TR Air-Force TF-X KAAN Fighter Jet

IC3M@N FX

Contributor
Messages
604
Reactions
3 30 1,233
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
You can also upgrade the TAI KAAN platform to Gen 5.5+, which will enable you to keep pace with Gen 6+ in the long term.
Although the airframe would ultimately be the limiting factor, this isn’t a major issue, as the avionics, MUM-T and sensors, etc., would meet Gen 6 standards from 2040 onwards; therefore, it will still be able to keep up.
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
6,321
Reactions
1 16,103
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
Never implied we were, just that perhaps we have some plans for it.
Financially we're not so bad as many try make out.
Its the natural process of things,after 5th you go for 6th then 7th etc.
First thing we need is the TF35k engine,without it we cant even talk about 5th gen.
 

TurkWolf

Member
Messages
14
Reactions
28
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
You can also upgrade the TAI KAAN platform to Gen 5.5+, which will enable you to keep pace with Gen 6+ in the long term.
Although the airframe would ultimately be the limiting factor, this isn’t a major issue, as the avionics, MUM-T and sensors, etc., would meet Gen 6 standards from 2040 onwards; therefore, it will still be able to keep up.

Its the natural process of things,after 5th you go for 6th then 7th etc.
First thing we need is the TF35k engine,without it we cant even talk about 5th gen.
I am hoping we're proactive after decades of just buying off the shelf.
20-years from now, I hope we're not asking to buy 6 Gen is all I ask for.
Have a feeling we won't so I am strangely optimistic.
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
6,321
Reactions
1 16,103
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
I am hoping we're proactive after decades of just buying off the shelf.
20-years from now, I hope we're not asking to buy 6 Gen is all I ask for.
Have a feeling we won't so I am strangely optimistic.
The reason for developing and producing a 5th gen fighter and other modern platforms was to be independent from others.
Why would you think we would buy the next gen from others after being able to develop and produce our own 6th gen?
Does it make sense to you?
No need to hope we wont be asking anyone,they will ask us to sell.
 

duveil

Active member
Messages
33
Reactions
2 87
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
What does it stop you to go further. I say we should go for 10th gen . Since we dont have “operational” modern fighter jet now and it seem we have at least 7-8 years away from it so I think we are free to tell about our dreams. Come on people. I know everyone has entitled to express his\her ideas but you have to be accept that other people also has a right to call it stupid. I suggest we built our Kaan first then you will have time to talk about what is next.
 

Huelague

Experienced member
Messages
5,101
Reactions
19 5,194
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
So,you have a 5th gen fighter jet ready in production fase?
We are not the Chinese or the Americans with their financial options.
Lets have a 5th gen fighter first.
The iphone 5 was newly on the market, as Steve Jobs worked on iphone 7 after he finished iphone 6. Dont think like a Turk. Think big (like our ancestors).
 

TR_123456

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
6,321
Reactions
1 16,103
Nation of residence
Nethelands
Nation of origin
Turkey
The iphone 5 was newly on the market, as Steve Jobs worked on iphone 7 after he finished iphone 6. Dont think like a Turk. Think big (like our ancestors).
OK,so he already developed the iphone one to five,right?
Did we develop generation one to four in fighter jets?
It is easier to skip a generation if you already have a base in developing a certain product which we dont.
You should think rational logical realistic before thinking big,it will bring you nothing but mocking for being a fantasist.
 

Huelague

Experienced member
Messages
5,101
Reactions
19 5,194
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
OK,so he already developed the iphone one to five,right?
Did we develop generation one to four in fighter jets?
It is easier to skip a generation if you already have a base in developing a certain product which we dont.
You should think rational logical realistic before thinking big,it will bring you nothing but mocking for being a fantasist.
What we do on Kaan is the fine tuning and maturation. I can’t say how far we are on developing a 6. Gen. fighter jet. But what we do is not skipping from one Generation to another. Even we don’t start from Gen. 1.
It was explained very well (T.Kotil) we are building from one level, based on it, to the next level.
Best example is our shipyards, from Yonca Fast Crafts, over Milgem to TF-2000 and LPD.

„This is the way.“ 😉
 

Huelague

Experienced member
Messages
5,101
Reactions
19 5,194
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
@TR_123456
One more point, we don’t come out of nowhere to Kaan. This is not possible.
Even for Turks.
I am not firm in türkish aviation history. But we have had an aviation industry until WW1/2. After that, we worked on 3. Gen. aircrafts like F-16. So, we have some experience I guess.
 

TurkWolf

Member
Messages
14
Reactions
28
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
What does it stop you to go further. I say we should go for 10th gen . Since we dont have “operational” modern fighter jet now and it seem we have at least 7-8 years away from it so I think we are free to tell about our dreams. Come on people. I know everyone has entitled to express his\her ideas but you have to be accept that other people also has a right to call it stupid. I suggest we built our Kaan first then you will have time to talk about what is next.
I say we can build a 100th gen from scratch because we're Turks and we can do the impossible.

Seriously though, I think what I am trying to say is, there must be some planning with 6 Gen by powers that be, Weather that's wise, plausible or financially possible is another discussion.
Even if such a plan was in place they'd not ever reveal it to the masses , as all would ask for updates and what-not.
Anyways , lets get the 5th Gen bird flying first then can discuss the others in due time.
 

Zafer

Experienced member
Messages
5,320
Reactions
15 8,234
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
The main difference between 5th gen and 6th gen planes is the rudderless airframe. I am sure they are brainstorming some designs already. When the 6th gen plane becomes a necessity everything will probably be ready to start building one.
 

Yasar_TR

Experienced member
Staff member
Administrator
Messages
4,020
Reactions
241 20,944
Nation of residence
United Kingdom
Nation of origin
Turkey
Guys, forget about the generation argument.
Tusas knows what the next stage is going to be.
This generation palaver, is all academic.
US produced F22 as a stealth aircraft which made its first flight in 1997. First F35A flew Dec 2006.

Even though it is a more modern aircraft, f35A is no where as capable and potent fighter as an F22 as far as air superiority goes. So if one is gen5 what generation is the other?

Let us get over the hurdle of engines and Kaan serial production first. Then the rest will follow. That is the natural way of things.

Everybody makes up a story about what constitutes gen 5 and gen 6. In fact they are both intertwined with each other with the way things are progressing at the moment. There will be smooth transitions of from one generation to the next. That is why some planes are called gen 4+ and gen 5+ nowadays.
 

IC3M@N FX

Contributor
Messages
604
Reactions
3 30 1,233
Nation of residence
Germany
Nation of origin
Turkey
The F-35 simply has a different role within the U.S. and NATO forces. Due to its stealth capabilities and sensor fusion, the F-35 is considered a superior asset against all 4.5+ generation models; through its “First Look First Shoot” BVR doctrine, it is a “4.5+ Generation Killer.” Ultimately, however, it is a Gen 5+ multi-role fighter that is limited both kinetically and by its range when facing Gen 5+ air superiority fighters.
Assuming the opposing fighters are at least Gen 5+. Turkey could exert significant pressure with the TAI KAAN, even as an early Gen 5 aircraft in the Block 10 version. I don’t believe we’ll ever reach the Americans’ level in stealth and sensor fusion; due solely to their experience, know-how, and technology, there’s a gap of at least 10+ years, and they have the best subcomponents in the aircraft—that’s simply a fact. The problem is that the F-35 can’t be scaled cost-effectively; even if the KAAN, as a Gen 5.5+ aircraft starting in 2035+, achieves only 70–80% of the performance of an F-35/F-22, this is sufficient to exert pressure, as Turkey produces it at cost and can manufacture 250–300 units for domestic use if absolutely necessary.
Add to this effectors like Kizilelma, Anka 3, and Super Simsek.
The remaining NATO countries must purchase the F-35 and effectors from USA at a high cost and wait.
For most European nations, the limit is already 40–60 aircraft because maintenance is simply too expensive. The only exceptions would be the U.S. and Israel, which have unlimited resources.
 

Holikarbon

Active member
Messages
46
Reactions
2 102
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
The iphone 5 was newly on the market, as Steve Jobs worked on iphone 7 after he finished iphone 6. Dont think like a Turk. Think big (like our ancestors).
We are building an ecosystem. Our priority is to build the big world needed to make 5th or 6th generation aircraft. Before thinking about a 6th or 7th generation iPhone, an ecosystem is necessary to do that. These are the things that need to be planned after it's established and Kaan is built.
 

Holikarbon

Active member
Messages
46
Reactions
2 102
Nation of residence
Turkey
Nation of origin
Turkey
@TR_123456
One more point, we don’t come out of nowhere to Kaan. This is not possible.
Even for Turks.
I am not firm in türkish aviation history. But we have had an aviation industry until WW1/2. After that, we worked on 3. Gen. aircrafts like F-16. So, we have some experience I guess.
We lacked both institutional memory and people to pass on the experience gained from those years. When this kind of knowledge accumulation is interrupted, it is considered dead. Therefore, there is no accumulated knowledge from those years. The knowledge was acquired later.
 
Top Bottom