TR Navy Naval Programs

[dBSPL]

So KAAN wont be deployed on the national AC to be built?

'I think' even if there is such planning, it may start at very late stage. I think the most important problem with the KAAN: The Air Force is in urgent need of a new generation fighter. Moreover, the planned procurement size is astronomical, even with different blocks. Apart from the Turkish Air Force, there are at least 2-3 countries looking for an advantageous procurement plan.

It is necessary to search the archives to see if there has been any announcement about this in the past years. Aside from the physical dimensions of the aircraft(almost double compared to any single engine jet), neither KAAN nor MUG is ready at the moment. However, I think that in the MUG design process, they considering an aircraft of these dimensions can of course be navalized and operated on board. The question of whether it can be done is beyond me, but as a home built and most strategic strike/fighter element in hand, this possibility must be evaluated.

On the other side, there is a light jet platform that has completed its 100th sortie and is nearing the end of its development in the aerobatic and jet training aircraft phase, ready for mass production and very close to moving to the next stage in the development roadmap. The development of this variant can be carried out with more modest budgets due to the class of the aircraft, and perhaps it can create the infrastructure for a development program of the kind you mentioned in the 2030s.

 

[Yasar_TR]

A 285 metre long 65000 ton carrier is a seriously large ship. Having said that, both Single and Twin engined KEs and Anka-3 drones are not too different than a fighter jet and a bomber jet in their potential capabilities. Just slightly smaller in size and a great deal cheaper. Instead of a 150m partly usable runway of TCG Anadolu (arguably difficult to believe that any jets can safely land on that LHD), they will have a 285 metre long dedicated runway for carrier operations.
A single or twin engined navalised and reworked Hurjet will definitely add a big plus to our naval force projection.

 

[Quasar]

frankly speaking to erase any potantial question marks TEI should be cooking up a supprise '' a new turbofan engine '' in F 404 class

 

[dBSPL]

Images published on TRT News. I got the photos from Avionot. I think 'around 50 aircraft' is one of the specs that are starting to become clear. This means that I think there are at least 30 combatant jet targets when we exclude tactical drones and various types of aircraft such as utility, CSAR, and AEW etc.

 

[BalkanTurk90]

Turkish Submarine MİLDEN's Construction to Start in 2025 | TURDEF

Chief of the Turkish Navy Ercüment Tatlıoğlu has stated that the construction of MİLDEN national submarines will begin in 2025.

turdef.com

Milden construction to start in 2025 as disclosed whilst the first Reis Class is being accepted in to naval forces inventory.
Turkish Navy’s real indigenisation of submarine program is to start as a whole from design to finished article, as the MILDEN submarine will be Turkish through and through.
Milden will be the epitome of self sufficiency of Turkish navy in submarines.
As local companies are working on Hydrogen based solutions for the power systems it is expected that a form of AIP based power and drive system is to be utilised in Milden. But as the seas surrounding Turkish mainland are deep enough to support nuclear submarines, a nuclear powered sub can not be excluded either.

View attachment 70241

No news about stm 500 submarine??

 

[Nutuk]

Gezgin cant use the same capsule with Sub Atmaca as there is a huuuge difference in size. But we can say for sure tjat the capsule from ceremony is for Sub Atmaca and probably Hisar Derin

Our gezgin will most likely have similar dimensions as the Tomahawk
That is 5.56m (6.25 with booster)

 

[Khagan1923]

Images published on TRT News. I got the photos from Avionot. I think 'around 50 aircraft' is one of the specs that are starting to become clear. This means that I think there are at least 30 combatant jet targets when we exclude tactical drones and various types of aircraft such as utility, CSAR, and AEW etc.

This ship will change so often over the next few years we might not even recognize it anymore by then. Just like TF-2000 has changed with evolving needs and subsystems.

Anyone remember the first TF-2000 designs?

Its always to have discussion like this but we should keep in mind that with an evolving defense industry especially one as fast as Türkiye's things can change in an instant. Just like the Navies needs and wants can change. A couple years ago the talk was about a second LHD now we are at an full blown AC.

I fully expect this design to undergo major changes until it arrives at its first steel cut if it does even arrive there at all. Who knows where the next decade will lead us.

I also don't think that the Navy will be satisfied with Hürjet as its primary fighter. But that is another topic.

 

[Yasar_TR]

This ship will change so often over the next few years we might not even recognize it anymore by then. Just like TF-2000 has changed with evolving needs and subsystems.

Anyone remember the first TF-2000 designs?

Its always to have discussion like this but we should keep in mind that with an evolving defense industry especially one as fast as Türkiye's things can change in an instant. Just like the Navies needs and wants can change. A couple years ago the talk was about a second LHD now we are at an full blown AC.

I fully expect this design to undergo major changes until it arrives at its first steel cut if it does even arrive there at all. Who knows where the next decade will lead us.

I also don't think that the Navy will be satisfied with Hürjet as its primary fighter. But that is another topic.

It s a good and correct decision to design a carrier for the Turkish Navy, since we have the know how to build one; albeit with some help from UK and Spain. .
It will however be the wrong decision to build one under these economic conditions. It is too expensive to build and sustain with our current economy. But in a decade or so from now, it may become a feasible prospect.
Same is the case for TF2000 destroyer. When even a small frigate like I-Class costs best part of 500million dollars to build and equip, a destroyer like TF2000 will far exceed the billion dollar mark.
UK’s six type 45 destroyers each cost 1.4 billion dollars in 2003-2008 period. Pound in today’s inflation corrected is 1.67 times more. That makes 2.35 billion dollars a piece. They were planning to build 12 of them. But remained in 6. According to UK defense Journal, the Type 45 cost to operate is circa 126,000 pounds per day. That is 60million dollars a year.

The soft belly of our defence industry is the motor technology. We need engines for Kaan, Hurjet, KE, Anka-3, atak-t129, Atak-2, Altay, Firtina …….
The air defence project is also a priority case.
We need to turn these above mentioned platforms in to physical realities in our inventory. To do that we need financial resources channelled in to correct targets in accordance with a list of priorities. We also need to produce platforms that we can replace easily with least amount of hassle and pain should we, god forbid, lose them in a fight. At the end of the day, even a large platform like TF2000 is in the mercy of a single torpedo. And it is not a ship that you can send to fight or position in a sea like the Aegean.

Our priority should be Kaan, Anka-3, KE and air defence systems. Plus development of midrange ballistic missiles with capability to hit moving sea targets. (Similar to a Chinese DF21 or even DF21-D). Stationed well inside Anatolian mainland, these missiles can target any ship in the Eastern Med and the Aegean and the targets will not have reasonable means of effective defence against them. I hope we are moving towards that goal with Cenk missile. (There was talk of Tayfun having the capability to hit moving sea targets)

 

[zio]

Second LHD was not bad idea but one LHD is bad idea.You can need it when she was on repairs.

 

[uçuyorum]

Second LHD was not bad idea but one LHD is bad idea.You can need it when she was on repairs.

If its either 1 lhd and one ac or 2 lhd, rather have the ac as well, and support lhd with Bayraktar class. At the end you will always have the capability to do both landing and send some aircraft to support them if one is not available, but you won't have 100% capability all the time

 

[dBSPL]

Is this the final design?

 

[Khagan1923]

Is this the final design?

Looks to me the only thing that changed is the exhaust to a split design again. Everything else looks the same as the design we last saw in april.

 

[Quasar]

Well, look at this then:

"TEI would assemble, inspect, and test the F404 engines, and provide MRO services"

TEI - MoU from TEI, Turkish Aerospace and GE Aerospace

www.tei.com.tr

Thank you bro! Well this may erase several question for instance

what is the role of TEI in F404?
who will assemble F404?
Who will inspect F404?
Who will test F404?
Who will provide MRO services for F404?

Sure answers for these questions will be satisfactory for some yet there can be more questions like

Will holy F404 be the timless god sent solution for all our potantial cases?

 

[Anmdt]

Looks to me the only thing that changed is the exhaust to a split design again. Everything else looks the same as the design we last saw in april.



View attachment 70275

I think they have added few more 'stuff' on the each side of mid hull VLS. Before it was only life rafts, now we have for few more 'stuff' marked with black.

 

[Osman]

Do we still have 96 vls in this deisgn?

 

[Sanchez]

Do we still have 96 vls in this deisgn?

Middle section looks slimmer, probably due to image quality, but the given full weight is unchanged, so should be 96 still. We probably will see a new model in Saha Expo in October and we'll have plenty of photos. Last model we've seen with 16 ASMs behind the funnel is very outdated now. That design had 64 cells with 16 ASMs. Current design have 96 cells with no other launchers. Sensor suite also changed considerably.

From 2021:

 

[Anmdt]

SavunmaSanayiST now claim Dearsan will build 2 "warships" and 2 "support" ships for the navy for a total of 4. Unclear what they will be.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1821982293101285815

Got some "legit" information on the matter, first of all it was not nice of the mentioned media to make this bit of information falsely into news, there is nothing more than a negotiation stage with Dearsan on a certain matter and it is not a done deal. Information leak could not be understood nicely in these conditions.

I will openly tell it when it is the time.

 

[Saithan]

I take that smiley as a good sign and good news… insallah.

 

[Anmdt]

By the end of the procurement programme, there will be more than 10 OPVs.

 

[Fairon]

By the end of the procurement programme, there will be more than 10 OPVs.

Does that mean replacements are also in consideration as well or additional hulls will be added to Corvette/OPV numbers?