Live Conflict Ukraine-Russia War

mehmed beg

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You live in Europe yet you don't care about the European economy suffering, how sad, because of people thinking like you Europe is in this situation it is now ( and im not only talking about the Ukranian war but a host of other issues we have ).

Where is the patriotism? Its sorely missing from so many people here, so called Europeans.

There is no european country that Russia can take, name me 3, I dare you.
Well my grandfather was a German officer in WW2 , the best Austro Hungarian units in ww1 were Bosnian brigades and Ottoman Army fought that communism and other nonesense doesn't come to Europe in ww1.
So please stop this corny pseudo right wing serenade.
Where were you?
Chomping Tablerone ?
Give me a break
 

contricusc

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In a hypothetic scenario where Russia would attack the baltics, you can't be serious to think that the US would side with Russia, thats crazy talk sorry.

His statements about Canada being a 51th state and stuff like that is pretty silly, I don't take him seriously, and im no fan of Trump he has quite a lot of issues, but I happen to agree with him regarding Ukraine.

Under Trump, he would definitely not side with the Baltics. He would say some stupid things like “it’s not our war”, ”they provoked Putin”, “Kallas is a warmonger”, etc., and he would stay neutral while blaming the Baltics for not doing Putin’s wishes.

For Trump, there is no difference between Ukraine and Estonia. He doesn’t care about either. Also, any alliance, accord or deal is meaningless for him. He signed the USMCA trade deal with Mexico and Canada during his first term, praising it as the “best deal ever”, and now he is threatening to put tariffs on both. He doesn’t even care about the deal he personally signed. Do you think he cares about NATO?

His voter base hates Europe and loves Putin, and all Trump cares about is to score political points at home. International treaties mean nothing to him.
 

blackjack

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Everyone knows I said this over 100 times on this thread and even Trump and Vance have said it multiple times even today with Zelensky, "Ukraine is running out of bodies."

I dont want to compare majority of users here to euro leaders or western media outlets but with the amount of I hate Russia and love Ukraine goal there is none that address the issue of what ways can Ukraine deal with their body shortage even with the fact that increasing weapons and support are not working.

Zelensky did not even attempt to discuss to either Trump or Vance that an increase in weapons and support will get Russians out of their territory due to the fact that Trump and Vance will give him the answer that would crush the general western public's support for Ukraine. No Politican, New's media outlet, some big shot Ukraine twitter user wanted to engage any of J.D. Vance's Twitter posts which were referring to Europe's situation and Ukraine's lack of bodies and I do know those posts of his got like over 10s of millions of views because his response would crush the western public's support for Ukraine if he was to give a further explanation for it. If anything, Zelensky is lucky that neither Trump or Vance went straight for his throat for them to explain why it would be impossible for them to win the war with Russia if they were going to support Ukraine with funding because the answer would be something along the lines of they would get wiped out at the rate they are fighting in the war that would not result in a victory which is the reason they are telling you to make a peace deal.

Has Europe ever explained how much money or support is actually required for Ukraine to win? Their only answers are begging the Americans to get into the war assisting their peacekeepers which basically means admitting that Ukraine can't get the job done keeping the Russians out anymore. So as of now we are going to continue watching the Russian's push west and wait on further actions from Europe which as of now is cheering for Ukraine. Europe is probably going to watch Ukraine get fucked in the ass long enough for Europe to take advantage over whatever is left of Ukraine, at least the west of it. Because Europeans might assume that Ukraine will give up if Russians touch Kiev while they still can physically fuck over Ukraine next demanding for their minerals(as cash back for their support) or what's left of it from the west.......What a fucked ending we will see that even I feel bad.

I know you guys are capable of doing critical thinking even a little of it.
 
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Relic

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Today was strictly for "show". It was completely premeditated by Vance and Trump to appeal to their base. It was back to Trump's days of doing "the Apprentice". But people need to learn to cut through the BS talking points and follow the actions.

1. What Trump is trying to do is get this mineral deal done so he can continue sending military aid to Ukraine quietly, while loudly promoting to his followers that he's made the Ukrainians capitulate to a mineral deal that would recoup the money America has spent on the war. In reality, anyone that has read the leaked text of that deal knows that it was completely hollow and not what Trump and Vance are promoting it to the U.S. people as. What the deal really is, is a way for U.S. direct investment to spread into Ukraine, so that behind the scenes Trump could threaten Putin, and say "those are our interests now, so if you fuck around, I'll give the Ukrainians everything they need to repel you and more"... But on the surface, Trump would let Putin save face by getting a percentage of Ukraine in a peace deal, in exchange for the war coming to an end.

2. What Zelensky did wasn't disrespectful in any context. Again, it was all just "for show" on Trump and Vance's side. But what Zelensky did frustrated the American leadership because he's prodding them to make public comments condemning Putin and wanting them to openly aide with Ukraine, while simultaneously trying to get the Russians to negotiate. Trump and Vance wanted that meeting in front of the public to be all about the mineral deal and convince the base that America was getting some huge win. They were annoyed that Zelensky brought it back to questions about trusting Putin and negotiations, because anything negative they said about Putin would further setup American-Russian negotiations. Trump and Vance were frustrated that Zelensky wanted to talk about the war in public fashion and Zelensky wanted to take the opportunity to hold the feet of the Americans to fire publicly by getting the. To talk about something they were trying to avoid in the public realm.

This was pure geopolitics mixed with entertainment. Trump doesn't hate Zelensky and he fully understands how valuable Ukraine is in draining the Russian resource pool and weakening Russia's hand globally, while destroying their irreplaceable Soviet stockpile. But Trump wants Zelensky to accept the role of playing "weak" on the surface, while continuing to receive support quietly, on the backend. Zelensky, on the other hand, wants support from the Americans to be public and for them to strongly and openly back the Ukrainian war effort, because he thinks that serves as the best deterrent to Putin and creates the best morale for the Ukrainian people. Both sides know that a peace deal between Russia and Ukraine is still quite a ways off, but both want to arrive at it differently.

Meanwhile, Europe wants Ukraine to keep fighting and they're willing to step up with new support packages to keep Ukraine in the fight. But what Europe is after is an increasingly destroyed Russian Army. Make no mistake about it, Ukraine is losing a lot of soldiers and weapons of war too, but Russian advancement costs the Russian military unfathomable amounts of equipment and manpower. We saw them take 6 months and the destruction of Wagner to take tiny, Bahkmut. They've now been stuck for another 7 months attempting to take another defensive position in Pokrovsk. Russia has no reasonable chance of taking Kharkiv or Kramatorsk-Slovyansk within the next year, therefore, Ukraine's eastern strongholds are relatively safe. But if Russia takes 5% more of Ukraine over the next year, at the cost of significant depletion of their armor, artillery shells, etc.... Europe sees that as a win. Kyiv will not fall and what remains of Ukraine post war will eventually join the EU, but right now the Ukrainian willingness to fight for every cm of land is a win for Europe.

In short, nothing has really changed other than Europe realizing that they'll have to step up significantly financially and Trump confirming that they will not be an open ally of the Ukrainians and would rather do things behind the scenes instead, while forcing Europe to foot a great portion of the bill.
 

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