Academic Future of Education in Turkey

[Zafer]

Sending students to get the science of the world is so passe.
We need to make our schools work for us and teach our students for our goals and not the goals of someone else.

 

[adenl]

I'm trying to explain something to a mindset that advocates intervening in universities and science . I guess I'm naive.

Yes you are. But don't hit yourself on the head for it, geopolitics and strategy is a secretive area from which we get to know very little of but we can understand it if one is willing to put in the time and effort and to do away with ones pre-conceived notion of what 'should' be instead of what something 'is'. It is an ego and naivety breaking process that not many people can endure.

 

[Turko]

Sending students to get the science of the world is so passe.
We need to make our schools work for us and teach our students for our goals and not the goals of someone else.

Let's do it but with which army?

 

[Turko]

Yes you are. But don't hit yourself on the head for it, geopolitics and strategy is a secretive area from which we get to know very little of but we can understand it if one is willing to put in the time and effort and to do away with ones pre-conceived motioned of what 'should' be instead of what something 'is'. It is an ego and naivety breaking process that not many people can endure.

I could not get an education for economic reasons. (Translate it in turkish you would find it funny)

 

[Turko]

 

[Anmdt]

Sending students to get the science of the world is so passe.
We need to make our schools work for us and teach our students for our goals and not the goals of someone else.

Ever heard of inbreeding in science?
Ever visited a lab on abroad?
The budget of lab i have been to in Japan was surpassing budget of an entire university in Turkey (one of the among top 10).
Science grows with collaboration, the defense industry grows with science. You need smart people who is well educated and who can convert that science into practice.
We need to send students to get science, culture, research abilities & we need to grow people on our own who can educate the youth. Education and science two separate fields and we shouldn't expect a pure scientist and researcher to go into classes and give lectures. We should grow the education part of the science on our own according to our needs.
there are new efforts which has been in action to separate applied fields and education in Universities, already applied to post-doc, post-graduates, slowly will be imposed on research assistants by granting a new title as "teaching assistant" and relieving them of either research or teaching.

 

[mulj]

if this move means more STEM less "humanistic" sciences it is great one. empty talk of univesities shit talk from one empty glass to other one is only burden for society.

 

[Zafer]

Ever heard of inbreeding in science?
Ever visited a lab on abroad?
The budget of lab i have been to in Japan was surpassing budget of an entire university in Turkey (one of the among top 10).
Science grows with collaboration, the defense industry grows with science. You need smart people who is well educated and who can convert that science into practice.
We need to send students to get science, culture, research abilities & we need to grow people on our own who can educate the youth. Education and science two separate fields and we shouldn't expect a pure scientist and researcher to go into classes and give lectures. We should grow the education part of the science on our own according to our needs.
there are new efforts which has been in action to separate applied fields and education in Universities, already applied to post-doc, post-graduates, slowly will be imposed on research assistants by granting a new title as "teaching assistant" and relieving them of either research or teaching.

That is yesterdecades' normal. Iron curtains are being pulled now and standing alone is the new norm.

 

[Anmdt]

That is yesterdecades' normal. Iron curtains are being pulled now and standing alone is the new norm.

Those iron curtains aren't really pulled for science and education, thousands of students are going from China and eventually returning back. Not mentioning of those who is from Iran and studying in fields which is sensitive, as well.

 

[Zafer]

Now, they are seen as spies.
Numbers are coming down.

In the past there was a huge divide between capabilities of countries but now this rift is not as big.
Countries have established their own research facilities and development programs.
The world is going towards multi-polar division.
Countries that have amassed enough strength go for stand alone operation.
And the US is repulsive in this respect.
Academic world is not immune to politics.

 

[Saithan]

Something I wrote in another thread about the political realities of Turkey:



This applies to universities also.

Good point, Politics in Turkey is like supporting a football team, different teams fans do not like each other.

This doesn't mean politicians should continue this trait. That's a failure as politician and one who strives for democracy.

 

[Anmdt]

Now, they are seen as spies.

Do you know how many retired renowned professors have moved to China and governing major scientific projects?
Do you know how many renowned professors has close ties with Chinese academicians who is also aiding the defense industry in China?
I don't know numbers but what i know is -many.
I am lazy to check numbers but at least quarter of positions available at labs in US is filled by Chinese post-grad students. and there are thousands of Iranian who is studying in Europe-US and actually returns back to their countries.

In the past there was a huge divide between capabilities of countries but now this rift is not as big.
Countries have established their own research facilities and development programs.
The world is going towards multi-polar division.
Countries that have amassed enough strength go for stand alone operation.
And the US is repulsive in this respect.
Academic world is not immune to politics.

Should i start to count Russians who had their post-grad in US in the peak times of Cold War when the world was actually "polarized"
Please don't mix this political bullsh#t into science and education matters.

 

[Zafer]

Do you know how many retired renowned professors have moved to China and governing major scientific projects?
Do you know how many renowned professors has close ties with Chinese academicians who is also aiding the defense industry in China?
I don't know numbers but what i know is -many.
I am lazy to check numbers but at least quarter of positions available at labs in US is filled by Chinese post-grad students. and there are thousands of Iranian who is studying in Europe-US and actually returns back to their countries.



Should i start to count Russians who had their post-grad in US in the peak times of Cold War when the world was actually "polarized"
Please don't mix this political bullsh#t into science and education matters.

Bias is in the mind of the beholder.
Post pandemic world is a different one, wake up.

 

[Anmdt]

Bias is in the mind of the beholder.
Post pandemic world is a different one, wake up.

 

[Zafer]

Read between the lines.

 

[Test7]

Posts not related to topic integrity have been deleted.

 

[Huelague]

@Zafer is right about the spies. I know it from GER.

 

[TR_123456]

Ever heard of inbreeding in science?
Ever visited a lab on abroad?
The budget of lab i have been to in Japan was surpassing budget of an entire university in Turkey (one of the among top 10).
Science grows with collaboration, the defense industry grows with science. You need smart people who is well educated and who can convert that science into practice.
We need to send students to get science, culture, research abilities & we need to grow people on our own who can educate the youth. Education and science two separate fields and we shouldn't expect a pure scientist and researcher to go into classes and give lectures. We should grow the education part of the science on our own according to our needs.
there are new efforts which has been in action to separate applied fields and education in Universities, already applied to post-doc, post-graduates, slowly will be imposed on research assistants by granting a new title as "teaching assistant" and relieving them of either research or teaching.

The post you quoted says it all.

 

[Saithan]

Legal action on way against academic ghostwriting 'industry' - Türkiye News

As academic ghostwriting ‘industry’ continues its unavoidable growth in Turkey, the country’s Higher Education Council (YÖK) filed a criminal complaint to the Ankara Chief Public Prosecutor’s Office about the suspects who prepared academic thesis and essays in exchange of money.

www.hurriyetdailynews.com

5 years prison for having someone write your thesis for you ? Wouldn't it be enough to kick the person out of the university ?

Doesn't universities normally have their own way of dealing with fraud or plagiarism ?

 

[mulj]

Legal action on way against academic ghostwriting 'industry' - Türkiye News

As academic ghostwriting ‘industry’ continues its unavoidable growth in Turkey, the country’s Higher Education Council (YÖK) filed a criminal complaint to the Ankara Chief Public Prosecutor’s Office about the suspects who prepared academic thesis and essays in exchange of money.

www.hurriyetdailynews.com

5 years prison for having someone write your thesis for you ? Wouldn't it be enough to kick the person out of the university ?

Doesn't universities normally have their own way of dealing with fraud or plagiarism ?

it is simple like with the throwing paper on street, there is service for cleaning streets but what helps them also is sanction for throwing it. this kind of measure is fine as it could help that education retrieve some lost integrity in the time of internet and social media, i see it like free assistance from state to the universities. don't understand your objection fraud is fraud it does not matter if it is only for university degree or some financial scam where people for that serve same amount of time or so.