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Anastasius

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I'll be interested to see if Assad actually upholds his end of the deal. PKK/YPG has been in cahoots with him, Iranians and Russians plenty of times so this seems foolish. And as someone else said, this effectively means all of Syria that doesn't wanna live under Assad's control will now flee to Turkey.
 

GoatsMilk

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I'll be interested to see if Assad actually upholds his end of the deal. PKK/YPG has been in cahoots with him, Iranians and Russians plenty of times so this seems foolish. And as someone else said, this effectively means all of Syria that doesn't wanna live under Assad's control will now flee to Turkiye.

He won't, its a dumb deal where Turkey loses every card she has while she took massive costs and blows over the syrian civil war. There is no way in hell that can be a deal, has to be made up.
 
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Xenon54

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The Turkish-Syrian agreement according to the Damascus sources (take it with a grain of salt),

1) Turkiye will withdraw from Syria.
2) Turkiye will respect Syrian sovereignty
3) Turkiye and Russia will open the M4 international highway from Latakia to Aleppo.
4) PKK/YPG is a tool of the US and Israel
5) PKK/YPG is the biggest threat to both Syria and Turkiye
6) Syrian-Turkish joint committees will be formed for implementation and observation.
I hope thats fake, imagine our government agreed to it, it not very hard to imagine so im a little bit affraid
 

Lool

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The Turkish-Syrian agreement according to the Damascus sources (take it with a grain of salt),

1) Turkiye will withdraw from Syria.
2) Turkiye will respect Syrian sovereignty
3) Turkiye and Russia will open the M4 international highway from Latakia to Aleppo.
4) PKK/YPG is a tool of the US and Israel
5) PKK/YPG is the biggest threat to both Syria and Turkiye
6) Syrian-Turkish joint committees will be formed for implementation and observation.
Those are the same sources which claimed that Putin is winning in Ukraine thx to Assad's help and would have lost the war without the mighty's Assad help during the early months of the war🤣🤣😂😂

Assad, his media, govt, and army are truly a bunch of clowns
 

GoatsMilk

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I hope thats fake, imagine our government agreed to it, it not very hard to imagine so im a little bit affraid

thats the problem with this administration that even when you see really bad deals, you half worry that this government takes it. Just like the terrible refugee deal that screwed Turkey and took away her only leverage to deal with syria. But Turkey filling with migrants is good for AK party they can buy votes with the taxpayers money by providing for them.
 

GoatsMilk

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If this is true we will have a new refugee wave unless we shoot into the crowds of fleeing Syrians.

If the retreat is on the condition of PKK being gone, that's a little more understandable. But still. REFUGEES!

Only a muppet could believe the PKK will be gone, they are not gone in Iraq or Iran, but they are going to be gone in the nation that was most friendly to their cause. Don't forget how Ocalan was given VIP status by the Assad regime in the past. We quite rightly could have gone to war with Syria in the past over it, i would argue today that their support for the PKK is stronger now then it was then.

This is what you do now, you tell the Turkish nation of the threats facing the nation and what the enemies may do. You then tell the Russians to Foff from northern syria, you give them 48hours, if at any moment it looks like they are going to pull a Manbij on us where they hand over their positions to the americans, you strike and dont wait. If it has to be all out war with Russia, then it has to be that way. Lets stop running from the fight that is critical to the welfare of the nation, the people of the region and the religion of islam itself.

Then when it comes to american side you do everything to make it difficult for them, for one you constantly strike the pkk positions and the pkk oil facilities. You never relent just like the Russians never relented from bombing Turkish controlled regions in syria.

Only a moron especially after watching these last 10 years will think that anything can be achieved for Turks via talking.

If this deal takes place expect another name change like ypg to sdf and then Turks can cry for many more years to come arguing with the enemies that its really the pkk and not a different organisation.

But is absolutely incredible that while Putin is burying his nation over Ukraine and setting the ground work for what potentially could be the complete collapse of the federation, yet erdogan cannot get us an inch over syria. If he can't achieve now, then he was never going to achieve in the past when things were going good for Russia.

And guys refugees are not going back, not only is not feasible unless Turkey controls the land, AK party needs these migrants for votes and demographic change to suit an islamist authotarian/socialist agenda.
 

Palaman

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The Turkish-Syrian agreement according to the Damascus sources (take it with a grain of salt),

1) Turkiye will withdraw from Syria.
2) Turkiye will respect Syrian sovereignty
3) Turkiye and Russia will open the M4 international highway from Latakia to Aleppo.
4) PKK/YPG is a tool of the US and Israel
5) PKK/YPG is the biggest threat to both Syria and Turkiye
6) Syrian-Turkish joint committees will be formed for implementation and observation.
No such statement has been received from the Turkish and Russian government yet.
 

Anastasius

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Translation: "The free man who does not want the humiliating reconciliation and possesses the lowest necessities of action, let him work seriously to open the path of liberation to Damascus, here is the uprising and this victory, and overthrow the projects of surrender and murderous humiliation."

This is from the founder of the Free Syrian Army. Apparently there's also a video floating around of Syrian anti-government protestors condemning the Turkish withdrawal and rumors that the US is negotiating with the FSA to take over in establishing rebel strongholds in Syria and is planning to throw YPG/PKK/PYD/y'know-those-guys under the bus in favor of getting someone more "acceptable" for Turkish national security interests.

Take this with a grain of salt but it's starting to seem that yes, an agreement has in fact been reached for withdrawal.

BONUS: A Dutch journalist reporting on Syria has been receiving death threats from PKK accounts based in places from Syria to France.


 
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GoatsMilk

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Translation: "The free man who does not want the humiliating reconciliation and possesses the lowest necessities of action, let him work seriously to open the path of liberation to Damascus, here is the uprising and this victory, and overthrow the projects of surrender and murderous humiliation."

This is from the founder of the Free Syrian Army. Apparently there's also a video floating around of Syrian anti-government protestors condemning the Turkish withdrawal and rumors that the US is negotiating with the FSA to take over in establishing rebel strongholds in Syria and is planning to throw YPG/PKK/PYD/y'know-those-guys under the bus in favor of getting someone more "acceptable" for Turkish national security interests.

Take this with a grain of salt but it's starting to seem that yes, an agreement has in fact been reached for withdrawal.

BONUS: A Dutch journalist reporting on Syria has been receiving death threats from PKK accounts based in places from Syria to France.



These plans make no sense from a Turkish perspective, unless Turkey wants to lose.

Everyone gets to stay there, Russia, USA, Iran, but Turkey has to leave? Makes no sense.

So far everything i'm seen seems like something only a mad man could agree too.

Not one previous agreement was upheld by Russia or the USA concerning Turkey, but now we are too believe that if Turkey withdraws all her concerns will be taken into account? Makes no sense.

All americans have to is work with NATO's second largest army who shares a 900km border with Syria. That way you resolve it very quickly and easy. If they dont want to work with a NATO ally but see PKK communist terrorists as allies over you, then they defacto show you they are your enemy.
 

Anastasius

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These plans make no sense from a Turkish perspective, unless Turkiye wants to lose.

Everyone gets to stay there, Russia, USA, Iran, but Turkiye has to leave? Makes no sense.

So far everything i'm seen seems like something only a mad man could agree too.

Not one previous agreement was upheld by Russia or the USA concerning Turkiye, but now we are too believe that if Turkiye withdraws all her concerns will be taken into account? Makes no sense.

All americans have to is work with NATO's second largest army who shares a 900km border with Syria. That way you resolve it very quickly and easy. If they dont want to work with a NATO ally but see PKK communist terrorists as allies over you, then they defacto show you they are your enemy.
If I may interject, it seems, SEEMS, like the US may be getting tired of PKK trying to suck up to Assad, Russia and Iran and having to have their incompetent asses bailed out when they fail to get ISIS under control and think the FSA might be a better bet as a proxy force (I mean, US did recently give credit to FSA for killing al-Qurayshi). Also I think the US is getting ready to have Assad removed permanently (not like the meme "Who needs to go?" but actually make Assad go) and they need the Syrian rebels for that not a bunch of Marxist separatist extremists.

I also disagree that this is necessarily bad from a Turkish perspective IF my analysis is correct because it means that Syria becomes the US' and friends' problem, PKK threat is effectively neutralized and Turkey gets to withdraw from that hellhole and possibly get rid of refugees/migrants if my guess that the US intends to back FSA more heavily to knock down Assad is true. Let's face it, an invasion of Syria to depose Assad like some were clamoring for wasn't going to be a cakewalk, it would have been difficult, resulted in thousands of Turkish lives lost and Turkey would have been stuck having to babysit an entire country which now doesn't even have a functional government, no matter how shitty the previous one was. Turkey has been having a difficult enough time trying to babysit a couple of vastly smaller rebel regions in which Turkey was established while the country was economically in a much stronger place.
 

GoatsMilk

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couldn't disagree more.

As far as the USA is concerned its in Turkeys long term interest to make sure they leave syria and iraq completely eventually. Everything they have done in those nations has been to undermine Turkey.

As far as Syria is concerned, i dont think it matters whether assad stays or not, what matters to Turkey is northern syria, its best that entire region comes under Turkish control. I got no issue with it remaining in totality as part of Syria, but the Turkish army must be able to exist and operate freely there.
 

Anastasius

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couldn't disagree more.

As far as the USA is concerned its in Turkeys long term interest to make sure they leave syria and iraq completely eventually. Everything they have done in those nations has been to undermine Turkiye.

As far as Syria is concerned, i dont think it matters whether assad stays or not, what matters to Turkiye is northern syria, its best that entire region comes under Turkish control. I got no issue with it remaining in totality as part of Syria, but the Turkish army must be able to exist and operate freely there.
No offence but you overestimate the extent to which the US gives a f**k about Turkey. Not everything the US does in the region is some 5D chess to screw Turkey. In the case of PKK, not even the entire US establishment was ever on board with backing them.

What matters in Syria and particularly northern Syria to Turkey is that there isn’t an actively hostile extremist entity parked right outside its borders. FSA taking over these regions with US blessing (if I’m correct in my analysis) would be extremely beneficial to Turkish national security and easing the refugee burden without Turkey needing to waste resources and manpower on that region.
 

GoatsMilk

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No offence but you overestimate the extent to which the US gives a f**k about Turkiye. Not everything the US does in the region is some 5D chess to screw Turkiye. In the case of PKK, not even the entire US establishment was ever on board with backing them.

What matters in Syria and particularly northern Syria to Turkiye is that there isn’t an actively hostile extremist entity parked right outside its borders. FSA taking over these regions with US blessing (if I’m correct in my analysis) would be extremely beneficial to Turkish national security and easing the refugee burden without Turkiye needing to waste resources and manpower on that region.

like i say i couldn't disagree more with you, i actually think your wrong on all points.

The US gives enough of a fk about Turkey that will even work with Russia against Turkey, as witnessed over and over again in syria. Just like when Turkey moved on al bab and both the USA and Russia moved in unison together to cut Turkey off. Or when Turkey was finally going to move on the american controlled manbic and eastern syria only for the americans to allow the Russians to take over the positions instead of NATO ally Turkey. Moves to protect the PKK who are allied with Assad and Iran.

Whats so special about stinky pkk communists in syria that will drive even the USA and Russia to work together against Turkey? lets not be naive as to what's happening here.

Azeri's made that mistake in thinking the west cared about them, then when you moved on the Armenian occupiers the west made you out to be the bad guys. And Azerbajian is nothing compared to what Turkey is to them.

The reality is that we are one of the few active military nations on earth who doesn't follow to the tune of america or russia, that makes us a great concern to them.
 
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Ryder

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No offence but you overestimate the extent to which the US gives a f**k about Turkiye. Not everything the US does in the region is some 5D chess to screw Turkiye. In the case of PKK, not even the entire US establishment was ever on board with backing them.

What matters in Syria and particularly northern Syria to Turkiye is that there isn’t an actively hostile extremist entity parked right outside its borders. FSA taking over these regions with US blessing (if I’m correct in my analysis) would be extremely beneficial to Turkish national security and easing the refugee burden without Turkiye needing to waste resources and manpower on that region.

Usa backstabbed the FSA for the pkk/Ypg.

Usa cant be trusted.
 

GoatsMilk

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Usa backstabbed the FSA for the pkk/Ypg.

Usa cant be trusted.

If you pay attention to how the Arab rebels were armed they were never intended to win anything, just to create chaos and destruction. Enough to potentially break assads control over the northern regions to allow the PKK project to ferment.

For example they were never given something as simple as manpads.

It was so so obvious what the aim was for Syria, i used to point it out before the war even started to people i knew. Now they see the reality that they failed to understand back then.
 

Knowledgeseeker

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If you pay attention to how the Arab rebels were armed they were never intended to win anything, just to create chaos and destruction. Enough to potentially break assads control over the northern regions to allow the PKK project to ferment.

For example they were never given something as simple as manpads.

It was so so obvious what the aim was for Syria, i used to point it out before the war even started to people i knew. Now they see the reality that they failed to understand back then.
Time to give some Sungur to the SNA in syria?
 

GoatsMilk

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Time to give some Sungur to the SNA in syria?

The first day erdogan decided to join the rebel cause stingers should have been supplied. The YPG have manpads supplied from russia and american in big numbers. when we first hit afrin the ypg infestation, the jets had to bomb from heights behind manpad range.

Why is that? Why did the legitimate rebel movement never get manpads or serious anti air systems but the ypg/pkk did?

Only reason i can think is that no one actually wanted the rebels to win.
 

Knowledgeseeker

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The first day erdogan decided to join the rebel cause stingers should have been supplied. The YPG have manpads supplied from russia and american in big numbers. when we first hit afrin the ypg infestation, the jets had to bomb from heights behind manpad range.

Why is that? Why did the legitimate rebel movement never get manpads or serious anti air systems but the ypg/pkk did?

Only reason i can think is that no one actually wanted the rebels to win.
If the SNA had manpads the russians would bomb from high alltitude missing their targets by atleast 1 km😂 Seriosly they should get alot of manpads, aswell as anti tank missiles. The western world are proffesionals in using proxies around the world. Turkey should do the same method. Tell them to attack, and when the big powers around the world complain to turkey, then Turkey should shake their head just like the americans are doing with PKK.
 

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