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schuimpjes

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But the Arabs and Muslims around them ? They're not going anywhere, on the contrary at this very century they will represent the single largest human groups.

So Israel will soon find a situation where they could no longer actually look at our eyes the wrong way and not expect us to (at one point in time) drown them all in the Mediteranean. Let alone talk about "paying a high price".
I don’t know why, but number and playing a long game always be the main talking points. There’s no one made time table that shown, “at this year, Muslims as a largest human groups will massacre the Jews”, there’s no one guarantee what you say gonna happen or make sure that’s gonna happen.

And Muslims is not single entity answer to one authority. It is not a Catholics let say, that Pope Urban II had the calling to took the Holy Land then all including Kings with armies gonna answer the call. Muslims maybe sharing emotional bond, but does that mean their actions would also same?

Btw, thing above was the reason why back then Catholics was seen as not fit to be government officials, especially in Protestants (Christian whose free from Vatican authority) dominated society. They seen as having dual or double allegiance. I’m kind of think Muslims kind of like that too tho, no offense
 

schuimpjes

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Don’t need to look far lah, see Indonesia, a country with largest Muslims population in the world. Then what after that?
 

Gary

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I don’t know why, but number and playing a long game always be the main talking points. There’s no one made time table that shown, “at this year, Muslims as a largest human groups will massacre the Jews”, there’s no one guarantee what you say gonna happen or make sure that’s gonna happen.

Because it's a long game, a long game imply that the situations and conditions will be there for a very LOOOOONG time, independent of what a particular individual wants.

Of course there's no guarantee of what will happen, during the peak of the Belle Epoch no one can even imagine, let alone guarantee that Europe will stay a colonial power for how many long. But for the eagle eyed, they will notice that as the standard of living rises, the more access to education common Europeans and their colonial subject could get the more likely the idea of anti-colonialism spread among the population. Add that to the relative success of the "Yellow monkeys" against the Russians in 1905 and you get the situations and conditions where colonialism is increasingly unpopular among Europeans themselves and eventually their subjects.

The situation is, the Americans are actually at their last cycle, that's a condition that will stay for until they eventually end, like all empires before.

We don't know for how long the Americans will stay powerful enough to babysit their dogs in the Middle East, but if it happens that they lose (they'll lose it anyway) the capability to do such. I must say, their pet project in the Middle East is in big trouble.


And Muslims is not single entity answer to one authority. It is not a Catholics let say, that Pope Urban II had the calling to took the Holy Land then all including Kings with armies gonna answer the call. Muslims maybe sharing emotional bond, but does that mean their actions would also same?

Correct, but then again it's not something we can't correct. That's why there's the Da'wa/preaching to begin with. And with a common enemy to point our fingers into, it's going to be easier (in the long run) to turn our general division into something that could unite us.

One of the biggest blessing in disguise of Muslims in the 21st century is we don't actually have a single people to look up into and listen. If there's an Islamic equivalent to the Pope, then it'll be easier for our enemies to use him for the enemy's interests to silence us.

In fact, Muslims are in general very dissatisfied with their ruler (as seen in the Middle East). So for example, the West can't use Bin Salman as a voice to muffle the anger of Muslims worldwide.


Btw, thing above was the reason why back then Catholics was seen as not fit to be government officials, especially in Protestants (Christian whose free from Vatican authority) dominated society. They seen as having dual or double allegiance. I’m kind of think Muslims kind of like that too tho, no offense

No offense as well, but I don't trust the Christians as well especially in Indonesia. It's not like I'm not aware that they have significant bond with the West and in your case, it's not like I haven't notice your fondness with American foreign agent working on political meddling in our country.

medd.png
 

schuimpjes

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satria

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NEKO

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Prett....
Emang berani? Bakal digoyang pemerintahannya, aksi solidaritas untuk palestina aja sampe ngumpul jutaan orang kok.
Emang mau kayak 98? Bisa2 DPR digeruduk dan presiden diminta mundur.

Cuman biar dapat embel2 ikut organisasi saja sampe harus kisruh didalam negeri.
 

Gary

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Ya sekarang tergantung umat Muslim, seberapa sanggup mereka buat cost untuk Jakarta lebih berat daripada benefit yang didapat dari normalisasi.
 

satria

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Prett....
Emang berani? Bakal digoyang pemerintahannya, aksi solidaritas untuk palestina aja sampe ngumpul jutaan orang kok.
Emang mau kayak 98? Bisa2 DPR digeruduk dan presiden diminta mundur.

Cuman biar dapat embel2 ikut organisasi saja sampe harus kisruh didalam negeri.
kayaknya ini inisiasi cek ombak ... ide barat lah ... goyang warga 62 ... pas masuk itu club masi juga dibatasi karena beda ras :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
 

satria

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bisa2 rame negeri ini, barat senang, rakyat berantem mulu cari pembenaran ...

gw yakin 02 sadar, seperti ini bikin pemerintahannya bakal rame trus, contoh mirage aj ada asap lalu di delay ga jelas ;)

kalo mau setara ya gabung BRIC+ lah ...
 

NEKO

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Kita harus membuka hubungan diplomatik dengan israel agar kedudukan setara dan bisa meloby untuk permasalahan di palestina.
Pret juga.

Udah jelas maunya israel apa dan dengan yang israel lakukan terhadap palestina selama beberapa dekade terlebih lagi dengan konflik di gaza sekarang, opsi hubungan diplomatik dengan israel adalah political suicide bagi yang di jakarta. Seharusnya opsi ini ditutup dan pemerintah menyatakan dengan tegas, jadi gak bakal ada isu indonesia akan menjalin hubungan diplomatik dengan israel baik disini ataupun di sana.
Membuka hubungan diplomatik dengan israel adalah BIG win untuk mereka, tanpa adanya keuntungan berarti bagi palestina ataupun berkaitan dengan penyelesaian konflik.
 

Gary

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Kita harus membuka hubungan diplomatik dengan israel agar kedudukan setara dan bisa meloby untuk permasalahan di palestina.
Pret juga.

Udah jelas maunya israel apa dan dengan yang israel lakukan terhadap palestina selama beberapa dekade terlebih lagi dengan konflik di gaza sekarang, opsi hubungan diplomatik dengan israel adalah political suicide bagi yang di jakarta.
Membuka hubungan diplomatik dengan israel adalah BIG win untuk mereka, tanpa adanya keuntungan berarti bagi palestina ataupun berkaitan dengan penyelesaian konflik.

Argumen pendukung Israel itu memang lemah dan dibuat-buat.
Tapi gini aja sih, kalau Jakarta nekat mau normalisasi, ya silahkan aja. Konsekuensinya ada di tangan mereka. Chaos create opportunities for whoever is able and willing to exploit it.

Hamas sudah melakukan apa yang harus dilakukan, seterusnya adalah kemampuan umat Islam untuk exploit dan impose cost bagi normalisasi dan sisasnya wait and see.

Prett....
Emang berani? Bakal digoyang pemerintahannya, aksi solidaritas untuk palestina aja sampe ngumpul jutaan orang kok.
Emang mau kayak 98? Bisa2 DPR digeruduk dan presiden diminta mundur.

Ehh Jangan salah. Bisa jadi kita memang normalisasi. Pernah dengar kata 'Mulkan Jabbariyan / penguasa yang memaksakan kehendak" ? (cari sendiri deh)

Kalau sempat kita normalisasi, berarti udah ga diragukan lagi ini fase 'Mulkan Jabbariyyan". Karena udah ga klop antara keputusan pemerintah dan hajat hidup/kepentingan orang banyak. Perlu diingat sekarang dimana-mana hampir di semua negeri mayoritas Islam, udah merata ga klopnya antara kepentingan umat Islam dan siapa yang berkuasa. Seringkali keputusan (pemerintah) dan kepentingan (umat Islam) selalu bertolak belakang. Dan keputusan pemerintah ini selalu merugikan harta dan nyawa umat Islam.

And that's good, karena setelah itu kita masuk fase 'Ala Minhajjin Nubuwwah".

So be patient.
 

Umigami

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Kalau aku sih yakin semakin muncul beritanya semakin yakin gak akan kejadian dalam waktu dekat
 

Lordimperator

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Argumen pendukung Israel itu memang lemah dan dibuat-buat.
Tapi gini aja sih, kalau Jakarta nekat mau normalisasi, ya silahkan aja. Konsekuensinya ada di tangan mereka. Chaos create opportunities for whoever is able and willing to exploit it.

Hamas sudah melakukan apa yang harus dilakukan, seterusnya adalah kemampuan umat Islam untuk exploit dan impose cost bagi normalisasi dan sisasnya wait and see.



Ehh Jangan salah. Bisa jadi kita memang normalisasi. Pernah dengar kata 'Mulkan Jabbariyan / penguasa yang memaksakan kehendak" ? (cari sendiri deh)

Kalau sempat kita normalisasi, berarti udah ga diragukan lagi ini fase 'Mulkan Jabbariyyan". Karena udah ga klop antara keputusan pemerintah dan hajat hidup/kepentingan orang banyak. Perlu diingat sekarang dimana-mana hampir di semua negeri mayoritas Islam, udah merata ga klopnya antara kepentingan umat Islam dan siapa yang berkuasa. Seringkali keputusan (pemerintah) dan kepentingan (umat Islam) selalu bertolak belakang. Dan keputusan pemerintah ini selalu merugikan harta dan nyawa umat Islam.

And that's good, karena setelah itu kita masuk fase 'Ala Minhajjin Nubuwwah".

So be patient.
 
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