TR Turkish Air Forces|News & Discussion

[Zafer]

There are rumours that we might get some. Conversions from THY fleet to be specific. According to the rumours we will convert 7 of them to MRTT spec in order to replace our KC-135Rs.

That is fantastic.
I wonder who will do the conversion.

 

[Yasar_TR]

There are rumours that we might get some. Conversions from THY fleet to be specific. According to the rumours we will convert 7 of them to MRTT spec in order to replace our KC-135Rs.

That is the news in a lot of circles. But remember that the KC-135s are going through major avionics based upgrading. One plane already back with upgrades. Second is in US at the moment.
Why spend money if Airbus 330 conversion is on the table? Unless of course they will all be included in to the fleet!

 

[Mis_TR_Like]

That is the news in a lot of circles. But remember that the KC-135s are going through major avionics based upgrading. One plane already back with upgrades. Second is in US at the moment.
Why spend money if Airbus 330 conversion is on the table? Unless of course they will all be included in to the fleet!

Having both would be great! 7 dedicated tankers + 7 multirole.

 

[TheInsider]

We won't be retiring KC-135s soon they will serve at least another decade.

 

[Stuka]

Maybe

There aren't any other alternatives really.

I Checked if there is another Military Freighter with bigger Payloads currently in Serial Production and the answer is no.

If the Turkish MoD orders additional A400Ms in 2022 we will likely see them arrive in 2025 (It takes approx. 3 Years from Order to Delivery)
The need for additional A400Ms seems to be there.

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Egypt is set to pay 183 Million for C130J (20 Ton Payload) which makes the cost for A400Ms easier to swallow.

US Senate backs $2.2 billion military sale of C-130 Super Hercules planes to Egypt

Republican Senator Rand Paul had sought to stop the sale, joined by some of the 100-member Senate's most progressive Democrats.

www.egypttoday.com

 

[Combat-Master]

How many A400M would Turkey need to satisfy Turkey's current outward facing foreign policy and deployments ?

 

[Ryder]

There aren't any other alternatives really.

I Checked if there is another Military Freighter with bigger Payloads currently in Serial Production and the answer is no.

View attachment 42049

If the Turkish MoD orders additional A400Ms in 2022 we will likely see them arrive in 2025 (It takes approx. 3 Years from Order to Delivery)
The need for additional A400Ms seems to be there.

---

Egypt is set to pay 183 Million for C130J (20 Ton Payload) which makes the cost for A400Ms easier to swallow.

US Senate backs $2.2 billion military sale of C-130 Super Hercules planes to Egypt

Republican Senator Rand Paul had sought to stop the sale, joined by some of the 100-member Senate's most progressive Democrats.

www.egypttoday.com

These Arabs pay for anything

They should be bargaining not getting themselves ripped off.

 

[Deliorman]

Germany have 53 A400s on order while France plans to have 50. France has many overseas territories to cover but why would Germany need so many of them?

 

[Combat-Master]

Germany have 53 A400s on order while France plans to have 50. France has many overseas territories to cover but why would Germany need so many of them?

Germans always had a large fleet of transport planes, perhaps something to do with their operational concepts ?

 

[Khagan1923]

How many A400M would Turkey need to satisfy Turkey's current outward facing foreign policy and deployments ?

View attachment 42069
View attachment 42070

I think 25 would be an sufficient number, expensive but necessary. This would ease the burden brought on due to C-160 retirement and expanded operations overseas.

Additional 15 wouldn't hurt imo.

The C-130 Fleet isn't getting younger either...

 

[Lool]

These Arabs pay for anything

They should be bargaining not getting themselves ripped off.

You see, this here is the point

They are willingly getting ripped off in order to please the West
Most weapons sale of Arabs rn are redundant and are made to gain political poijts with the West. In Egypt's case, just look at a massive arms deal with Italy worth more than 5 billion euros for shitty old frigates and typhoon jets the moment the egyptian authorities killed an Italian national in Egypt; another example is how Egypt saves the French defence industry whenever they face shortages in profits and possible layoffs start looming around

If Egypt spent half of what it spends on such sales on R&D instead, then Egypt would have been a massive defemce industrial hub

 

[Lool]

How many A400M would Turkey need to satisfy Turkey's current outward facing foreign policy and deployments ?

View attachment 42069
View attachment 42070

I think Turkey should look into the future and stop buying new transport planes
Rn, Turkey is working even closer with Antonov with rumors (back in 2021) that Erdo is interested in both the An-225 and An-124

With the current events and the war, Turkey may be closer to building those within its own soil than ever; thus, it is more beneficial to just upgrade the current transport fleet and build the necessary infrastructure to build these planes in Turkey

 

[Ryder]

You see, this here is the point

They are willingly getting ripped off in order to please the West
Most weapons sale of Arabs rn are redundant and are made to gain political poijts with the West. In Egypt's case, just look at a massive arms deal with Italy worth more than 5 billion euros for shitty old frigates and typhoon jets the moment the egyptian authorities killed an Italian national in Egypt; another example is how Egypt saves the French defence industry whenever they face shortages in profits and possible layoffs start looming around

If Egypt spent half of what it spends on such sales on R&D instead, then Egypt would have been a massive defemce industrial hub

Egypt's military industry started with Muhammed Ali Pasha.

Irony is the Ottomans did not allow any blacksmiths or even gunsmiths to be built in Egypt. Ottomans somestimes did not want their provinces being more powerful than them. But it all ended with Muhammed Ali Pasha.

Im not supporting monarchy but the monarchs in Egypt has more vision than the jokers that came after like Nasser, Sisi and Mubarak.

 

[Cypro]

There aren't any other alternatives really.

I Checked if there is another Military Freighter with bigger Payloads currently in Serial Production and the answer is no.

View attachment 42049

If the Turkish MoD orders additional A400Ms in 2022 we will likely see them arrive in 2025 (It takes approx. 3 Years from Order to Delivery)
The need for additional A400Ms seems to be there.

---

Egypt is set to pay 183 Million for C130J (20 Ton Payload) which makes the cost for A400Ms easier to swallow.

US Senate backs $2.2 billion military sale of C-130 Super Hercules planes to Egypt

Republican Senator Rand Paul had sought to stop the sale, joined by some of the 100-member Senate's most progressive Democrats.

www.egypttoday.com

I did exactly same research two days ago and come to conclusion that A400M is very expensive for some regular tasks, may be Turkey can cooperate with Japan for Kawasaki C2, less agile, less flexible but cheaper or even commercial cargo planes. If Ruskies did not intervened best option would be An-188, or lets say a mix fleet of An-70 with jet engines and/or TP400. A400M is the best and infrastructure already exists, however it is very expensive and range is shorter.

 

[Stuka]

I did exactly same research two days ago and come to conclusion that A400M is very expensive for some regular tasks, may be Turkey can cooperate with Japan for Kawasaki C2, less agile, less flexible but cheaper or even commercial cargo planes. If Ruskies did not intervened best option would be An-188, or lets say a mix fleet of An-70 with jet engines and/or TP400. A400M is the best and infrastructure already exists, however it is very expensive and range is shorter.

> The Options are there but is Japan willing to Cooperate ? They aren't really keen on Industry Cooperation.
> And very important is also the Timeframe. How long from Order to Service ?

About the Price of KAWASAKI C2

"The JASDF is paying about ¥20 billion, or $176 million U.S. dollars, per aircraft. However, Omine noted the costs would be different for international customers based on the configuration of the aircraft and the volume of the procurement."

Japan's C-2 airlifter makes its international debut

Dubai Airshow is Japan’s first big opportunity to garner foreign interest for the C-2, the largest plane ever made by a Japanese defense firm.

www.defensenews.com

The Price seems adequate but data from 2017.

Specs Comparison:

Kawasaki C2 vs Airbus A400M vs Antonov 188

And TAI has 5.6 % in AIRBUS Military and Space.

About Us - TUSAS

About Us

www.tusas.com

 

[Zafer]

Antonov if the planes are built in Türkiye, very possible.

 

[HTurk]

Germany have 53 A400s on order while France plans to have 50. France has many overseas territories to cover but why would Germany need so many of them?

Good God, you're right. Why does Germany need so many planes? Which country are they planning to invade?

 

[TheInsider]

Antanov is not a good choice as it has 4 engines. If a 2 engine version of Antonov can be developed then it will be a good alternative.

 

[Zafer]

As Ukraine can be considered to be out of the game for decades we should bite the bullet and make our own cargo plane from scratch. This project can be started once the design of the TFX is completed. I am more biased to making a multi role plane that can also be used as a tanker and passenger plane similar to the Airbus A330 Multi Role Tanker Transport. This will boost our reach to global power level.

 

[Fairon]

Airbus A330 MRTT is a better option.
Faster, longer range, bigger payload, tanker role.
One plane could take the Ataks to the Philippines with no stopovers.

As far as i know, you can't. Having a payload capacity is one thing but being able to load oversizde cargo is another. Cargo bay doors and general structure of MRRT is not compatible to load oversized cargo. A330 MRRT's body is configured like its civilian version, there are partitioned in two.(lower and main deck). Also the cargo doors is at the side of the aircraft and both of these limits the oversized cargo loading.

MRRT is good for general and humanitarian cargo flights but it can't replace A400 or the Ukranian alternatives. It will be complement them well though and will be good for alternative troop transfer and tanker duties.(It will be great for our tanker fleet)