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TR Attack & Utility Helicopter Programs

Afif

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We will keep hearing this word until we are sick of it, and I'm here for it.

Haha, that is fairly new deal/rediscovery for us. But I was looking at 1960s 1970s major powers ORBATS, those guys knew that very well.

I think so as well. Minor issue though, we don't have the engines to build it and maybe to even develop it, hence the backburner.

They should have gone with TS3000 when it was presented. That wasn't a wise skip at all.
 

Yasar_TR

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I think it would be easier to develop a more powerful derivative of TS1400 and use it in a dual engine 13 ton helicopter than taking the TS1400 and developing a 3-engine transmission for it.
The TS1400 is a radial flow turboshaft engine. Radial flow engines best work with single stage compressors; and are limited to maximum two stage compressors. The TS1400 is at this limit. There isn't much room for attaining any more meaningful power from this engine.

The T700TEI701D engine that TEI manufactures however, is a 2000hp class engine, and has room to grow to 3000hp level.
We have an additional agreement with GE in our license contract to have freedom to expand and alter the engine as we see fit by informing and taking GE's consent. It is a matter of re negotiating to increase output power level of this well established and proven engine. - provided TEI can allocate manpower and financial resources to this project.
 
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UkroTurk

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The TS1400 is a radial flow turboshaft engine. Radial flow engines best work with single stage compressors; and are limited to maximum two stage compressors. The TS1400 is at this limit. There isn't much room for attaining any more meaningful power from this engine.

The T700TEI701D engine that TEI manufactures however, is a 2000hp class engine, and has room to grow to 3000hp level.
We have an additional agreement with GE in our license contract to have freedom to expand and alter the engine as we see fit by informing and taking GE's consent. It is a matter of re negotiating to increase output power level of this well established and proven engine. - provided TEI can allocate manpower and financial resources to this project.
THE FIRST DOMESTIC PRODUCED HELICOPTER ENGINES IN TÜRKİYE!💪🇹🇷
 
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boredaf

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And confirms my belief that no T625 deliveries to JnGK is yet made.
It would have been fine if they just kept their mouth shut about any deliveries or dates and kept testing Gökbey. It is stuff like this that is making me take every word coming out of TAI with a pinch of salt these days.
 

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Former Hürkuş test pilot and TAI test flight chief Hüseyin Fazla says TAI spent 600 million dollars from its own resources on T929 Atak II. No other sources for the figure aside from his own words, but this is a very rare figure we got on development costs of a national project.

"According to what I have heard, after its flight on April 28, the Atak II prototype was simply thrown aside. In fact, many parts and systems were removed from the helicopter. The helicopter is not flying at the moment. For 10 months, the helicopter has not flown at all, and TAI has begun to feel as if the project has been 'halted'. It is understood that TAI GM Kotil's words on CNN Türk screens about 10 months ago, perhaps in the excitement of the elections, that "We will give it to the Land Forces in 2025" are probably no longer valid."

It seems to also confirm what we've heard about T929 previously, development is on backburner and maybe even halted for now.
 

Afif

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I hope this isn't the cost of Temel Kotil's over enthusiasm. Or somebody messed up at higher management level. (From SSB?)

With so many vital projects running simultaneously in all domains, efficient management of resource & priorities is important than ever.
 

Merzifonlu

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I think it's a normal development. The helicopter that is urgently needed is not the T929 attack helicopter. T925 helicopter is urgently needed.
 

boredaf

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Former Hürkuş test pilot and TAI test flight chief Hüseyin Fazla says TAI spent 600 million dollars from its own resources on T929 Atak II. No other sources for the figure aside from his own words, but this is a very rare figure we got on development costs of a national project.

"According to what I have heard, after its flight on April 28, the Atak II prototype was simply thrown aside. In fact, many parts and systems were removed from the helicopter. The helicopter is not flying at the moment. For 10 months, the helicopter has not flown at all, and TAI has begun to feel as if the project has been 'halted'. It is understood that TAI GM Kotil's words on CNN Türk screens about 10 months ago, perhaps in the excitement of the elections, that "We will give it to the Land Forces in 2025" are probably no longer valid."

It seems to also confirm what we've heard about T929 previously, development is on backburner and maybe even halted for now.
This is not surprising at all, if I had to bet, I would put a lot of money on the fact that it was a political stunt rather than a natural next step in the project.
 

uçuyorum

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This is not surprising at all, if I had to bet, I would put a lot of money on the fact that it was a political stunt rather than a natural next step in the project.
This is a bit of mismanagement, TAI went too quickly to make things work when faced with embargoes and difficulties, instead of taking a step back and rethinking priorities, they went ahead and tried to rush with any solution they found. So just when we thought we found the engine war happens and we can no longer get more than 14 engines. Thankfully, the drive train is common between 925 and 929 so even if Atak II is cancelled for now, at least the R&D will be useful for delivery of T925, but its still be a small number of deliveries.
 

Fairon

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Since FARA is cancelled GE lost a big customer for their T901 engine. Maybe we can try our luck with that engine for T92x series.(till TS3000 is ready)
 

Khagan1923

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Since FARA is cancelled GE lost a big customer for their T901 engine. Maybe we can try our luck with that engine for T92x series.(till TS3000 is ready)
T901 will be used to re-engine over two thousand AH-64 and UH-60 in the US inventory. Don’t know if they really need our business…

Maybe the CT7–8 could be used though until an indigenous 3000shp engine is ready
 

Fairon

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T901 will be used to re-engine over two thousand AH-64 and UH-60 in the US inventory. Don’t know if they really need our business…

Maybe the CT7–8 could be used though until an indigenous 3000shp engine is ready

Yes but business loss is a business loss.

There might be a possibility to use this. Not necessarily for T901, we could try to get CT7-8 as you said. Option that Yasar_TR mentioned above also could be tried.
 

TheInsider

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We need utility choppers and something to replace ATAK as the ATAK contract will end in 2028. ATAK II was never a priority. I don't know why TAI pushed it so hard.
 

Fairon

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We need utility choppers and something to replace ATAK as the ATAK contract will end in 2028. ATAK II was never a priority. I don't know why TAI pushed it so hard.

Most likely because Atak 2 potentially brings more votes than T925.

Fortunately we seem to be focusing on T925 now.

Speaking of T925, Temel Kotil said that the first flight will be on March 18th 2024.(or they are targeting March 18th) Is there any indication that T925 will fly that date?
 

Sanchez

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Most likely because Atak 2 potentially brings more votes than T925.

Fortunately we seem to be focusing on T925 now.

Speaking of T925, Temel Kotil said that the first flight will be on March 18th 2024.(or they are targeting March 18th) Is there any indication that T925 will fly that date?
Nothing except the CGI video from last month which was rare for TAI, they don't usually make videos like that.

New video on possible T925 models.
We know that Forestry Service model is already coming and it's the first one shown here as well. As well as the air ambulance and offshore support version. And given MTOW is now 12 tons, instead of 11. This thing gains weight faster than me. At this point, I'm expecting a three engine design...

 

Sanchez

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"It is aimed to complete the projects of the National Coast Guard Ship, which is resistant to heavy weather and sea conditions, which is of great importance to increase the effectiveness of missions on the high seas, the development of the search and rescue version of the indigenous Helicopter Gökbey over the sea, and the Supply of General Purpose Helicopter Over 10 Tons, which will provide our country with a new opportunity."
COAST GUARD COMMAND 2024-2028 STRATEGIC PLAN
And the first official confirmation that T625 Gökbey will be navalized in the future. T625 was always the perfect choice to replace SGM's 14 AB-412s. They want both T625s and T925s. Once it can finally be delivered, T625 already have onlookers from coast guard, possibly police and of course gendarme. Army will get in line soon and I still believe we will see a T625 ASW version in the future. Just for Turkish needs, there is a need for at least 100-150 helicopters. They just gotta deliver it...
 

boredaf

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And the first official confirmation that T625 Gökbey will be navalized in the future. T625 was always the perfect choice to replace SGM's 14 AB-412s. They want both T625s and T925s. Once it can finally be delivered, T625 already have onlookers from coast guard, possibly police and of course gendarme. Army will get in line soon and I still believe we will see a T625 ASW version in the future. Just for Turkish needs, there is a need for at least 100-150 helicopters. They just gotta deliver it...
Man, I really don't want to think about how long it is going to take to navalize Gökbey.
 
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