrial revolution. In a heavy debt. Not much possibilities for the new Republic. These are the realities.

 

[Scott Summers]

Yeah because they were beacon of development before the republic. Please don't impute mistakes during the Empire to the Republic.

An undeveloping or retarded empire could not last for 6 centuries. After the military coup we saw a new form of statehood with 1 party and 0 elections.

 

[Tornadoss]

An undeveloping or retarded empire could not last for 6 centuries. After the military coup we saw a new form of statehood with 1 party and 0 elections.

It was developed until it was not. It was underdeveloped at the end of empire, beginning from late 1600s. There would be a land locked country if there was not a coup, that people you blamed with coup fought for this country and work until very end for it. The things are done for the salvation of this country.

 

[Rooxbar]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1877040918244593970

 

[hugh]

True. Illiteracy rate was less than 50% before (10%~50%) (which is far less from most european countries at that time).

Everyone knew how to read the Quran, the Quran is written in Arabic, Ottoman alphabet was Arabic, Ottoman Turkish was being read as written as todays Turkish, so everyone who could read Quran (who is everyone) was able to read and write in Ottoman Turkish too. Otherwise would mean they were not hearing what was coming out from their mouth.

Think it like writing a Turkish word you heard for the first time, it's easy because it's written as it's read right ? It's the same in Ottoman. And I'm saying less than 50% for the last century of the empire. It was way more less than that at the empire's peak.

By this logic anyone who can read(I can read it too) Quran today can read Ottoman Turkish, which is obviously false. Go ahead and test this theory if it holds water. And when you fail, please don't come back with excuses like "those words are forgotten today". Because that is not the reason. You cannot even read the words you use and know by heart.

And can you produce a source for this 50% literacy rate claim?

 

[chngr]

Imagine, tiny Netherlands had in 2023 a export of 667 billion.

Our export should hit skyrockets with our geographic position.

Thats not pruduction or exports..just re-exports

Netherlands is port country like bigger Hong Kong and Singapore.

 

[Turkic]

Go ahead and test this theory if it holds water.

I don't need to try I already can. There are some tips for it. My father is a literature teacher and he thought me how (Literature students get Ottoman Turkish classes too). So I'm not coming back with excuses. But I need to tell that this is not valid for all sentences you can face. When "divan" involves, it's impossible if you didn't educate Ottoman. I'm talking about simple Ottoman Turkish, which people used to talk. Sorry for not stating this and the tips before.

And can you produce a source for this 50% literacy rate claim?

There are a lot of sources to claim it but none is official. Just like there's no official source that claims a lower percent in the last era of the Empire.

 

[No Name]

I want to point out that people who compare the Ottoman Empire to the European empires come across as really silly.

The European states had vastly different circumstances with their territories in Europe at least. For example, the European territory can be described as easily mod as most European powers were located on flat land with a river network that allowed power to be centralised much easier than the mountainous Ottoman empire.

The mountainous territory made it more difficult for the government to govern and allowed minority groups to avoid assimilation. This created a massive problem as most of the empire's population wasn't Turkish-speaking. By the 1800s, the empire only had about 8 to 9 million Turks out of 31 million people.

In other words, it was nearly impossible for the state to increase literacy in a multicultural state such as the Ottoman Empire.

Also, those European states didn't have a better literacy rate than the Ottoman Empire, as the data is somewhat manipulative. When people discuss the literacy rate in the Ottoman Empire, they talk about the entire Ottoman Empire, which includes the Christian minorities in the mountains and the countless nomadic Muslim tribes of the deserts and plains.

That said, when people discuss the literacy rates of the European empires, they do not discuss the complete picture, as most of the European empires' populations were also illiterate; for every English-speaking subject of the British empire who could read, there were a hundred Indian subjects who could not. The same applies to all the European empires, but this is never discussed when comparing the Ottoman Empire to other European empires.

I should also point out that European empires that did have higher levels of education often had them in areas in which the religious book was in the languages of the local population. In other words, there was a link between education and religious literature. Separating the religious component of education has actually slowed down the spread of education in the Muslim world, at least in the 20th century.

Religious education, of course, only goes so far in spreading literacy. Eventually, a country does need to break with religious teaching and adopt a more secular education system, but that comes after society matures a bit, but not before.

 

[Scott Summers]

WEG investing 28 million USD to build gearbox factory in Manisa.

WEG invests €28m to build a gearbox factory in Turkey - Drives&Controls

The Brazilian motors and automation manufacturer WEG is investing around €28m to build a new gearbox manufacturing facility in the Izmir region of Turkey. The 12,000m² plant, due to be completed by 2027, will boost the company’s capacity for manufacturing gearboxes and components outside of...

drivesncontrols.com

 

[B_A]

I want to point out that people who compare the Ottoman Empire to the European empires come across as really silly.

The European states had vastly different circumstances with their territories in Europe at least. For example, the European territory can be described as easily mod as most European powers were located on flat land with a river network that allowed power to be centralised much easier than the mountainous Ottoman empire.

The mountainous territory made it more difficult for the government to govern and allowed minority groups to avoid assimilation. This created a massive problem as most of the empire's population wasn't Turkish-speaking. By the 1800s, the empire only had about 8 to 9 million Turks out of 31 million people.

In other words, it was nearly impossible for the state to increase literacy in a multicultural state such as the Ottoman Empire.

Also, those European states didn't have a better literacy rate than the Ottoman Empire, as the data is somewhat manipulative. When people discuss the literacy rate in the Ottoman Empire, they talk about the entire Ottoman Empire, which includes the Christian minorities in the mountains and the countless nomadic Muslim tribes of the deserts and plains.

That said, when people discuss the literacy rates of the European empires, they do not discuss the complete picture, as most of the European empires' populations were also illiterate; for every English-speaking subject of the British empire who could read, there were a hundred Indian subjects who could not. The same applies to all the European empires, but this is never discussed when comparing the Ottoman Empire to other European empires.

I should also point out that European empires that did have higher levels of education often had them in areas in which the religious book was in the languages of the local population. In other words, there was a link between education and religious literature. Separating the religious component of education has actually slowed down the spread of education in the Muslim world, at least in the 20th century.

Religious education, of course, only goes so far in spreading literacy. Eventually, a country does need to break with religious teaching and adopt a more secular education system, but that comes after society matures a bit, but not before.

Actually Ottoman’s problem in 19 century was too few population but too many minority groups.

The Russian Empire became the great power because of her large population.

Ottoman was the most populous empire besides Chinese and Indian in 1500s and 1600s but even lesser than England in 1900.

 

[B_A]

By this logic anyone who can read(I can read it too) Quran today can read Ottoman Turkish, which is obviously false. Go ahead and test this theory if it holds water. And when you fail, please don't come back with excuses like "those words are forgotten today". Because that is not the reason. You cannot even read the words you use and know by heart.

And can you produce a source for this 50% literacy rate claim?

Literacy in Ottoman society was higher than believed

The statistics of the early Republican era suggest the literacy rate in the Ottoman Empire was lower than 10 percent. However, these numbers do not reflect...

www.dailysabah.com

That is just a claim and a view.

Btw the theory of high literacy in 19 century Japan also under challenge now.

 

[No Name]

Actually Ottoman’s problem in 19 century was too few population but too many minority groups.

The Russian Empire became the great power because of her large population.

Ottoman was the most populous empire besides Chinese and Indian in 1500s and 1600s but even lesser than England in 1900.

I did point out the population problem when I was talking about minorities and how difficult it was to assimilate them.

 

[Saithan]

Turkish exporters mull new sea route to alleviate Bulgaria border gridlock - Türkiye News

Turkish export representatives are contemplating a plan to alleviate truck congestion at the Türkiye-Bulgaria border by transporting vehicles to Romania via sea routes, aiming to resolve the bottleneck through maritime logistics, local media has reported.

www.hurriyetdailynews.com

But why from Sakarya, why not develop and expand in black sea area and develop a new port to serve for agricultural export only! AMK as if the istanbul strait is not trafficked enough.

 

[Scott Summers]

Invest Hong Kong (IHK) opens second office in Turkey.

InvestHK opens second Turkey office

The first InvestHK office in Turkey opened in Istanbul in 2006.

www.investmentmonitor.ai

“Turkey is part of the Belt and Road Initiative and is one of our target markets with growing economic potential. It has long been recognised as a strategic hub for global trade, logistics and manufacturing” IHK-CEO Alpha Lau said in a statement.

 

[Scott Summers]

Turkish exporters mull new sea route to alleviate Bulgaria border gridlock - Türkiye News

Turkish export representatives are contemplating a plan to alleviate truck congestion at the Türkiye-Bulgaria border by transporting vehicles to Romania via sea routes, aiming to resolve the bottleneck through maritime logistics, local media has reported.

www.hurriyetdailynews.com

But why from Sakarya, why not develop and expand in black sea area and develop a new port to serve for agricultural export only! AMK as if the istanbul strait is not trafficked enough.

Thats why Canal Istanbul should be established. Look how much money Panama and Egypt are making with their canals. Searoutes are always the safest, even in times of war.

 

[Saithan]

Thats why Canal Istanbul should be established. Look how much money Panama and Egypt are making with their canals. Searoutes are always the safest, even in times of war.

we already have a fucking strait there is no need spend money to make another. it's much cheaper to build a new port than to make your own fucking panama canal. Plus expanding an existing one will only benefit the region that gets it.

 

[Scott Summers]

we already have a fucking strait there is no need spend money to make another. it's much cheaper to build a new port than to make your own fucking panama canal. Plus expanding an existing one will only benefit the region that gets it.

We dont earn a fucking dime with our straits because of all the restrictions and regulations.

We need to invest in a new one that could race with the old one in time and comfort. Its worth the investment.

With the money they spend on luxury cars and appartments for the kids and grandkids of the ministers, they could have build a new canal.

With our geography we needed a domestic canal far before our domestic drone, tank, jet etc. But because we have a cancer in the opposition, a party like CHP, blocking everything that could benefit our country, we never made it.

The Panama Canal is making so much money that Donald Trump wants to annex it, think about that.

 

[Scott Summers]

Turkey thinking of sharing defence tech with Bangladesh

https://www.trtworld.com/turkiye/turkiye-can-replace-india-others-as-bangladeshs-key-trade-partner-18252373

 

[Tornadoss]

We dont earn a fucking dime with our straits because of all the restrictions and regulations.

We need to invest in a new one that could race with the old one in time and comfort. Its worth the investment.

With the money they spend on luxury cars and appartments for the kids and grandkids of the ministers, they could have build a new canal.

With our geography we needed a domestic canal far before our domestic drone, tank, jet etc. But because we have a cancer in the opposition, a party like CHP, blocking everything that could benefit our country, we never made it.

The Panama Canal is making so much money that Donald Trump wants to annex it, think about that.

Comparison of Panama and Canal Istanbul meaningless, as there is no alternative to Panama Canal.