TR TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

[boredaf]

Mark my words, TFX WILL outsell the F-35.

I'll eat a model of F-35 if that ever happens. I understand being excited and proud but letting it go to our heads this much is dangerous. No need to turn into Russia and lose ourselves in our own hype while not even having a end product in our hands.

 

[TheInsider]

TFX can't outsell the F-35 period. It is not possible. We have no production capacity for it. We can't produce 150 TFX per year. We can never match the production rate of the F-35 production line. The moment TFX is available for sale all the production slots will be full I agree but even with an 8-per-month production rate, TAI can only produce 96 TFX per year and i have huge doubts that TAI can scale production to that level. Don't forget that means we need to produce 16 engines, 8 Burfis RF suite etc per month.

I like Temel Kotils stance on the MMU. Turkiye should take calculated risks. We are underdogs and taking risks is the only way we can climb to the top. We can't wait till 2025 for the first flight. We have a fighter that can do taxi tests I think the end of 2023 for the first flight is a logical risk to take. TAI should deliver a completed TFX in 2028 at the latest.

 

[Combat-Master]

I will resist the urge to Temel Koat things

 

[boredaf]

We have no production capacity for it.

It's not even just that, buying F-35 (or most other big military purchases) aren't just about F-35 itself, it is about being on the good side of the US. On top of not having the production capacity for it, we don't have the same standing with as many rich countries as US does. Not to mention some of those countries were also partners in F-35 project.

I'd be perfectly happy with being able to produce our own jet by ourselves, any export is just a bonus on top of that.

 

[TheInsider]

TFX will be sold out the moment it is available. There is a huge market out there. I expect some F-35 users to also buy TFX for air superiority and form a hi-lo mix. I expect TurAF to buy 24 TFX per year for roughly 2 billion $ at the start of the production. TAI will probably export 24 TFX per year on top of that by increasing the production in 2030-2032. TFX production will probably switch to a national engine in 2030.

 

[TheInsider]

BTW TAI will reach a production rate of 2 per month for Gökbey in June and TUSAS expects to sell 1000 Gökbey helicopters. Jandarma(Gendarmes) will buy 100 Gökbeys. Scaling up production is not an easy task.

 

[MADDOG]

İbrahim Sünnetçi:

"The actual maiden flight will take place in 2025, this flight (he is referring to GTU-0's planned 2023 flight) will be a part of the accelerated aircraft flying programme."

 

[TheInsider]

Actual maiden flight = Maiden flight of Block-10.

Block-10 (It will have F110 engines) will be delivered to TurAF in 2028. There will be some amount of production between 2028 and 2030 with F-110 engines. If everything goes well F-110 engines will be replaced with national engines in 2030 but national engines might start trials as early as 2028 again if everything goes according to plan.

 

[Agha Sher]

İbrahim Sünnetçi:

"The actual maiden flight will take place in 2025, this flight (he is referring to GTU-0's planned 2023 flight) will be a part of the accelerated aircraft flying programme."

This makes 0 sense. do they consider us to be retards?

How does GTU-0s first flight not count as the first flight of TF-X

 

[MADDOG]

This makes 0 sense. do they consider us to be retards?

How does GTU-0s first flight not count as the first flight of TF-X

I guess it counts as the first flight of a tech demonstrator. Whereas Block 10's maiden flight will be considered as the genuine first flight.

Not that big of a deal tbh it wouldn't be the first time that officials confused thousands of people with these statements

 

[TheInsider]

This makes 0 sense. do they consider us to be retards?

How does GTU-0s first flight not count as the first flight of TF-X

GTU-0 is MMU too. There won't be monumental changes between GTU-0 and block 10. Maiden flight will happen this year. Maiden flight of block 10 is in 2025 but don't be surprised if it happens Q4 2024 because block 10 production will start this year. Block 10 might be ready for taxi tests in Q1 2024 and first flight might happen in Q4 2024.

 

[moz68k]

I guess it counts as the first flight of a tech demonstrator. Whereas Block 10's maiden flight will be considered as the genuine first flight.

Not that big of a deal tbh it wouldn't be the first time that officials confused thousands of people with these statements

The YF-22 (1990) and F-22 (1997) comparisons seem reasonable to me. Except greatly accelerated of course. I'd bet if the cold war persisted the F-22 would have made its first flight much sooner.

 

[MADDOG]

The YF-22 (1990) and F-22 (1997) comparisons seem reasonable to me. Except greatly accelerated of course. I'd bet if the cold war persisted the F-22 would have made its first flight much sooner.

I guess the only difference is that there won't be that many external differences. Most of the changes will be internal.

 

[Bürküt]

I guess it counts as the first flight of a tech demonstrator. Whereas Block 10's maiden flight will be considered as the genuine first flight.

Not that big of a deal tbh it wouldn't be the first time that officials confused thousands of people with these statements

I think block 0 should not be called as a technology demonstrator.There will be differences between block 0 and block 10. But not like x35 and F35 or YF22 and F22. Kubilay Yıldırım once said in a program.

 

[Era_shield]

This makes 0 sense. do they consider us to be retards?

How does GTU-0s first flight not count as the first flight of TF-X

Test flights mid-development aren't considered maiden flights. Externally it may look complete but many internal sub-systems won't be completed yet at that time.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

In reality, there are no huge changes between YF-22 and the F22. Air intakes were moved to the rear of the fuselage, the design of the horizontal stabilizers was changed, the nose section was further enlonged and wing area increased. I think we will see some changes not only in avionics/subsystems but also in the fuselage of TFX if needed. These changes can be seen as optimization in terms of performance improvement in accordance to requirements thanks to datas to be taken from Block-0.

 

[Heartbang]

I'll eat a model of F-35 if that ever happens. I understand being excited and proud but letting it go to our heads this much is dangerous. No need to turn into Russia and lose ourselves in our own hype while not even having a end product in our hands.

Saved for future reference. Be around.

 

[boredaf]

Saved for future reference. Be around.

Considering the fact that we are about 7 to 10 years away from serial production and they are about to hit 1000 F-35's in a a year or two, I have no problem with that lol

 

[moz68k]

One thing I noticed on the GTU-0 was the lack of an air data boom. I'd guess it's for the upcoming ceremony. We'll see it with a boom before its first flight.

 

[Windchime]

View attachment 55375

In reality, there are no huge changes between YF-22 and the F22. Air intakes were moved to the rear of the fuselage, the design of the horizontal stabilizers was changed, the nose section was further enlonged and wing area increased. I think we will see some changes not only in avionics/subsystems but also in the fuselage of TFX if needed. These changes can be seen as optimization in terms of performance improvement in accordance to requirements thanks to datas to be taken from Block-0.

That is a very misinformed judgement. YF-22 and production F-22 (EMD models and onwards) are very different aircrafts, both inside and outside. YF-22 as well as YF-23 were both more of a technology demostrator models for the ATF competition. In fact, they were only one of the many pre development concept designs that was chosen to be actually built for evaluation. All of these designs were very much far off from what actually became the raptor. Just because they look a bit similar in terms of outer planform doesn't mean that there weren't much changes.

I don't know how different MMU block-0 and 10 will be, but I'm pretty sure that the differences between them will be way less than the differences between YF-22 and F-22