TR Air Defence Programs

[Afif]

Quad packable Siper missile with a range of 100km. This missile can provides a destroyer's firepower to a corvette.

It doesn't seem SIPER can be packed in quad! It just to big, even without a booster ( I mean HISAR RF ) however, for that matter turkish navy propably have G40.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

It doesn't seem SIPER can be packed in quad! It just to big, even without a booster ( I mean HISAR RF ) however, for that matter turkish navy propably have G40.

The Navy want a quad-pack missile for MIDAS and currently the Navy's missile is the Hisar-Rf. It was said that no requests were made for the G40 yet. We're just brainstorming on the possibility of packing with the same requirements for Siper Blk-1, derived from Hisar-Rf.

 

[UkroTurk]

Can someone guess the range of radar and range of target?

 

[Oublious]

Can someone guess the range of radar and range of target?

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They hit the target 100 km and the target is end of the first block, i see 5 blocks. if each block is 100km will make it 500 km range...

 

[Baryshx]

Birisi radar menzilini ve hedef menzilini tahmin edebilir mi?

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He answered some of the questions you asked.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1563224567623340033

 

[Khagan1923]

As expected Siper Block 0/1 is very slim. Interest in seeing the further evolution of it and how much the shape is going to change going forward.

I expect Block 2 and 3 to be similar in design to SM-3 and SM-6.

 

[UkroTurk]

As expected Siper Block 0/1 is very slim. Interest in seeing the further evolution of it and how much the shape is going to change going forward.

I expect Block 2 and 3 to be similar in design to SM-3 and SM-6.

Just wanted to share...

 

[Ecderha]

So Siper Block 0/1 made many tests and it is on final phase of tests.
Can we send some package to Ukraine for real tests?

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Mr Ismail Demir: We add Hisar-A at an altitude of 2km and a range of 5km more and made Hisar-A+. We add Hisar-O at an altitude of 5km and a range of 10km more and made Hisar-O+. Currently, we can reach an altitude of 15 km on these.

Now the real question to be asked is: What is the actual range of the Hisar-Rf which reaches 100km with this small size booster?

• Hisar-A(15+km range, 8km altitude), Hisar-A+(20+km range, 10km altitude)
• Hisar-O( 25+km range, 10km altitude) Hisar-O+( 35+km range, 15km altitude)
• Hisar-Rf (~60-70km range, ~20(?)km altitude
• Hisar-Rf+Booster (Siper Blk0/1) (100km range, 25km altitude)

 

[Cabatli_TR]

A nice comparison from @SavunmaSanayiST.com

 

[Afif]

Now the real question to be asked is: What is the actual range of the Hisar-Rf which reaches 100km with this small size booster?

• Hisar-A(15+km range, 8km altitude), Hisar-A+(20+km range, 10km altitude)
• Hisar-O( 25+km range, 10km altitude) Hisar-O+( 35+km range, 15km altitude)
• Hisar-Rf (~60-70km range, ~20(?)km altitude
• Hisar-Rf+Booster (Siper Blk0/1) (100km range, 25km altitude)

Even though siper is based on hisar rf it has slightly larger body and also even though the booster is small the 3 4 second extra burn time can make a lot of difference in range. So hisar rf probably is 40-50 km not 60-70.

[URL . A while ago I made a calculation of hisar a+ and hisar o+ motor burn's time from available videos. ( I am quite sure I got it relatively correct ) hence the range calculation

First, the hisar a+ has motor burn time of 7.5 to 8 second so it can quite comfortably intercept a target at 20 km as for comparison mica has motor burn time of 6 seconds with a range of 20 km. However it should be noted at 20km hisar a+ may not gerunte the kill, which it has at 15 km range.

Now, in case of hisar o+ it has 9 to 9.5 second motor burn time. so yes, it can be quite effective at 35km but propably can gerunte a hit at 30 km as compared to essm block ii which has a motor burn time of 10 to 10.5 second with a range of 50 km. Even though, these are only my speculations however, I think it has little credibility.

If hisar o+ had a more powerful aesa radar like the one IRIS T SLM has it could be easily considered the 2nd best medium range air defence system in the world with IRIS T SLM. As far as i know, no other medium range interceptor combined the benefits of TVC and dual pulse motor ( sustaining 50g at early stage of flight and 40g when engaging the target ) expect barak 8. However I have some doubt about kalkan radars capability, as its effective range quite small and it is originally pesa hence quite vanurable to jamming (Can anyone has any information about kalkan ii? Is it aesa ? )

 

[Trakya_forever]

Its an interim solution. We re still waiting for the real Siper missile. Maybe at IDEF23.

 

[Huelague]

As expected Siper Block 0/1 is very slim. Interest in seeing the further evolution of it and how much the shape is going to change going forward.

I expect Block 2 and 3 to be similar in design to SM-3 and SM-6.

Which has formidable altitude performance.

 

[Knowledgeseeker]

Could you please translate what is he wrote ?

If we look at the data shared in the video, the SİPER Air Defense System hit the target (150 m/s) traveling at a speed of 540 km per hour at an altitude of 8 km from a distance of approximately 93 km (42,0992,36,3205 target coordinate).

 

[Afif]

Does anyone has any idea of type 80 drone's radar cross section ?

 

[RadarGudumluMuhimmat]

Now the real question to be asked is: What is the actual range of the Hisar-Rf which reaches 100km with this small size booster?

• Hisar-A(15+km range, 8km altitude), Hisar-A+(20+km range, 10km altitude)
• Hisar-O( 25+km range, 10km altitude) Hisar-O+( 35+km range, 15km altitude)
• Hisar-Rf (~60-70km range, ~20(?)km altitude
• Hisar-Rf+Booster (Siper Blk0/1) (100km range, 25km altitude)

The fuel tanks of Hisar O+ and RF are the same, naturally, such a range value difference is impossible in the RF missile you mentioned. In addition, the booster you mentioned as small has a burning time of 8 seconds and the main reason for its design is to accelerate an 800 kg anti-ship missile, naturally it is not that small. Considering that this booster has overcome the low altitude region, which is the most difficult part of the road, where friction and gravity are high, it is quite normal to reach these ranges. If you integrate the same booster into Hisar O+, you will get the same results. It is impossible to get a range value of 70 km from Hisar RF. This isn't a Pac 3.

 

[Cabatli_TR]

Even though siper is based on hisar rf it has slightly larger body and also even though the booster is small the 3 4 second extra burn time can make a lot of difference in range. So hisar rf probably is 40-50 km not 60-70.

HİSAR-RF SGTM Firing Test and the Differences Between the SİPER B1 Missile

On February 19, 2022, President of Defence Industries (SSB) İsmail DEMİR announced on his social media account that the HİSAR-O+ System successfully destroyed a target in the first firing test carried out with the RF (Radio Frequency) Seeker model. DEMİR said,

www.defenceturkey.com

Your other speculations are quite correct. A while ago I made a calculation of hisar a+ and hisar o+ motor burn's time from available videos. ( I am quite sure I got it relatively correct ) hence the range calculation

First, the hisar a+ has motor burn time of 7.5 to 8 second so it can quite comfortably intercept a target at 20 km as for comparison mica has motor burn time of 6 seconds with a range of 20 km. However it should be noted at 20km hisar a+ may not gerunte the kill, which it has at 15 km range.

Now, in case of hisar o+ it has 9 to 9.5 second motor burn time. so yes it can be quite effective at 35km but propably can gerunte a hit at 30 km as compared to essm block ii which has a motor burn time of 10 to 10.5 second with a range of 50 km. Even though, these are only speculations however I think it has some credibility.

If hisar o+ had a more powerful aesa radar like the one IRIS T SLM has it could be easily considered the 2nd best medium range air defence system in the world with IRIS T SLM. As far as i know, no other medium range interceptor combined the benefits of TVC and dual pulse motor expect barak 8. However I have some doubt about kalkan radars capability, as it effective range quite small and it is originally pesa hence quite vanurable to jamming (Can anyone has any information about kalkan ii? Is it aesa ? )

I'm not speculating. I write the officially announced ranges and add the values in the official explanations. You didn't need to calculate the burn times of the engines of other missiles to prove the given ranges of these missiles.

The range in hisar-Rf is of course an estimate if you look at the range scale so I asked this question and This is also a controversial subject and has the potential to create good technical discussions under this topic but the truth is that the information about size difference between Hisar-Rf used in the Siper Blk1 and original Hisar-Rf isn't depend on official information or technical truths. What is certain is that the fins have been enlarged to compensate for the negative moment created by the Booster but It is not possible to comment on the dimensions by putting the photos side by side so we interpret based on the knowledge that the two missiles are the same in terms of seeker head fuel tanks...etc

 

[Glass🚬]

Enjoy this moment my friends! And let me take some part in your celebration! Wow! just wow ! what else can i say! may allah bless those who worked for it days and nights! May allah bless those who believed in their youth and engineers rahter than simply buying it from 'allies'! may allah bless turkiye and its all people ! you are truly becoming a beacon of hope and inspiration for all of us! Just because of you now we know, if turkiye can do it today inshaallah! my country can do it tomorrow! We just need to put some faith in our own youth and engineers like turkiye did!

wow

 

[Afif]

The fuel tanks of Hisar O+ and RF are the same, naturally, such a range value difference is impossible in the RF missile you mentioned. In addition, the booster you mentioned as small has a burning time of 8 seconds and the main reason for its design is to accelerate an 800 kg anti-ship missile, naturally it is not that small. Considering that this booster has overcome the low altitude region, which is the most difficult part of the road, where friction and gravity are high, it is quite normal to reach these ranges. If you integrate the same booster into Hisar O+, you will get the same results. It is impossible to get a range value of 70 km from Hisar RF. This isn't a Pac 3.

booster burning is time 8 second ? are you sure ?

 

[Cabatli_TR]

The fuel tanks of Hisar O+ and RF are the same, naturally, such a range value difference is impossible in the RF missile you mentioned. In addition, the booster you mentioned as small has a burning time of 8 seconds and the main reason for its design is to accelerate an 800 kg anti-ship missile, naturally it is not that small. Considering that this booster has overcome the low altitude region, which is the most difficult part of the road, where friction and gravity are high, it is quite normal to reach these ranges. If you integrate the same booster into Hisar O+, you will get the same results. It is impossible to get a range value of 70 km from Hisar RF. This isn't a Pac 3.

I don't think the fuel tanks are the same in both missile. There are weight and friction differences between Hisar-Rf and Hisar-O+ due to their design so Hisar-Rf will appear as a heavier missile even if the lengths are same. Integrating fuel tanks with the same thrust and burn time at this weight will cause you to sacrifice the range increase from the advantagea to be gained from rf seeker head. This causes the range to actually not increase significantly but It is known fact that Hisar-Rf will have a way longer range than Hisar-O.

I agree with what you said about the booster effect so but ranges may vary which is normal.