TR Attack & Utility Helicopter Programs

[Cabatli_TR]

TAI: Qualification trials of Atak Phase-II have been completed.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

T-625 in JGK colors

 

[AzeriTank]

It boils down to power to weight ratio. If the T629 P/W is less than the T129 P/W then it is less hot and high capable. It is up to how much less it will be. It can still be within acceptable parameters for Pakistan's intended geography. Mind you, when there is already the T129 for hot and high making another helicopter with the same hot and high capability makes no sense. Other possible users like the Philippines and lowland Turkey and the marine environment can be better served with a lower P/W ratio helicopter that uses its power to carry more structural, armor, sensor and weapons load than saving the power for hot and high. The specifications have not been announced yet so there is no solid evidence to what its forte will be.

in aviation, its not only about weight to power ration... its also about the engine.. as you go up, there is less oxygen and less density in the air. your helicopter should be able to work on that condition... take it chinese drone, why they cannot go high attitude with diesel engine as Turkish products? even though they show in paper that they have more lifting capabilities, fly longer and so on, but their operational capability is around 3000-4000 meters attitude. thats why they get shoot down easily.
or, they can try to go up, as Algeria tried several times but 3 of them fall down during the test. because the engines is not designed to work on high attitude.
as you know when those helicopters go to high attitude, engines loose its power, question is how much power they keep at high attitude and the most important one how long they can work at that attitude... ??

 

[Zafer]

in aviation, its not only about weight to power ration... its also about the engine.. as you go up, there is less oxygen and less density in the air. your helicopter should be able to work on that condition... take it chinese drone, why they cannot go high attitude with diesel engine as Turkish products? even though they show in paper that they have more lifting capabilities, fly longer and so on, but their operational capability is around 3000-4000 meters attitude. thats why they get shoot down easily.
or, they can try to go up, as Algeria tried several times but 3 of them fall down during the test. because the engines is not designed to work on high attitude.
as you know when those helicopters go to high attitude, engines loose its power, question is how much power they keep at high attitude and the most important one how long they can work at that attitude... ??

It is all about power to weight ratio and that ratio changes by altitude. Engines have different power ratings for sea level and high altitude. Turbine engines do not care much about altitude as they can provide plenty of air for good combustion already and large helicopters are always powered by turbine engines.

However piston engines are susceptible to oxygen starvation at high altitude if they are not equipped with superchargers/turbochargers. Superchargers suck in enough air for good combustion. And the TEI D170 sports a double serial turbocharger system that provides the required air at high altitude. Rotax engines that are used by Baykar too maybe modified for high altitude, I am guessing.

For very high altitude engines have to work at their top power rating to provide the movement of larger air volume required to keep the helicopter in the air. At that point engines get worn if they are kept at that power level for too long. The helicopter that landed on top of Mount Everest almost melted down its engines if it hovered seconds longer.

 

[AzeriTank]

It is all about power to weight ratio and that ratio changes by altitude. Engines have different power ratings for sea level and high altitude. Turbine engines do not care much about altitude as they can provide plenty of air for good combustion already and large helicopters are always powered by turbine engines.

However piston engines are susceptible to oxygen starvation at high altitude if they are not equipped with superchargers/turbochargers. Superchargers suck in enough air for good combustion. And the TEI D170 sports a double serial turbocharger system that provides the required air at high altitude. Rotax engines that are used by Baykar too maybe modified for high altitude, I am guessing.

For very high altitude engines have to work at their top power rating to provide the movement of larger air volume required to keep the helicopter in the air. At that point engines get worn if they are kept at that power level for too long. The helicopter that landed on top of Mount Everest almost melted down its engines if it hovered seconds longer.

Mi-24 helicopter use 2x1700 Hp engine. its 8t helicopter, can go up only 4500 meters, operational attitude is lower than that in reality,
t-619 use 2x1400 hp engine for 6t aircraft but operational attitude is 6500 meters. as you can see even though there is not much difference on weight to hp ration, huge difference on the attitude..
Also, when you install thermal exhaust for those engines, it also makes a little difference. if you add of all of these, it makes big difference.. even the design of the helicopter matters.

 

[Zafer]

Mi-24 helicopter use 2x1700 Hp engine. its 8t helicopter, can go up only 4500 meters, operational attitude is lower than that in reality,
t-619 use 2x1400 hp engine for 6t aircraft but operational attitude is 6500 meters. as you can see even though there is not much difference on weight to hp ration, huge difference on the attitude..
Also, when you install thermal exhaust for those engines, it also makes a little difference. if you add of all of these, it makes big difference.. even the design of the helicopter matters.

There are other parameters in a helicopters design like disc loading that affects performance. Every major difference in design actually effects its performance. What matters for altitude performance is how high it can hover out of ground effect, HOGE. A helicopter can usually fly up to 7000 meters or so but most of them can only hover at around 4000 meters.

 

[AzeriTank]

There are other parameters in a helicopters design like disc loading that affects performance. Every major difference in design actually effects its performance. What matters for altitude performance is how high it can hover out of ground effect, HOGE. A helicopter can usually fly up to 7000 meters or so but most of them can only hover at around 4000 meters.

so you agree with me now that its not only about weight to power ratio right? )

 

[Zafer]

so you agree with me now that its not only about weight to power ratio right? )

Sure, but still it is the parameter that has the biggest effect.

 

[Huelague]

What is T-929 project?

 

[Test7]

What is T-929 project?

I don't think there is a project with this name. Troll's clickbait..

 

[Zafer]

What is T-929 project?

T-929 = Atak-2


T = Atak + 927

 

[AzeriTank]

Sure, but still it is the parameter that has the biggest effect.

everybody knows that, even people used to say it about fighter jets when they forget about drag and so on...
i am ok if a new guy says it, but you need to be more specific, especially when you talk against Turkish made products..

 

[Zafer]

everybody knows that, even people used to say it about fighter jets when they forget about drag and so on...
i am ok if a new guy says it, but you need to be more specific, especially when you talk against Turkish made products..

T-629 is my favorite helicopter for it is a perfected remake of the T-129 possibly also getting around some Italian patents that were granted to them by Turkey. My words are my honest and realistic opinion. The actual performance that the new helicopter will afford can not be known until it is tested. Because many parameters will be changed on it with some working in favor of better performance and some against. We don't even know what mission profiles it is optimized for. So asserting that it will perform in a certain way is not realistic. All I know is we don't need a second model of helicopter with the same mission profile.

 

[Huelague]

T-929 = Atak-2


T = Atak + 927

That’s it.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Atak Phase-II in production

 

[Glass🚬]

Atak Phase-II in production

View attachment 10374

How many will be produced?

 

[CAN_TR]

Atak Phase-II in production

View attachment 10374

On the left side above the emblem of Iraqi Ministry of Defence, did they visit TAI production facilities?

 

[Test7]

How many will be produced?

Currently 21 units.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

On the left side above the emblem of Iraqi Ministry of Defence, did they visit TAI production facilities?

Yes, The images were taken during this visit.

 

[Bogeyman]

80th ATAK helicopter on the production line