TR HÜRJET-Advanced Jet Trainer/ Light attack aircraft

[Sanchez]

It is a failed product

Failed products don't get ever growing orders. It's now operated by 3 navies, ordered by Japan and will probably also be ordered by Singapore and by Spain in the future as well. Only non American aligned navies with a carrier not using it will likely be France and Turkey. It is a great platform in a great package with teething issues, like all F-35s. F-35B is a marvel of engineering. It's a 5th gen stealth STOVL fighter, no other like it exists. Harrier couldn't ever do what a contemporary fighter like Mirage 3 could do.

Hürjet naval can be a great option for the training of F-35C pilots

There is only one F-35C operator and it's USN. Their new trainer requirements to replace the T-45 doesn't even include landing to and being operated from carriers. Hürjet is set to compete in that tender with SNC. If pigs start to fly and Hürjet wins, it won't land on an American carrier. We shouldn't expect it would be much different for a future British one.

But both carriers were built with provisions to operate with CATOBAR should the STOVL system proves to be inefficient. It is almost like FFBNW. The construction of the deck, under deck and overall systems are ready to accept the fitting of a catapult and arresting wires. But the cost involved will most likely deter Royal Navy from adapting it. It is not just the conversion of ships’ hardware

QE class ships were originally designed with a possible upgrade to CATOBAR down the line. But, house reports and further studies show that nearly all CATOBAR studies were forgotten about by 2004. It was sold as a minor upgrade worth less than 500M for two ships. Last talks from 2010-12 show it at 2 billion per ship. British armed forces are being forced to choose between upgrading their Trident SLBMs and buying new F-35As due to budget issues. Newly released budget talks for up to 2030 are not any better. They don't have the money for such a program. They will take their F-35Bs, say thank you and be happy that they are even allowed to have them. Their latest studies in that "Project Ark Royal" all came down to operating the Mojave from QE, that's it.

 

[Khagan1923]

Only non American aligned navies with a carrier not using it will likely be France and Turkey.

I would not be so sure about Turkey btw.

I think if the F-35 situation is fixed and F-35A are ordered we will see the Navy take the F-35B into realistic consideration for the future MUG.

 

[Pokemonte13]

I would not be so sure about Turkey btw.

I think if the F-35 situation is fixed and F-35A are ordered we will see the Navy take the F-35B into realistic consideration for the future MUG.

I think if we can get f35s than maybe the Americans would be ready to sell us their catapult tech that way navy could order f35C. But depends on the price they offer

 

[Saithan]

Too much talk about F35.

I agree that UK won't be ordering Hürjet. Just not how they do it.

UK who developed the Harrier are the best to judge whether F35B is failed or not. And like the old Harrier documentary I've shared in the past says. The F35B is insanely easier to use than Harrier.

I believe that with Spain as part of the Hürjet our trainer has a real chance of become something more than a historic moment. Because while we succeed in many things PR and follow through with solid production line on just isn't on a level that would give it justice.

We're not in any good standing with nations around us or anywhere, so let's hope Hürjet doesn't end like a footnote in history due to our governments mistakes.

 

[mTT]

View attachment 75178

Bro, how's the world tour going?

From these countries they only buy Hürjet as Qatar (friendly country), Spain (partner).

 

[Zafer]

Bro, how's the world tour going?

From these countries they only buy Hürjet as Qatar (friendly country), Spain (partner).

Those countries are candidate countries that were known to be close to buying or are looking into buying or simply who need to buy a trainer or a light combat aircraft. Simply put their names are cited as candidates for the Korean plane. Not all of them are included, I included them selectively. Otherwise there are like twice as many candidates. If you also factor in the upcoming Baykar engine the list can go to as far as the number of export drone users. So it will be exciting to map them. But this whole thing can take like a decade. So the world tour will be broadcast in seasons and episodes.

 

[Sanchez]

buy Hürjet as Qatar (friendly country)

Qatar operates pretty new Hawks and M346s. Hawks were delivered only few years ago and are based in UK in another joint RAF/Qatar squadron, while the Masters are based in Italy within IFTS. It's a small country with a small air force, they offload a big part of their training to others. They won't order Hürjet anytime soon, they have no need for it.

I wish the IFTS would have materialized in Konya instead, we missed big time there.

 

[Zafer]

Qatar operates pretty new Hawks and M346s. Hawks were delivered only few years ago and are based in UK in another joint RAF/Qatar squadron, while the Masters are based in Italy within IFTS. It's a small country with a small air force, they offload a big part of their training to others. They won't order Hürjet anytime soon, they have no need for it.

I wish the IFTS would have materialized in Konya instead, we missed big time there.

Hürjet LCA can be attractive, with Turkish everything.

 

[Sanchez]

Hürjet LCA can be attractive, with Turkish everything.

For a country with near infinite money and tiny manpower pool, any kind of small fighter is meaningless. Kaan sure, Hürjet LCA, no way.

 

[mTT]

Those countries are candidate countries that were known to be close to buying or are looking into buying or simply who need to buy a trainer or a light combat aircraft. Simply put their name are cited for candidates for the Korean plane.

Poland, Malaysia, Indonesia have chosen South Korea as their training jet, orders have been placed and deliveries are being made. (The last delivery will be to Poland in 2028)

Qatar operates pretty new Hawks and M346s. Hawks were delivered only few years ago and are based in UK in another joint RAF/Qatar squadron, while the Masters are based in Italy within IFTS. It's a small country with a small air force, they offload a big part of their training to others. They won't order Hürjet anytime soon, they have no need for it.

I wish the IFTS would have materialized in Konya instead, we missed big time there.

Qatar does not order according to its needs, if it orders according to its needs, it does not need to buy airplanes for 20 years.

 

[Zafer]

Hürjet LCA is to be used by foreign pilots defending Qatar when numbers matter. Easy on maintenance unlike a stealth fighter. Money does not always solve problems as you can not turn money into problem solving in a short time. I would have them if I were them. Also money may not last too long. Qatar's money come from LNG and other countries have started LNG business which shrinks Qatar's market. Also as a modern fighter I would make Hürjet an optionally manned fighter unlike other options Qatar has.

 

[Zafer]

Poland, Malaysia, Indonesia have chosen South Korea as their training jet, orders have been placed and deliveries are being made. (The last delivery will be to Poland in 2028)

Poland has some complaints though about some new systems integration. While at the same time Poland has strong cooperation with Türkiye. And who knows if Koreans can stomach palm oil well like we can. Indonesia is reluctant on paying money to Koreans while they have started going bigger with Türkiye. So, possibilities everywhere.

 

[Pokemonte13]

Is the current engine of Hürjet suitable, if you would want to make something like a EA-18 Growler out of Hürjet?

For single engine jet that uses the old f404 and not the better f414 it would be difficult but its possible i mean if akinci can be equiped with ew than hürjet can be to/problem is the power generation.

 

[Yasar_TR]

QE class ships were originally designed with a possible upgrade to CATOBAR down the line. But, house reports and further studies show that nearly all CATOBAR studies were forgotten about by 2004. It was sold as a minor upgrade worth less than 500M for two ships. Last talks from 2010-12 show it at 2 billion per ship. British armed forces are being forced to choose between upgrading their Trident SLBMs and buying new F-35As due to budget issues. Newly released budget talks for up to 2030 are not any better. They don't have the money for such a program. They will take their F-35Bs, say thank you and be happy that they are even allowed to have them. Their latest studies in that "Project Ark Royal" all came down to operating the Mojave from QE, that's it.

Bro, initial cost estimations with early 2000‘s GPB rates for the upgrade was 500million, and it was with hydraulic catapult and matching arrester wires for which the ship was constructed accordingly. Later it was thought to upgrade it to employ an EMALS. That is when price of 1billion then to 2 billion GBP became apparent. (That price overlaps well with the EMALS French are aspiring to fit on to their new Carrier by purchasing it from the Americans). UK even received a quote from General Atomics for the upgrade. But as you rightfully pointed out, UK don’t have the finances available to realise such a costly endeavour.

But it is important to make a point about the cost factors involved in CATOBAR operations, especially for where the MUGEM is involved.
If a country like UK finds it too expensive, should we really consider it at all?
As we currently have good relations with the US, may be it would be more apt to opt for the F35Bs, since they are more readily available to operate under conditions when CATOBAR planes are grounded. And cheaper to operate than CATOBAR alternatives.
That would negate the need for MUGEM too. A second LHD would be the more clever choice in that case.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

 

[Fuzuli NL]

​

Airbus jumps on the Hürjet train in Spain​

After the Airbus AFJT project for a light jet trainer has not yet progressed beyond the concept stage, the manufacturer has concluded an agreement with the Turkish group TUSAŞ (Turkish Aerospace Industries) for the tender for the Spanish Air Force, whose Hurjet is already in flight testing.

16.05.2025

TUSAŞ (Turkish Aerospace Industries) unveiled a Hurjet in the colors of the Spanish Air Force in Madrid and signed a cooperation agreement with Airbus. © Airbus

Airbus has signed a memorandum of understanding with the Turkish company TUSAŞ (Turkish Aerospace Industries) to cooperate in the replacement of the Spanish Air Force's (Ejército del Aire y del Espacio) 19 SF-5M jet trainers. Under this agreement, TAI's advanced single-engine supersonic Hürjet training aircraft will serve as the basis for a proposal for the Ejército del Aire. Under the agreement, some structural components of the Hürjet could also be produced in Spain.
In addition to the Hurjet, several potential competitors were already being evaluated at Torrejon Air Base, including the Boeing T-7A Red Hawk, the KAI T-50, and the Leonardo M-346. The Hurjet arrived in Spain in August 2024, as AeroBuzz reported.
To launch the initiative at the Spanish arms fair FEINDEF'25 in Madrid, a scale model of the Hürjet in the colors of the Ejército del Aire y del Espacio was exhibited.
TUSAŞ has been developing the jet trainer since 2017 and launched the Hurjet in April 2023. The model is currently undergoing flight testing for certification by the Turkish authorities. The first production aircraft was originally scheduled to be delivered to the Turkish Armed Forces in 2023.
TAI has published the following specifications for the Hürjet: length 13.60 meters; wingspan 9.50 meters; wing area 35 square meters; height 5.10 meters; and takeoff engine thrust 17,000 lb (75.6 kN). According to the manufacturer, the calculated service ceiling is 45,000 feet (13,716 meters) and the range 1,400 nautical miles (2,592 kilometers). TAI specifies the maximum speed as Mach 1.2.

Airbus springt in Spanien auf den Hürjet-Zug auf - Aerobuzz.de

Nachdem das Airbus-Projekt AFJT eines leichten Jet-Trainers bislang nicht über das Konzept-Stadium hinaus gekommen ist, hat der Hersteller für die Ausschreibung der spanischen Luftstreitkräfte eine Vereinbarung mit dem türkischen Konzern […]

aerobuzz.de

 

[Sanchez]

"The two companies signed a memorandum of understanding (MOU) on May 14 at the Feindef defense exhibition in Madrid. Under the arrangement, Airbus will lead—as national industry coordinator—a team of Spanish companies to adapt the platform to meet the Spanish Air Force’s Advanced Jet Trainer Aircraft and Integrated Training System - Combat (ITS-C) program.

Other companies involved include Aciturri, Aernnova, Aertec, Airtificial, Amper, Centum, Cesa, Clue, GMV, Grabysur, Indra, ITP Aero, Grupo Oesía, Orbital and Sener....

Airbus states that the project will not only support the modernization of the Spanish Air Force, but also nationalize the country’s flight training system, strengthen Spain’s national industry and reinforce defense ties between Spain and Turkey—which were illustrated by the significant presence of Turkish companies at this year’s edition of Feindef.

The project also aims to “meet the challenges posed by the growing operational demand for modern training aircraft,” Airbus said...."

Airbus, Turkish Aerospace Team Up On Hurjet For Spain | Aviation Week

Airbus will support TAI in developing the Hurjet to meet a requirement to replace the Spanish Air Force's Northrop SF-5 lead-in fighter training aircraft.

aviationweek.com

 

[I_Love_F16]

"The two companies signed a memorandum of understanding (MOU) on May 14 at the Feindef defense exhibition in Madrid. Under the arrangement, Airbus will lead—as national industry coordinator—a team of Spanish companies to adapt the platform to meet the Spanish Air Force’s Advanced Jet Trainer Aircraft and Integrated Training System - Combat (ITS-C) program.

Other companies involved include Aciturri, Aernnova, Aertec, Airtificial, Amper, Centum, Cesa, Clue, GMV, Grabysur, Indra, ITP Aero, Grupo Oesía, Orbital and Sener....

Airbus states that the project will not only support the modernization of the Spanish Air Force, but also nationalize the country’s flight training system, strengthen Spain’s national industry and reinforce defense ties between Spain and Turkey—which were illustrated by the significant presence of Turkish companies at this year’s edition of Feindef.

The project also aims to “meet the challenges posed by the growing operational demand for modern training aircraft,” Airbus said...."

Airbus, Turkish Aerospace Team Up On Hurjet For Spain | Aviation Week

Airbus will support TAI in developing the Hurjet to meet a requirement to replace the Spanish Air Force's Northrop SF-5 lead-in fighter training aircraft.

aviationweek.com

I’m wondering what TAI is actually gaining in this project ? As I understand it, we are not really ‘’exporting or selling’’ Hurjet, but, sharing the design with them so they can modify it and adapt it for their needs. So this project is about ‘’europeanizing’’ Hurjet, like you rightfully stated before.

But concretely, what are we gaining from this ?

 

[No Name]

I’m wondering what TAI is actually gaining in this project ? As I understand it, we are not really ‘’exporting or selling’’ Hurjet, but, sharing the design with them so they can modify it and adapt it for their needs. So this project is about ‘’europeanizing’’ Hurjet, like you rightfully stated before.

But concretely, what are we gaining from this ?

Royalties, reputation and probably an opening to sell the KAAN as well as the loyal wingman program sometime in the future.

The Hurjet and Anka 3 have already been integrated, thus Spain may be forced into buying Turkish drone systems to train in joint fighter jet and unmanned drone operations. This will increase the chances of them buying the KAAN, thus integrating them into the Turkish aviation ecosystem, at least that is what I believe to be the case. I would love to hear if other community members have a better take.

I should also point out that it might also be Turkey's way of rewarding Spain for being Turkey's biggest Ally within NATO, as Spain helped develop Turkey's naval programs.

 

[Sanchez]

I’m wondering what TAI is actually gaining in this project ? As I understand it, we are not really ‘’exporting or selling’’ Hurjet, but, sharing the design with them so they can modify it and adapt it for their needs. So this project is about ‘’europeanizing’’ Hurjet, like you rightfully stated before.

But concretely, what are we gaining from this ?

TAI is gaining a partner nation and an industry giant to further develop the platform. If Spain puts the 25 aircraft order that's mentioned, we should remember that Spain will have the largest Hürjet order on the books, not TurAF and that makes sure whatever TurAF ends up doing, Hürjet remains a viable project financially. TAI doesn't have the experience Airbus or Leonardo have in creating, maintaining and operating the training system that is needed for these aircraft by itself. Spain wants industry participation as it needs its own companies to make money and thrive.

Production model is not yet made public. I've seen reported that at least some of the Spanish Hürjets would still be built by TAI to Spanish specifications. We don't know if this is a Spain specific model with Spanish subsystems or a larger redesign that will be different than Hürjet to warrant a new classification.