TR Navy Naval Programs

[Pokemonte13]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/2102310564122833295

Did i miss something or wasnt it supposed to be 1+3 Tepe

 

[uçuyorum]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/2102310564122833295

Did i miss something or wasnt it supposed to be 1+3 Tepe

Started as 4+4, was reduced to 4+3 last I saw.

 

[Burberryswine]

we prob need at least 8 if not 12 or even 14 3 for MUGEMs task force, 2-3 for Anadolu and another 2-3 for a future LHD thats 7-9 ships just as escorts and if u account for ships being maintained etc. so another 2 ships for that adds up to 9-11 and well it would be nice to have some destroyers to secure the Aegean and the med as well ofc our task forces wont be projecting power continents away most of the time so i might js be overexaggerating the numbers we need but imo at least 12 ships would be nice to have esp if they are planning another (possibly nuclear powered) carrier

 

[Yasar_TR]

so i might js be overexaggerating the numbers we need but imo at least 12 ships would be nice to have esp if they are planning another (possibly nuclear powered) carrier

Bro, these destroyers are essentially air defence destroyers. For escort duties 1 destroyer should suffice. Two would be OK but instead of two destroyers two frigates, one ASW specialised and one general purpose with the destroyer and a submarine or two should be enough as a carrier group. Standard complement of US carrier group is 2 destroyers and a frigate with a nuclear attack submarine (not ballistic missile one). Any additions are “mission” related.
Looking at the future planning of navy ; 4 Tepe Class ships are plenty. Remaining units should be mid weight, but heavier than İstif class frigates, smaller versions of Tepe Class as per @Anmdt has pointed out earlier @ post #6479 in below page.

Naval Programs

Chinese had already had YJ-20 on Type 055s; last month they tested it on a smaller Type 052D. New 054B maybe have VLS capability also.

defencehub.live

 

[AlperTunga]

Bro, these destroyers are essentially air defence destroyers. For escort duties 1 destroyer should suffice. Two would be OK but instead of two destroyers two frigates, one ASW specialised and one general purpose with the destroyer and a submarine or two should be enough as a carrier group. Standard complement of US carrier group is 2 destroyers and a frigate with a nuclear attack submarine (not ballistic missile one). Any additions are “mission” related.
Looking at the future planning of navy ; 4 Tepe Class ships are plenty. Remaining units should be mid weight, but heavier than İstif class frigates, smaller versions of Tepe Class as per @Anmdt has pointed out earlier @ post #6479 in below page.

Naval Programs

Chinese had already had YJ-20 on Type 055s; last month they tested it on a smaller Type 052D. New 054B maybe have VLS capability also.

defencehub.live

Is it a good idea to invest in the design of a new ship between Istif (113m) and Tepe (149m). Fremm is with 144m almost the same size as Tepe. We will save only marginally from material costs. But we will get a platform with wide range, flexible to use 32 or 64 Midlas, more capacity for crew, USV, and UAV or ASW capability. We can try to save from radar maybe a bit or any other high cost item where we can afford to slightly downgrade in terms of performance but designing a brand new ship of around 135m does not sound time efficient.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Is it a good idea to invest in the design of a new ship between Istif (113m) and Tepe (149m). Fremm is with 144m almost the same size as Tepe. We will save only marginally from material costs. But we will get a platform with wide range, flexible to use 32 or 64 Midlas, more capacity for crew, USV, and UAV or ASW capability. We can try to save from radar maybe a bit or any other high cost item where we can afford to slightly downgrade in terms of performance but designing a brand new ship of around 135m does not sound time efficient.

If you read the earlier posts of @Anmdt regarding Tepe, İstif and cost base, you will see that the cost of a ship‘s hull constitutes approximately 10-15% of a frigate’s total cost. In fact he points out that you can double the size/tonnage of an İstif hull for around 75 to 80 million dollars.

Naval Programs

In my opinion the plan is almost obvious for the future fleet, and i very much doubt I+ class at this point; 1-8 I-Class as is (2-8 is different to first hull). 1-4 Tepe (TF-2000 as is) From 5th, it will be a TF-2000 light configuration with 48 VLS. The first hull will be laid down after 1st...

defencehub.live

post #6493

Main cost is the radar. It may be between 25-30% of a vessel’s total cost. Then electronics and weapons plus engines and propulsion comes. Double the size of İstif and produce a 5500-6000 ton frigate will be nearly half the cost of a Tepe.
Tepe is nearly three times bigger than an İstif 3100 vs 8300 tonnes). It has a 21m Beam and a deeper draft with more surface height. it will cost us in excess of 1.5 billion dollars each. (Check out how much UK’s 8300 ton type45 destroyers cost them all those years ago -2003 to 2006 first ship for 1.3 billion dollars)

 

[AlperTunga]

What part of the primary tasks of the Tepe class didnt you understand?
Air defence,covering all our territory with those destroyers.
Fremm is a frigate which can be configured to many duties.
Tepe is primarely for defence,Fremm can be used for both defense and offense depending on the configuration.
You cant just cheapen the Tepe with less or different weapons,it would be costly and foolish(dumb,stupid).
Thats why we need a bigger frigate then then Istif between 4500 to 5500 tons to be used for multiple tasks.

It seems we agree that material costs are secondary. And I am not only proposing reducing weapons but also cost optimization with the radar as Yasar_TR states it accounts for a significant part of the overall cost. Indeed, the version I suggest won‘t necessarily be fuel efficient and also not that silent for ASW tasks. On the other hand it would provide some other benefits so not sure whether it is an outright stupid idea as you claim. Don’t know how quickly they can design a super optimal frigate but the Navy does not seem very interested in this at the moment. So I thought after 4 Tepe one might just continu to produce quickly couple of its lighter versions to save money but still have additional and flexible war assets.

 

[TR_123456]

Don’t know how quickly they can design a super optimal frigate

Take a look,

https://www.navalnews.com/event-news/dimdex-2022/2022/03/dimdex-2022-dearsan-shipyard-unveils-new-frigate-design/

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2026/03/turkish-kuasar-marin-unveils-5500-ton-air-defence-frigate-design/

 

[Pokemonte13]

Take a look,

https://www.navalnews.com/event-news/dimdex-2022/2022/03/dimdex-2022-dearsan-shipyard-unveils-new-frigate-design/

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2026/03/turkish-kuasar-marin-unveils-5500-ton-air-defence-frigate-design/

navy will never buy something they haven't designed themselves but i think a mid sized frigate is currently under consideration/design.
Best design would be something similar to F124 with cenk350 and naval Alp300.

 

[UkroTurk]

I really don't know ideal weight of frigate for Turkish Navy however making larger and empty frigates than required would be a different strategy. They could reserve spaces for VLS and radars.
AFAIK German frigates have less VLS than planned. Any time they could add VLS.

 

[boredaf]

AFAIK German frigates have less VLS than planned. Any time they could add VLS.

And that means those frigates would have to spend weeks to months on a dock when a war breaks out to be properly useful.

 

[Tornadoss]

And that means those frigates would have to spend weeks to months on a dock when a war breaks out to be properly useful.

It can be Fitted but not with, so it doesn't need weeks.