TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

[Oublious]

If they solve the F35 deal then the engine will be solved to, accordin to that Tom Barrack wait and see, but when wil we see?

 

[hugh]

a quick reminder, the engines are not the only stranglehold the US have on KAAN. the aircraft's bulkheads are made by EBM machines, provided by an american company. I'm sure our shortsightedness will cause a roadblock there too. our brilliant leaders wanted to gain independent foreign policy through KAAN which can only be built with foreign tooling. The aircraft sits at the heart of our independence but investing in a goddamn hydraulic-press is too much to ask!

 

[BalkanTurk90]

Don't waste any more energy on countries like that. Get the WS 10 C or D engine directly from Pakistan over China. It is almost nearly identical to the CFM56/F-101 Family -> F-110 engine in terms of size, weight, diameter and LBF, it also has FADEC. It's just a transitional engine anyway.

Yes its a transitional engine , people should not worry too much about kaan but more about f16 that have same F110 engine so can Turkiye maintain and repair itself those engines ?
And for KAAN we just needs few F110 engines just for 3-6 prototypes until 2030 . So i see this ban on engines more to hurt f16 fleet

 

[mehmed beg]

It is time for these liars to live with their bases from Turkey. Nothing can be worked out with them.
Not surprising really.
So no need for f16 from them and no need for f35. Not a f penny. Boing planes, I understand. But nuclear deal and gas deals should be abandoned.
Turkey won't be protected or helped in any possible scenario.
So what is the point?

 

[godel44]

That's a pity. All I wanted from this deal was engines for the initial batches of Kaan. This topic is much more important than everything else. Of course, Americans would be hesitant to supply those engines and would rather sell F16s, but I would have made the LNG deal dependent on engines.

 

[Yasar_TR]

Japan Offers IHI XF9-1 Engine for India’s AMCA Program, GTRE Invited for Technical Review Amid Global Competition - idrw.org

SOURCE: RAUNAK KUNDE / NEWS BEAT / IDRW.ORG In a significant development for India’s Advanced Medium Combat...

idrw.org

Japan has offered XF9-1 engine to India for their AMCA stealth fighter.

This is a 33000lbf + wet thrust and 24250lbf dry thrust engine using 5th generation single crystal turbine blades and specifically developed for 5th generation fighter jets.

May be we should approach Japan and IHI to inquire about using this engine for KAAN until TF35000 is fully matured. That would ease the pressure on TEI as well.

We first alienated RR with Qatar involvement. Mistake #1
We went for a very big plane that needed a large engine. Mistake #2
We got ourselves kicked out from F35 project. Mistake #3
We assumed we had an ally in the form of USA. Mistake #4
We became too verbal in our animosity towards Israel. Mistake #5

Now we are in a predicament and don’t know how to get ourselves out of it.

There is always a way out of a predicament if the administration plays the cards right. But do we have that administration with balls and determination and morals that are patriotically driven and not politically and profit driven, to sort this mess out?
After all, why are we in this mess?

 

[Angry Turk !!!]

After all, why are we in this mess?

Self sabotage.

 

[Fuzuli NL]

Anybody surprised? Really?

 

[2033]

No F-16Vs, no F-35s, no engine for Kaan. What kind of deal did our guys make with Trump—LNG imports? This meeting turned out to be completely pointless. They came back without achieving anything.

 

[Lool]

Congrats on Altay 2.0. So the US Congress stopped the export of engines for Kaan… but Erdo still gave 100$ billion for overpriced American gas and junk Boeing planes. All Turkey won is for Erdo to sit next to Trump for two hours in front of the cameras.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1972029334543339939

It is highly likely due to the Syrian issue

I said it before on numerous threads, Turkey's greatest and closest threat rn is the YPG/SDF announcing their independece and state formation in Syria. In other words, Erdogan paid that money to please the US so that Turkey can operate freely if the March 10 agreement fails to materialise and honestly, if it takes 100 billion dollars to preserve turkish internal security, then it is a cheap price to pay.
Ofcourse, we still have to wait till years's end, to see whether the rumors are true or not

Just look at Point no.2

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1972041222119358863

 

[Lool]

I just wanna ask why on earth are people so surprised that the engines were embargoed? Congress, before even Erdo met Trump, reported that they would block any sale that would advance Turkish defence industry as they are a threat to Israel and Greece. Even in Israeli media, members of the Knesset clearly stipulated that they received guarantees from the US political sphere that they are gonna block any potential engine sale to Turkey

Japan Offers IHI XF9-1 Engine for India’s AMCA Program, GTRE Invited for Technical Review Amid Global Competition - idrw.org

SOURCE: RAUNAK KUNDE / NEWS BEAT / IDRW.ORG In a significant development for India’s Advanced Medium Combat...

idrw.org

Japan has offered XF9-1 engine to India for their AMCA stealth fighter.

This is a 33000lbf + wet thrust and 24250lbf dry thrust engine using 5th generation single crystal turbine blades and specifically developed for 5th generation fighter jets.

May be we should approach Japan and IHI to inquire about using this engine for KAAN until TF35000 is fully matured. That would ease the pressure on TEI as well.

We first alienated RR with Qatar involvement. Mistake #1
We went for a very big plane that needed a large engine. Mistake #2
We got ourselves kicked out from F35 project. Mistake #3
We assumed we had an ally in the form of USA. Mistake #4
We became too verbal in our animosity towards Israel. Mistake #5

Now we are in a predicament and don’t know how to get ourselves out of it.

There is always a way out of a predicament if the administration plays the cards right. But do we have that administration with balls and determination and morals that are patriotically driven and not politically and profit driven, to sort this mess out?
After all, why are we in this mess?

View attachment 77556

Useless tbh!
Japqn will never ever antagonise the US, period! If the US refused to sell engines to Turkey then Japan will likely do the same in order not to antagonsie both Israel and the US

Have you forgotten when the Japanese PM announced that Japan would recognise the Palesinian state? Even though the Japanese public opinion was majorly in favour of such a decision, all what it took is one call from the US for the decision to get cancelled; even the japanese themselves admitted that. In other words, dont waste your energy with Japan as they will 100% block such a deal to not antagonise the Americans and Israelis

 

[IC3M@N FX]

The only possibility would be to order the WS 10 engine from China via Pakistan. The engine would have to be relabeled and the transaction would have to be handled via Pakistan. The USA would find this difficult to sanction as it is officially a Pakistani engine. As already mentioned, the origin of the engine belongs to the CFM56/F-101 & AL-31F family. Of course you would have to make some modifications to the prototype, e.g. to the suspension and a few other things, but in principle it is feasible. This is the only Engine that really comes closest to the F-110 129.

Weight:
WS-10C/D: Approx. 1,700+ kg (estimated, based on WS-10A).

F110-GE-129: 1,805 kg.
The F110 is little bit heavier, suggesting the WS-10C/D might have a more compact design.

Diameter:
WS-10C/D: Approx. 1.1–1.2 m (estimated, based on
CFM56/F-101 & AL-31F Core).

F110-GE-129: 1.18 m.
Both are very similar in diameter, suitable for comparable fighter jets.

Length:
WS-10C/D: Approx. 4.7+ m. (estimated, based on WS-10C/D).

F110-GE-129: 4.63 m.
The F110 is slightly shorter, indicating a more compact build.

Thrust:
WS-10C/D: 132–140 kN (29,700–31,500 lbf, estimated) with afterburner; ~70–80 kN dry (estimated).

F110-GE-129: 131.65 kN (29,500 lbf) with afterburner; ~62.3 kN dry.
The WS-10C/D likely has a slight edge in maximum thrust, beneficial for aircraft like the J-20, though the difference is small.

 

[boredaf]

Japan Offers IHI XF9-1 Engine for India’s AMCA Program, GTRE Invited for Technical Review Amid Global Competition - idrw.org

SOURCE: RAUNAK KUNDE / NEWS BEAT / IDRW.ORG In a significant development for India’s Advanced Medium Combat...

idrw.org

Japan has offered XF9-1 engine to India for their AMCA stealth fighter.

This is a 33000lbf + wet thrust and 24250lbf dry thrust engine using 5th generation single crystal turbine blades and specifically developed for 5th generation fighter jets.

May be we should approach Japan and IHI to inquire about using this engine for KAAN until TF35000 is fully matured. That would ease the pressure on TEI as well.

We first alienated RR with Qatar involvement. Mistake #1
We went for a very big plane that needed a large engine. Mistake #2
We got ourselves kicked out from F35 project. Mistake #3
We assumed we had an ally in the form of USA. Mistake #4
We became too verbal in our animosity towards Israel. Mistake #5

Now we are in a predicament and don’t know how to get ourselves out of it.

There is always a way out of a predicament if the administration plays the cards right. But do we have that administration with balls and determination and morals that are patriotically driven and not politically and profit driven, to sort this mess out?
After all, why are we in this mess?

View attachment 77556

Couldn't agree more mate, no matter what government worshippers might say, one again they managed to fuck up a project with their ineptitude and belligerent foreign policy. We have to get TF6K/10K right and as soon as possible because in the short term our air force will have to rely on KE and Anka-3.

 

[Cenkcnk]

Yeah if USA has no authority on these engines, we should sign today, not tomorrow. Government messed up every engine issue from tanks to planes.
we should even consider buying Chinese engines for stop gap.

 

[TheInsider]

No F-16Vs, no F-35s, no engine for Kaan. What kind of deal did our guys make with Trump—LNG imports? This meeting turned out to be completely pointless. They came back without achieving anything.

Erdogan bought another term for himself.

 

[NEKO]

How about european enigne?

 

[mehmed beg]

---

Japan Offers IHI XF9-1 Engine for India’s AMCA Program, GTRE Invited for Technical Review Amid Global Competition - idrw.org

SOURCE: RAUNAK KUNDE / NEWS BEAT / IDRW.ORG In a significant development for India’s Advanced Medium Combat...

idrw.org

Japan has offered XF9-1 engine to India for their AMCA stealth fighter.

This is a 33000lbf + wet thrust and 24250lbf dry thrust engine using 5th generation single crystal turbine blades and specifically developed for 5th generation fighter jets.

May be we should approach Japan and IHI to inquire about using this engine for KAAN until TF35000 is fully matured. That would ease the pressure on TEI as well.

We first alienated RR with Qatar involvement. Mistake #1
We went for a very big plane that needed a large engine. Mistake #2
We got ourselves kicked out from F35 project. Mistake #3
We assumed we had an ally in the form of USA. Mistake #4
We became too verbal in our animosity towards Israel. Mistake #5

Now we are in a predicament and don’t know how to get ourselves out of it.

There is always a way out of a predicament if the administration plays the cards right. But do we have that administration with balls and determination and morals that are patriotically driven and not politically and profit driven, to sort this mess out?
After all, why are we in this mess?

View attachment 77556

I don't think by appeasing everything what other people want will get anyone, anywhere.
If you want to appease everyone, then what would be the point to build, great deal of weapons that Turkiye does?
No need to spend billions.

 

[Yasar_TR]

How about european enigne?

Europeans don’t have an engine in that caliber. (Not including Russian engines here, as being a CAATSA country, Russian engines would be more trouble than they are worth)

Only two companies in Europe that manufacture fighter jet engines:

RR/MTU has EJ200 with 13500lbf dry and 20200lbf wet thrust.
Safran’s M88 delivers 11200lbf dry and 16900 wet thrust.

F110-129 delivers 17155lbf dry thrust and 29500lbf wet thrust.

With TF35000 we are aspiring to deliver 24000+lbf dry and 35000lbf with afterburner thrust.

RR has the technology to develop high dry thrust engines.
Their Pegasus engine delivers 24000lbf dry thrust.
They also produced an engine for f35 together with GE , named F136. That engine was delivering 28000lbf dry and 45000lbf wet thrust.

 

[NEKO]

Europeans don’t have an engine in that caliber. (Not including Russian engines here, as being a CAATSA country, Russian engines would be more trouble than they are worth)

Only two companies that manufacture fighter jet engines:

RR/MTU has EJ200 with 13500lbf dry and 20200lbf wet thrust.
Safran’s M88 delivers 11200lbf dry and 16900 wet thrust.

F110-129 delivers 17155lbf dry thrust and 29500lbf wet thrust.

With TF35000 we are aspiring to deliver 24000+lbf dry and 35000lbf with afterburner thrust.

RR has the technology to develop high dry thrust engines.
Their Pegasus engine delivers 24000lbf dry thrust.
They also produced an engine for f35 together with GE , named F136. That engine was delivering 28000lbf dry and 45000lbf wet thrust.

I see. Then only CN option is left (?)

Btw how's the talk with RR? Didn't TR tried to get RR assistance to develop indigenous engine?

 

[Yasar_TR]

I see. Then only CN option is left (?)

Btw how's the talk with RR? Didn't TR tried to get RR assistance to develop indigenous engine?

Although not officially disclosed, there were reports and rumours that the consortium in charge of developing the TF35000 consisted of RR/Kale.
Originally RR were to manufacture the engine of KAAN together with Kale. This engine was to be produced in Turkey under licence and Turkey would have autonomy to sell it to third parties. However the engine’s IP rights were to stay with RR.
Turkey, later introduced Qatar in to the equation of the company in charge of developing the engine for financial reasons (more like for skimming profit). RR refused another entity having access to their tech and pulled out.
Turkey afterwards separated Qatar and started discussions with RR. But due to our insistence on IP rights being in our hands RR deal never materialised.

Even here, our Cabatli_53 had mentioned that the Kale/RR, Ivchenko, TRMotor and TEI were in charge of developing the engine. If RR were really involved or not is a myth at the moment.

According to news seeping through the grapevine, TEI and TRMotor have completed the development work and actual engine is being manufactured with a view to initial firing taking place in 2026.