TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

[Nutuk]

So it's 5 gen but the engine?

Basically yes. Modern aircraft and also the TFx will have electro optics to search for enemy aircraft without radar on (in order not to expose herself, same that F22 does). But that means you do not want to be spotted by enemy aircrafts electro optics either, so you need stealth in the IR spectrum as well.

And if the engines are not with reduced IR or dissipating the heat better than you are not fully 5th generation


The main difficulty of 5th generation is not the radar deflecting shape and radar absorbing paints, but the engine that dissipates the heat for lower observability

 

[Rooxbar]

Some of you guys have bad taste; the prototype looks 10x better than the bland mock-up. I love Su34 because of its duck nose, and the nose is a bit similar here; it's obviously much more like F-35 but the top is a bit flatter which I like aesthetically. Size-wise, it's all about the camera zoom length and the angles, lighting etc. I mean does this look like 19 meters to you?

 

[Umigami]

Yes, if we can develop the TFX's (AESA radar + passive sensor arrays + sensor fusion software) on time and to the desired standard. We probably do.

On the other hand, the engine issue will be challenging though.

You need to find good plan B for the engine then, at least for first block.
GE F101 132 isn't bad either.

 

[Rooxbar]

There were like 14 prototypes I think made for EJ200 for accelerated simulated mission endurance testing, helping compress thousands of hours of testing to a couple of years and this was one of the fastest engine development programs afaik from a company with the kind of pedigree we all know and it still took about 16 years from the inception of the program until the first series production engine flew on a Eurofighter. Other programs have been dragging on for decades, in China, Russia and India. I think we're already very late in this regard and I really cannot fathom the nonchalant sense of self-confidence that exists about the issue of engines. Do we have infrastructure to pull off ASMET testings of a dozen or more prototypes, or even the capabilities to produce that many in a couple of years? This is all very concerning to me.

 

[AWP]

There was a very high level Saudi delegation visiting. Negotiations must be in an advance stage before Turkiye shows the aircraft to KSA. KSA could become a (financial partner) ordering 100-200 TF-X. If true, it would solve one of the main non-technical hurdles for TF-X i.e. economic viability.

I don't think that Turkey will be able to sell Tf-x to KSA due to political reason ( USA etc .. ) . But I am confidant that KSA will buy drones from TAI and maybe the hurjet in the future .

 

[TheInsider]

As the expected nose is slightly shorter but wider and overall bigger to accommodate the big radar antenna and all of the electronics. We can clearly see IRST and EOTS at the top and bottom of the nose. Air inlets are different compared to the mock-up. This is expected as no one shows their real inlet design on the mock-up. I like this air inlet design more there is no way to see engine fans, the intake area looks slightly bigger and it is diamond shaped to reduce RCS further. You can see the bump(red) inside the air inlet from the picture and the inlet is slightly rising(green) after the entry part. It looks well-optimized for stealth and 3D fluid dynamics.

BTW front landing gear is also different. This might be the recently patented landing gear from TAAC. It was kept secret for a long time.

 

[Rodeo]

Will the operational TFX have DSI? And can we discuss the advantages/disadvantages of having DSI?

AFAIK, DSI doesn't yield more stealth but it's more efficient at supersonic speeds as it reduces the drag by not having a diverter creating shockwaves at the inlet. Moreover, because it's a fixed system, it requires less maintenance. The downsides that I can think of are its complex design and suboptimal performance at subsonic speeds.

F35, J20, AMCA have it, while F22(was old for DSI) and KF-21(not true 5th gen) don't. Should TFX have DSI?

 

[AzeriTank]

The mock-up's air intake looked more sleeker and better

And the nose in the mock up was longer

It seems tha the TFX mock up resembled an F22 and the prototype somehow got degraded into an F35. Still, a beautiful plane nonetheless

They actually mentioned several times that the nose will change and they intentionally doesnt show the nose so others dont copy and shortcome them

 

[AWP]

It has to be 4.5 gen first. We simply do not posses the engines to make her 5th generation.

If TEI manages to make suitable engines by 2030 we can upgrade to 5th gen.

The Tf-x fit the 5 gen criteria , not all of them but the one that is enough to make it 5 gen fighter . The most important thing is RAM paint , Internal weapon bay , Advanced Radar and Optical systems and Real stealth clean fuselage .

The engine is a subjective topic , yes it's important but how ? the engine heat signature is important in close quarters combat and low range combat , but It wouldn't make any difference if turkey Tf-x face Greece Rafale or F-16 because Tf-x radar and technology will outrange the Greece detection systems .

For me the most important thing is the electronic warfare , detection and communication systems to be as good as F-35 since F-35 is called mini AWACS . if TAI reached those goals then putting propeller engine on Tf-x won't make a difference ( Joke )

 

[AzeriTank]

Is first block of TFX still 4.5 gen or already 5 gen?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1607167019614633984

The only reason Turkey itself doesnt call the the real 5th generation is for its f110 engine which is not 5th generation engine, but other than that, everything is 5th generation.
Also, yesterday, the head pf TEI said that they are sure that they can make tfx engine as they have develop every important metal super alloy (alishim in english forgot) to build the engine

 

[AzeriTank]

The Tf-x fit the 5 gen criteria , not all of them but the one that is enough to make it 5 gen fighter . The most important thing is RAM paint , Internal weapon bay , Advanced Radar and Optical systems and Real stealth clean fuselage .

The engine is a subjective topic , yes it's important but how ? the engine heat signature is important in close quarters combat and low range combat , but It wouldn't make any difference if Turkiye Tf-x face Greece Rafale or F-16 because Tf-x radar and technology will outrange the Greece detection systems .

For me the most important thing is the electronic warfare , detection and communication systems to be as good as F-35 since F-35 is called mini AWACS . if TAI reached those goals then putting propeller engine on Tf-x won't make a difference ( Joke )

Also, you can see the aircraft with its heat engine but you cannot tell its speed, distance, or send missiles over 25km as those thermal heads will be heated. It still can do most of its missions its designed for.. or it can control the Kizilelma and Anka-3 from distance which would simply overcome that issue
Also consider the rainy, foggy and sandy weather, those thermal view will diminish several times

 

[YeşilVatan]

I thought F22's sensors included some future tech stuff that's classified, not only high-end electro optics

 

[Afif]

I thought F22's sensors included some future tech stuff that's classified, not only high-end electro optics

F22 doesn't have any EOTS.

 

[Bmx98]

The only reason Turkiye itself doesnt call the the real 5th generation is for its f110 engine which is not 5th generation engine, but other than that, everything is 5th generation.
Also, yesterday, the head pf TEI said that they are sure that they can make tfx engine as they have develop every important metal (alishim in english forgot) to build the engine

Afaik it doesn't have Ram coating neither yet so we can't call the structure pure 5th gen either.

 

[Siper>MMU]

We should teach Russians how to make a true stealth aircraft

 

[Agha Sher]

Afaik it doesn't have Ram coating neither yet so we can't call the structure pure 5th gen either.

ram coating will be applied to later prototypes

 

[Siper>MMU]

We have been working on RAM coatings for almost 20 years now. They will probably come up with a decent RAM coating.

 

[Merzifonlu]

Seriously, the Russians have never used S-duck inlets, except for 1-2 experimental aircraft. I wonder why?

 

[Umigami]

We should teach Russians how to make a true stealth aircraft
View attachment 51886 View attachment 51887

how did Russian miss this?

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Larger nose for bigger AESA radar TRM, integrated AESA based EW sensors, S-Duck, fully composite body, diamond shape IRST, EOTS, RAM coating, serrated surfaces, new generation powerful engine development, supercruise...etc

When the MMU matures, it will be a true multi-role fighter jet that will make friends proud and enemies sleepless with fear.

Congratulation TUSAŞ engineers and technicians again !