TR Turkiye's F-35 Project and Discussions

dBSPL

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Personally, if we are talking about buying F-35s at an indefinite date without full normalization, including the pkk ypg issue and F-35 industry involvement, I would prefer to buy EF backed by additional agreements to secure the engine development schedule for KAAN. I have the feeling that they want us to put all our eggs in the same basket, 'again'.
 

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Personally, if we are talking about buying F-35s at an indefinite date without full normalization, including the pkk ypg issue and F-35 industry involvement, I would prefer to buy EF backed by additional agreements to secure the engine development schedule for KAAN. I have the feeling that they want us to put all our eggs in the same basket, 'again'.
Yup. Funny thing is, Turkey even with its current economy can handle Viper, Özgür, F-35, EF2000 and Kaan together. And if the goal is to come to top, and survive the coming decades, we probably will need to. Both the firepower, and the relationships these purchases create.
 

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At this point we should try to get some Seahawks as well. We could try to include them in the T70 deal extension.
 

uçuyorum

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Thats the mentality I'm afraid of. The more stuff we buy from US the fewer orders for local companies and less urgency to finish ours, the longer it will take to become independent. We do need platforms but If we can make it past next 5 years or so we will really start seeing things come together.

Shouldn't go well we got f16 lets buy some f35 too and some patriot, some seahawk then you get hooked on more stuff you could search different solutions to boost our industry.
 

Heartbang

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US Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs Victoria Nuland {CNN Turk}

- Frankly, if we can resolve this S-400 issue, which we want to do, the US will be pleased to welcome Turkey back into the F-35 family.

- But first we must solve this other issue, and while solving it we must also ensure that Turkey has a strong air defense
Dang, Mete Yarar got it right 😮
 

Sanchez

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Thats the mentality I'm afraid of. The more stuff we buy from US the fewer orders for local companies and less urgency to finish ours, the longer it will take to become independent. We do need platforms but If we can make it past next 5 years or so we will really start seeing things come together.

Shouldn't go well we got f16 lets buy some f35 too and some patriot, some seahawk then you get hooked on more stuff you could search different solutions to boost our industry.
Yup. But there's some issues here as well. Mainly, highly unrealistic project schedules with even with many subparts still depending on US and US allies.
 

dBSPL

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Yup. Funny thing is, Turkey even with its current economy can handle Viper, Özgür, F-35, EF2000 and Kaan together. And if the goal is to come to top, and survive the coming decades, we probably will need to. Both the firepower, and the relationships these purchases create.
Even during the heaviest embargo period in history, we have an air force that was able to maintain Delta Daggers, which were developed entirely to intercept Soviet nuclear bombers, with zero spare parts. In terms of sustainment, they were probably the F-35s of the period.

Now, our economy and industrial infrastructure are incomparably advanced. However, there is a very similar point with that period; both the imminent threats and the risk of our country directly facing a war are at the highest level. In such situations, the concern for comfort need to takes a back, because there is a concern for security.

It is necessary to maintain a state of mobilization to rapidly bring every aviation project that is ready for production or has been concretized to a certain extent into mass production in the country. On the other hand, I am in favor of buying whatever we can from abroad, I wrote a long post about this last week, but I later withdrew the post, thinking that it would not be appropriate to discuss some of the issues I touched upon between the lines in an open forum. As a result, there is also the possibility of instrumentalizing foreign procurement to shape foreign policy. But this requires a decisive and upright stance.
 

dBSPL

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Let me play devil's advocate: Putin will announce at his press conference in Turkiye (Putin-RTE leaders summit in February) that they are ready for the delivery of a new S-400 battery, and he will say a few vague things that could lead to speculation about the possible sale of the Izdeliye 30.
 

Ryder

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Lots of good points for the F35 acquisition while many who are against it also shared really good points.

I like this kind of debate. You wont get this with F35 fanboys who worship this plane like its God and anti F35 fanboys who watch Pierre Sprey then called themselves experts.
 

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Guys, many messages were moved and some were deleted.

We are seeing a big number of off topic posts in the last week. Please let's help each other and keep the discussion as relevant to the name of the thread as much as possible. Otherwise we will be forced to take harsher measures.

There are many relevant threads for different discussions like the Air Forces thread, KAAN thread, Greece-Turkiye relationship and also nobody limit you guys to open new threads if you think the forum is lacking something. If you decide that you would go off topic I advice you to quote the post you want to respond in the relevant thread and continue discussion there.

Thank you!
 

Oublious

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US Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs Victoria Nuland {CNN Turk}

- Frankly, if we can resolve this S-400 issue, which we want to do, the US will be pleased to welcome Turkey back into the F-35 family.

- But first we must solve this other issue, and while solving it we must also ensure that Turkey has a strong air defense


the million dollar question is, what is the other issue?
 

what

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I think she implies getting the F16 deal done is the other issue.
 

godel44

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As long as funding for Kaan won't be affected, getting 20-40 F35 would be ideal both to bridge the time gap until Kaan becomes operational and also to learn more extensively the 5th gen characteristics by using F35 and participating in NATO exercises.

S400s were not an ideal decision to begin with and with Siper coming online it's looking more and more undesirable. It would be best to move it to Azerbaijan. Due to Shusha Declaration, we can recall it anyway if there is an attack on Turkey.
 

Saithan

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why from SBB and not from FM ? Aren't our FM suppose to be the one to react first on these statements ?

Is it because it was an under secretary that floated the idea ?
 

Strong AI

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why from SBB and not from FM ? Aren't our FM suppose to be the one to react first on these statements ?

Is it because it was an under secretary that floated the idea ?

SBB? Do you mean SSB?
SSB and the Defence Ministry are not the same.
 

dBSPL

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NEW: Turkish Defence Ministry sources' reaction to these statement by Biden Admin on F35 issue:

- There is no change in the stance of both countries right now
- At this stage, the statements made by the USA should be considered a declaration of good faith.

What we really need now is for KAAN to make its first flight and re-enter the international aviation agenda. At the same time, I wish TAI-Aselsan would conduct some social media activities with the progress of the Özgür program. There is a timidity in the Turkish public opinion that I find hard to understand. While the F-35 is not on the agenda, statements from the US seriously manipulating Turkish defense enthusiasts.
 

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