Indonesia Indonesian Air Force, Tentara Nasional Indonesia-Angkatan Udara (TNI-AU)

[Lordimperator]

US got some progress but not the French

So No Florence parly for indo and malay for this January?

 

[R4duga]

edited by mod: Progress of the H225M simulator facility

last warning: use English caption as per forum rules

 

[Madokafc]

Chronologically:
Eagle 2: US mindef postpone his visit, but Boeing representatives visit our US embassy.
Rafale: opportunity to sign the deal got postponed AGAIN. (The first one at Dubai airshow)

So US got some progress but not the French?

You know, how many Times i said to not take his tweet seriously

There is many errr here and there

 

[Lordimperator]

how many Times i said to not take his tweet seriously

Allright mate

 

[Mandala]

"KF-21 Prototype Unit 4 with a golden arrow pattern on a black background. KAI plans to choose the one that looks the most inconspicuous and cool in the air after different base paints and patterns for each prototype."

KF-21 Prototype Unit 3:

여차하면 스텔스로 둔갑한다…中·러 '눈'보다 뛰어난 KF-21 [김민석 배틀그라운드] : zum 뉴스

올 3월부터 지상 활주로 시험 시작<br/>스텔스 전환 준비도 국과연과 준비<br/>중국도 겁낼 전투기, 수출 전망 커

m.news.zum.com

 

[Mandala]

Some screenshots from the video below. Unfortunately the video is in Korean.

Looks like this is the KF-21 two-seater variant:

 

[Umigami]

"KF-21 Prototype Unit 4 with a golden arrow pattern on a black background. KAI plans to choose the one that looks the most inconspicuous and cool in the air after different base paints and patterns for each prototype."

KF-21 Prototype Unit 3:

여차하면 스텔스로 둔갑한다…中·러 '눈'보다 뛰어난 KF-21 [김민석 배틀그라운드] : zum 뉴스

올 3월부터 지상 활주로 시험 시작<br/>스텔스 전환 준비도 국과연과 준비<br/>중국도 겁낼 전투기, 수출 전망 커

m.news.zum.com

Not necessarily related to TNI AU, but okay...

KF21 is surprisingly bigger than F35, but why has less internal fuel?

"The KF-21 is also equipped with functions such as automatic posture recovery, automatic terrain tracking, automatic terrain collision avoidance, and automatic steering."
Auto GCAS?

 

[Lordimperator]

Not necessarily related to TNI AU, but okay...

View attachment 38913
KF21 is surprisingly bigger than F35, but why has less internal fuel?

Your attachment cannot be seen

 

[Umigami]

Your attachment cannot be seen

Done

 

[Mandala]

KF-21 Prototype Unit 4 with the black and gold tail pattern is the two-seater vaiant.

KF-21 two-seater variant:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1485090183251120129

A close up view of the tail pattern on both KF-21:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1485095360955842560

 

[Mandala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1485134025262084100

 

[Umigami]

How may prototype Korean build?
Is it possible ours already on this queue?

 

[Mandala]

How may prototype Korean build?
Is it possible ours already on this queue?
View attachment 38916

Cmiiw i once read an article and if i'm not mistaken its would be 6 prototypes. Indonesia to get 1 prototype.

If you look carefully from the blurry pic there are unpainted KF-21 Boramaes being constructed in the background. It could be Prototype Unit 5 & Unit 6.

 

[flogger]

Have we paid the overdue kfx bill...?

 

[Umigami]

Have we paid the overdue kfx bill...?

Disepakati Sisa Pembayaran Proyek KF-21 Boramae (KFX/IFX), Indonesia Cicil Selama Lima Tahun

Meski Bendera Merah Putih tertera dalam prototipe KF-21 Boramae (KFX) yang diluncurkan pada 9 April 2021 di Sancheon, namun urusan negosiasi atas sisa pembayaran dana pengembangan KFX/IFX yang harus ditanggung Indonesia, belum juga tuntas. Baca juga: Ada Bendera “Merah Putih” di Prototipe...

www.indomiliter.com

MoD were suppose to be communicating with MoF to came out with this kind of deal, right?

 

[Umigami]

Cmiiw i once read an article and if i'm not mistaken its would be 6 prototypes. Indonesia to get 1 prototype.

If you look carefully from the blurry pic there are unpainted KF-21 Boramaes being constructed in the background. It could be Prototype Unit 5 & Unit 6.

View attachment 38918

As of now, 8 prototype aircraft are being assembled simultaneously and four of them are already in late or final stages. 6 will be used for flight testing while 2 will be used for ground testing. 2 prototypes will be two-seater variants.

Check out the latest photos from KAI assembly line featuring KF-X 4.5 gen fighter - The Aviation Geek Club

Check out the latest photos from KAI assembly line featuring KF-X 4.5 gen fighter

theaviationgeekclub.com

So we get the 9th one.

 

[FPXAllen]

KF21 is surprisingly bigger than F35, but why has less internal fuel?

Twin engine

 

[Mandala]

As of now, 8 prototype aircraft are being assembled simultaneously and four of them are already in late or final stages. 6 will be used for flight testing while 2 will be used for ground testing. 2 prototypes will be two-seater variants.

Check out the latest photos from KAI assembly line featuring KF-X 4.5 gen fighter - The Aviation Geek Club

Check out the latest photos from KAI assembly line featuring KF-X 4.5 gen fighter

theaviationgeekclub.com

So we get the 9th one.

I see.

 

[Nilgiri]

KF21 is surprisingly bigger than F35, but why has less internal fuel?

F-35 has much higher MTOW and thus much larger mass-range (MTOW - empty weight) to play with.

i.e F35-A:

MTOW = 31.7 tons
Empty weight = 13.3 tons
Fuel capacity = 8.3 tons

Don't let the raw volumetric size of aircrafts fool you.

About 45% of that range is max internal fuel

i.e 8.3/ (31.7 - 13.3) = 0.45

KF-21 fuel ratio/mass range:

KAI KF-21 Boramae - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Prototype around 30%, and gets bumped up to about 40% in production.

Conventional (4th gen) fighters have this % around 30 - 33% typically.

Other 5th gen fighters (like F-35) tend to have it around 45%*.

It comes intrinsically somewhat with incorporating internal weapon bay on fuselage and RCS blended planform for stealth at same time.

i.e naturally leads to a higher cross-coefficient for fuel capacity compared to conventional fuselage (and external hardpoints only) found in 4th gen and earlier

KF-21 by blending 4th and 5th gen....has RCS-reduction planform but no internal weapon bay...thus comes up around 40% max fuel fraction (of total buffer) for its current production block series. i.e somewhere between the two.

Likely bumps up to closer to 45% in subsequent blocks that go for internal weapon bay and shift to 5th gen design philosophy etc.

*J-20 which is really more 5th gen fighter-bomber gets it to 60% even... given its beefy + long fuselage (21 m long) from the large weapons bay + range req. etc.

 

[Umigami]

F-35 has much higher MTOW and thus much larger mass-range (MTOW - empty weight) to play with.

i.e F35-A:

MTOW = 31.7 tons
Empty weight = 13.3 tons
Fuel capacity = 8.3 tons

Don't let the raw volumetric size of aircrafts fool you.

About 45% of that range is max internal fuel

i.e 8.3/ (31.7 - 13.3) = 0.45

KF-21 fuel ratio/mass range:

KAI KF-21 Boramae - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Prototype around 30%, and gets bumped up to about 40% in production.

Conventional (4th gen) fighters have this % around 30 - 33% typically.

Other 5th gen fighters (like F-35) tend to have it around 45%*.

It comes intrinsically somewhat with incorporating internal weapon bay on fuselage and RCS blended planform for stealth at same time.

i.e naturally leads to a higher cross-coefficient for fuel capacity compared to conventional fuselage (and external hardpoints only) found in 4th gen and earlier

KF-21 by blending 4th and 5th gen....has RCS-reduction planform but no internal weapon bay...thus comes up around 40% max fuel fraction (of total buffer) for its current production block series. i.e somewhere between the two.

Likely bumps up to closer to 45% in subsequent blocks that go for internal weapon bay and shift to 5th gen design philosophy etc.

*J-20 which is really more 5th gen fighter-bomber gets it to 60% even... given its beefy + long fuselage (21 m long) from the large weapons bay + range req. etc.

So in Layman's term?
In a clean configuration and full of fuel internally, who got more range?