Pakistan Pakistan Economy Updates

[Nilgiri]

How does further inflating the real estate bubble count as productive investment?

Well if its capex driven low-income housing, there is merit to the thing...as construction sector can bring lot of jobs and creates hard assets in valuable areas of a country. Theoretically if you attract lot of sound money in productive industries or investment funds directly, you can create a large job-providing sector that does not need immense training-investment...but provide a middle bulk sector for the economy. That is for example how China created even more job pull in the cities past just the initial factories.

Problem with Pakistan is the land-mafias joined at hip to each other and the DHA khakis et al., so entire effort turns into bubble and speculation quite prematurely (even for a developing country) like you describe.

I have been sensing this since a long time ago when musharaff first took power and he visited Singapore iirc (where I was at the time), and pakistan embassy produced a full multi-page feature (in a section of the Straits Times) of industry brochures complete with musharaf-isms like Pakistan will soon beat India in IT exports and will soon beat India at space launches and this and that.

Then certain folks confirmed it for me in PDF in much more grounded sectors a country really needs to get as correct as possible.

They are outnumbered heavily by the brochure-wallahs though...and droned out or banned when they mention underlying rot that is uncomfortable.

 

[VCheng]

Not entirely unexpectedly, FATF decided to keep Pakistan in the grey list for now.

 

[Kaptaan]

Not entirely unexpectedly, FATF decided to keep Pakistan in the grey list for now.

Well, you got your smile of the day.

 

[VCheng]

Well, you got your smile of the day.

Not really. It is in Pakistan's national interests to implement the FATF plan for its own benefits. What they are asking is the correct thing, and delaying it for as long as Pakistan has is increasingly counter-productive.

 

[suryakiran]

Not really. It is in Pakistan's national interests to implement the FATF plan for its own benefits. What they are asking is the correct thing, and delaying it for as long as Pakistan has is increasingly counter-productive.

Here is a reality check. Most militaries and regimes globally are involved in some kind of militant promotion in some part of the globe. But, this is done as part of State policy.

But, the case with Pakistan is that individual players have started believing their own inner voice (which actually is nothing more than indoctrination) that what they are doing is in benefit of the State. At an individual level.

De-linking becomes all the more difficult when major individual players are involved in supporting recognised terrorst organisations.

if it was only the State, you could always change groups/tacts and the like. But, when your own citizens are involved in the fund raising, well...best of luck.

 

[Kaptaan]

Here is a reality check. Most militaries and regimes globally are involved in some kind of militant promotion in some part of the globe. But, this is done as part of State policy.

But, the case with Pakistan is that individual players have started believing their own inner voice (which actually is nothing more than indoctrination) that what they are doing is in benefit of the State. At an individual level.

De-linking becomes all the more difficult when major individual players are involved in supporting recognised terrorst organisations.

if it was only the State, you could always change groups/tacts and the like. But, when your own citizens are involved in the fund raising, well...best of luck.

10/10

 

[VCheng]

Here is a reality check. Most militaries and regimes globally are involved in some kind of militant promotion in some part of the globe. But, this is done as part of State policy.

But, the case with Pakistan is that individual players have started believing their own inner voice (which actually is nothing more than indoctrination) that what they are doing is in benefit of the State. At an individual level.

De-linking becomes all the more difficult when major individual players are involved in supporting recognised terrorst organisations.

if it was only the State, you could always change groups/tacts and the like. But, when your own citizens are involved in the fund raising, well...best of luck.

Given the above, it merely reinforces what I have said earlier: It is in Pakistan's national interests to implement the FATF plan for its own benefits.

 

[Saithan]

Saudi Arabia revives cash, oil support to Pakistan​

Riyadh to deposit $3B in Pakistan's central bank, give oil supplies worth $1.2B on deferred payments​

Aamir Latif |27.10.2021

​

KARACHI, Pakistan
Saudi Arabia has revived its financial support to Pakistan to prop up the South Asian country’s tottering economy.

Riyadh will immediately deposit $3 billion into the State Bank of Pakistan (SBP) and provide oil supplies worth $1.2 billion on deferred payments, Pakistani officials confirmed late on Tuesday night.

“The Saudi Development Fund has generously announced for Pakistan an oil deferred payments facility of $1.2 bn/annum and a $3 bn deposit with SBP,” Energy Minister Hammad Azhar said on Twitter.

“This will help ease pressures on our trade & forex accounts as a result of global commodities price surge.”

The development came during Prime Minister Imran Khan’s three-day visit to Riyadh this week, who hailed Saudi Arabia for its consistent support to Islamabad.

“I want to thank HRH Prince Mohammad bin Salman for supporting Pak with $3 bn as deposit in Pak’s central bank & financing refined petroleum product with $1.2 bn,” he said on Twitter.

“KSA (Kingdom of Saudi Arabia) has always been there for Pak in our difficult times incl now when world confronts rising commodity prices.”

In 2018, Riyadh gave $3 billion in cash and a $3 billion oil facility to Pakistan to help shore up its depleted foreign exchange reserves.

However, Islamabad had to return $2 billion of the $3 billion as relations between the two allies deteriorated, mainly on the issue of the 2019 Kuala Lumpur Summit.

The summit, backed by countries including Malaysia and Turkey, was opposed by Saudi Arabia and the UAE, who viewed it as a threat to their grip on the Muslim world.
Pakistan, which was among the initial supporters of the meeting, was forced to pull out of the summit due to Riyadh’s concerns.

Saudi Arabia revives cash, oil support to Pakistan

Riyadh to deposit $3B in Pakistan's central bank, give oil supplies worth $1.2B on deferred payments - Anadolu Ajansı

www.aa.com.tr

 

[Lonewolf]

Saudi Arabia revives cash, oil support to Pakistan​

Riyadh to deposit $3B in Pakistan's central bank, give oil supplies worth $1.2B on deferred payments​

Aamir Latif |27.10.2021

​

KARACHI, Pakistan
Saudi Arabia has revived its financial support to Pakistan to prop up the South Asian country’s tottering economy.

Riyadh will immediately deposit $3 billion into the State Bank of Pakistan (SBP) and provide oil supplies worth $1.2 billion on deferred payments, Pakistani officials confirmed late on Tuesday night.

“The Saudi Development Fund has generously announced for Pakistan an oil deferred payments facility of $1.2 bn/annum and a $3 bn deposit with SBP,” Energy Minister Hammad Azhar said on Twitter.

“This will help ease pressures on our trade & forex accounts as a result of global commodities price surge.”

The development came during Prime Minister Imran Khan’s three-day visit to Riyadh this week, who hailed Saudi Arabia for its consistent support to Islamabad.

“I want to thank HRH Prince Mohammad bin Salman for supporting Pak with $3 bn as deposit in Pak’s central bank & financing refined petroleum product with $1.2 bn,” he said on Twitter.

“KSA (Kingdom of Saudi Arabia) has always been there for Pak in our difficult times incl now when world confronts rising commodity prices.”

In 2018, Riyadh gave $3 billion in cash and a $3 billion oil facility to Pakistan to help shore up its depleted foreign exchange reserves.

However, Islamabad had to return $2 billion of the $3 billion as relations between the two allies deteriorated, mainly on the issue of the 2019 Kuala Lumpur Summit.

The summit, backed by countries including Malaysia and Turkey, was opposed by Saudi Arabia and the UAE, who viewed it as a threat to their grip on the Muslim world.
Pakistan, which was among the initial supporters of the meeting, was forced to pull out of the summit due to Riyadh’s concerns.

Saudi Arabia revives cash, oil support to Pakistan

Riyadh to deposit $3B in Pakistan's central bank, give oil supplies worth $1.2B on deferred payments - Anadolu Ajansı

www.aa.com.tr

If currency depreciation really helped that much then this wouldn't be required , cpec is quite successful ....


.....in setting up a debt trap .

@VCheng I wanna ask why the paki established keep planting many newbies on top position , like your nsa , your finance ministry ,these guys don't seem polished for their ministry , more into politics than duties . And Pakistan is huge country ,how come the bureaucracy detach from politics and keep the essential work on track like infra and market balance

 

[VCheng]

@VCheng I wanna ask why the paki established keep planting many newbies on top position , like your nsa , your finance ministry ,these guys don't seem polished for their ministry , more into politics than duties . And Pakistan is huge country ,how come the bureaucracy detach from politics and keep the essential work on track like infra and market balance

This is by design so that there can be no competence higher than relative to the military. We look only for half-wits, so that we can manipulate the other half in our way and in our own time, the rest of the world be damned. It works quite well, but only up to a point, which is the desired outcome. @Nilgiri and I have discussed this many times.

 

[Lonewolf]

This is by design so that there can be no competence higher than relative to the military. We look only for half-wits, so that we can manipulate the other half in our way and in our own time, the rest of the world be damned. It works quite well, but only up to a point, which is the desired outcome. @Nilgiri and I have discussed this many times.

Isn't it creating a huge problem ,not only on economic health but on the talent too , segregation among those blind followers and one with senses will increase , that's social divide of worst category ,where competent are minority

 

[Bilal Khan(Quwa)]

This is by design so that there can be no competence higher than relative to the military. We look only for half-wits, so that we can manipulate the other half in our way and in our own time, the rest of the world be damned. It works quite well, but only up to a point, which is the desired outcome. @Nilgiri and I have discussed this many times.

This is true. The country's best talent and most capable leaders are all abroad. We have Pakistani auditors with 30+ years of experience working on MNC, TNC and public sector books, but they're in Deloitte or PW&C, not in NAB. Likewise, we have PhD professors and R&D engineers working in US and UK aerospace, but not at SUPARCO or PAC. Unfortunately, these people don't tolerate half-day workweeks, 45-minute chai breaks, segregation between "officers" and "others" and mediocrity in product or output, so the Pakistani system rejects them. OTOH, Americans, British and even Indians are cultivating those Pakistanis into leaders.

 

[Lonewolf]

This is true. The country's best talent and most capable leaders are all abroad. We have Pakistani auditors with 30+ years of experience working on MNC, TNC and public sector books, but they're in Deloitte or PW&C, not in NAB. Likewise, we have PhD professors and R&D engineers working in US and UK aerospace, but not at SUPARCO or PAC. Unfortunately, these people don't tolerate half-day workweeks, 45-minute chai breaks, segregation between "officers" and "others" and mediocrity in product or output, so the Pakistani system rejects them. OTOH, Americans, British and even Indians are cultivating those Pakistanis into leaders.

Indians ??? I thought people across border are not allowed here , you mean non resident indian ??

 

[Nilgiri]

Indians ??? I thought people across border are not allowed here , you mean non resident indian ??

Yes Indians in western shores work alongside Pak counterparts in a lot of diverse fields.

 

[Nilgiri]

This is by design so that there can be no competence higher than relative to the military. We look only for half-wits, so that we can manipulate the other half in our way and in our own time, the rest of the world be damned. It works quite well, but only up to a point, which is the desired outcome. @Nilgiri and I have discussed this many times.

Another tweet that aged well:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1453351651205652485

 

[VCheng]

Isn't it creating a huge problem ,not only on economic health but on the talent too , segregation among those blind followers and one with senses will increase , that's social divide of worst category ,where competent are minority

Is that a problem?

 

[VCheng]

This is true. The country's best talent and most capable leaders are all abroad. We have Pakistani auditors with 30+ years of experience working on MNC, TNC and public sector books, but they're in Deloitte or PW&C, not in NAB. Likewise, we have PhD professors and R&D engineers working in US and UK aerospace, but not at SUPARCO or PAC. Unfortunately, these people don't tolerate half-day workweeks, 45-minute chai breaks, segregation between "officers" and "others" and mediocrity in product or output, so the Pakistani system rejects them. OTOH, Americans, British and even Indians are cultivating those Pakistanis into leaders.

These are only some of the intended results by conscious design that is nourished with a lot of attention.

 

[Bilal Khan(Quwa)]

This. Shoaib Akhtar went through the exact experience of every competent Pakistani. What you see here is what happens in our institutions, armed forces, academia, political parties, and so on. If this is how you treat the subject matter experts, then, of course, you're not going to succeed. The stupidity at play was so overwhelming Shoaib Akhtar could only walk away. That, folks, is the story of competent Pakistanis in a nutshell. @Nilgiri @VCheng @Lonewolf

 

[Lonewolf]

This. Shoaib Akhtar went through the exact experience of every competent Pakistani. What you see here is what happens in our institutions, armed forces, academia, political parties, and so on. If this is how you treat the subject matter experts, then, of course, you're not going to succeed. The stupidity at play was so overwhelming Shoaib Akhtar could only walk away. That, folks, is the story of competent Pakistanis in a nutshell. @Nilgiri @VCheng @Lonewolf

From outside it seems like everytime political regime changes , a new identity is created , like die hard fans jumping over each other to prove themselves best fanboys in each arena of society , whitewashing all incompetence , using methods like mocking neighbours , tampering with facts etc .


When the next regime comes ,the previous ones as terrorist and corrupt .

Thus by each cycle , corruption actually increase

 

[Saithan]

*sigh* It's what Turkey has been turned into the past 10 years.

The only solution is having the smart people come on tv programs and tell the people of the situation, create an awareness and put it into words. They will probably end up getting killed for creating and formulating that awareness.

This goes for all countries with horrible leadership.