Bangladesh Army Bangladesh Army

[Afif]

Very interesting development bro! When it comes to the Bangladeshi land forces you guys could need some modern IFVs, as well as Altay tanks. The MLRS file is closed but needs a huge quantity of artillery. With the introduction of Hisar o+, and later the SIPER Bangladesh would have closed the file of the equipment for its land forces. It would definitely be the most modern army in the region in terms of quality. Seems like Bangladesh is taking a similar route as Morocco when it comes to filling its gaps, but has a long-term plan for a domestic defense industry.

When it comes to IFV/AFV we probably gonna need around 900-1000 of them.
Those will be wheeled instead of tracked. For example, BMC's Altug or FNSS pars iii equipped with Aselsan's 35mm Korhan turret would be cost effective but nevertheless capable platform. This process to replace all of our BTR-80 and old Chinese/soviet vehicles will take a decade at least. Probably starting at late 2020s and ending at late 2030s.

About MLRS I think we need one more regiment to deploy at our north west region. The same is true with Hisar O+, we are probably buying 1x regiment initially but will need 1x more.

And about the quantity of Artillery you are dead right. Both when it comes to the numbers of platform and number of shells. ( that is why I think that domestic production line would help)

Morocco has lots of M109s, that is a big plus point for you.

 

[Knowledgeseeker]

When it comes to IFV/AFV we probably gonna need around 900-1000 of them.
Those will be wheeled instead of tracked. For example, BMC's Altug or FNSS pars iii equipped with Aselsan's 35mm Korhan turret would be cost effective but nevertheless capable platform. This process to replace all of our BTR-80 and old Chinese/soviet vehicles will take a decade at least. Probably starting at late 2020s and ending at late 2030s.

About MLRS I think we need one more regiment to deploy at our north west region. The same is true with Hisar O+, we are probably buying 1x regiment initially but will need 1x more.

And about the quantity of Artillery you are dead right. Both when it comes to the numbers of platform and number of shells. ( that is why I think that domestic production line would help)

Morocco has lots of M109s, that is a big plus point for you.

1 000 IFV is a far strech bro. Let's be realistic the procurement budget is probably not the highest, and Bangladesh has a lot to modernize. It seems like, and I hope that the Bangladeshi leadership is transforming all of its branches in both weapons, but also the way to conduct modern warfare. Yes, I did not look into the quantity of MLRS and the air defense systems but I was more thinking about what's present at the moment. Artillery is much cheaper compares to missiles, and it has always been the backbone of armies for centuries.

Any plan to raise the defense budget? Bangladesh could need a heavy lift for the next years coming to 2030 for a huge transformation.

 

[Afif]

1 000 IFV is a far strech bro. Let's be realistic the procurement budget is probably not the highest, and Bangladesh has a lot to modernize. It seems like, and I hope that the Bangladeshi leadership is transforming all of its branches in both weapons, but also the way to conduct modern warfare. Yes, I did not look into the quantity of MLRS and the air defense systems but I was more thinking about what's present at the moment. Artillery is much cheaper compares to missiles, and it has always been the backbone of armies for centuries.

Any plan to raise the defense budget? Bangladesh could need a heavy lift for the next years coming to 2030 for a huge transformation.

I understand why are you thinking this is far fetched. But we actually currently have around 600 BTR-80 and around 200 old soviet and Chinese heavy armoured vehicles. If we replace them it will be wheeled platforms that can transform into modern AFV with 30/35mm turret. Does not cost more then 2.5/3 millions.

So around 900 would cost 2.7 billion. And if the program stretched over a decade I think it is pretty affordable, considering our economy will grow into a bigger size by late 2030s. you need to keep in mind I am not talking about this decade, Rather something like 2028/2029 to 2038/2039.

Yes, fielding heavy Artilleries is very important, And as I said before, given Army is establishing a Modern Turn-Key production line for 155mm shell it definitely means we are gonna have more 155mm howitzers in the near future. Otherwise it doesn’t make sense to establish a full production line for 18 howitzers only.

To your last point, I think defence budget will gradually increase from 2025 and onward. Also, big procurements would have separate budget than annual budgets.

 

[PutinBro]

But we actually currently have around 600 BTR-80

There are 800-850 BTR in BA.

 

[Knowledgeseeker]

I understand why are you thinking this is far fetched. But we actually currently have around 600 BTR-80 and around 200 old soviet and Chinese heavy armoured vehicles. If we replace them it will be wheeled platforms that can transform into modern AFV with 30/35mm turret. Does not cost more then 2.5/3 millions.

So around 900 would cost 2.7 billion. And if the program stretched over a decade I think it is pretty affordable, considering our economy will grow into a bigger size by late 2030s. you need to keep in mind I am not talking about this decade, Rather something like 2028/2029 to 2038/2039.

Yes, fielding heavy Artilleries is very important, And as I said before, given Army is establishing a Modern Turn-Key production line for 155mm shell it definitely means we are gonna have more 155mm howitzers in the near future. Otherwise it doesn’t make sense to establish a full production line for 18 howitzers only.

To your last point, I think defence budget will gradually increase from 2025 and onward. Also, big procurements would have separate budget than annual budgets.

Got your point, i was more thinking about this decade. 1 000 APC are not far streched however i thought you was refering to 1000 IFV. 1000 IFV would be a cost burden when Bangladesh have alot of different gaps in its armed forces. I hope the budget will increase because the modernization will cost a couple of tens of billions. I find it also interesting how Bangladesh wants to build a big Navy at this point.

 

[Gary]

Is there a reason why M1 helmets are so widespread in BA? I saw a lot of regular Bd infantry still uses M1 helmet. Why not at least procure the PASGT or other modern helmet.

 

[F-6 enthusiast]

Is there a reason why M1 helmets are so widespread in BA? I saw a lot of regular Bd infantry still uses M1 helmet. Why not at least procure the PASGT or other modern helmet.

Also : no optics

 

[Gary]

Also : no optics

Well for developing countries, infantrymen without optics is not uncommon. We also rarely sport TNI rifleman with optics. But helmets like PASGT has been the norm everywhere now, some has even replace PASGT with other FAST type helmet.

 

[F-6 enthusiast]

Defence Exports & Updates

Mali, Wagner and TB2!?🤔 Nah If wagner already had the TB2 then they would have used it in Ukraine already Russia and Wagner already have numerous wrecked TB2 samples in the home country that it doesnt make sense for them or the Turkish govt to sell such weapons to Russia through Mali It is...

defencehub.live

@Afif
hopefully we can get some level of ToT with this deal.
Any plans to replace 130mm Artillery with Turkish 155mm guns ?
what options are available to us ?

Can TB-2s be used to produce a firing solution for artillery and give correction data ?

 

[Afif]

Defence Exports & Updates

Mali, Wagner and TB2!?🤔 Nah If wagner already had the TB2 then they would have used it in Ukraine already Russia and Wagner already have numerous wrecked TB2 samples in the home country that it doesnt make sense for them or the Turkish govt to sell such weapons to Russia through Mali It is...

defencehub.live

@Afif
hopefully we can get some level of ToT with this deal.

Inshallah, but I have fear relevant leadership from our side may lack the necessary will and proper planning.

Any plans to replace 130mm Artillery with Turkish 155mm guns ?
what options are available to us ?

Usually, I am the hopeful one.
But I don't think so. Turkish 155mm Firtina ii is too expensive. (Around 8/9 millions per units)
When truck mounted ARPAN is ready it could be within reach. (probably around 4/5 millions per unit) But still expensive.

However, on the other hand there is no point in opening a dedicated ultra-modern 155mm shell production line for 1/2 regiment howitzers only. (18/36 howitzers)

Whether it's self propelled or towed I do believe Ultimately will standardize 155mm guns for Armor and mech infantry.

Serbian Nora b52 k1 could be a very cost effective but a reliable choice.
Army already has 1 regiment of it. And it only cost 2.5/3 millions per unit. So very much affordable.
In my estimation, we should have 3x more regiment of this. (To be deployed at 11th, 55th and 66th divisions)

Can TB-2s be used to produce a firing solution for artillery and give correction data ?

Bro, there is 2 types of firing solutions. One is direct data link from TB-2 to The Howitzer's fire control computer.
Another one is TB-2 operator orally communicate with howitzers gunner and tell him the precise coordination.

 

[Knowledgeseeker]

Inshallah, but I have fear relevant leadership from our side may lack the necessary will and proper planning.



Usually, I am the hopeful one.
But I don't think so. Turkish 155mm Firtina ii is too expensive. (Around 8/9 millions per units)
When truck mounted ARPAN is ready it could be within reach. (probably around 4/5 millions per unit) But still expensive.

However, on the other hand there is no point in opening a dedicated ultra-modern 155mm shell production line for 1/2 regiment howitzers only. (18/36 howitzers)

Whether it's self propelled or towed I do believe Ultimately will standardize 155mm guns for Armor and mech infantry.

Serbian Nora b52 k1 could be a very cost effective but a reliable choice.
Army already has 1 regiment of it. And it only cost 2.5/3 millions per unit. So very much affordable.
In my estimation, we should have 3x more regiment of this. (To be deployed at 11th, 55th and 66th divisions)



Bro, there is 2 types of firing solutions. One is direct data link from TB-2 to The Howitzer's fire control computer.
Another one is TB-2 operator orally communicate with howitzers gunner and tell him the precise coordination.

I dont know the final price of ARPAN but it's very similar to the Israeli ATMOST 155 artillery which cost around 4 million per unit. Around 80-100 of these howitzers will be very good for Bangladesh. We need to remember that artillery howitzers are still very effective, as well as cheap solutions for increased firepower. Much cheaper than for example Bangladesh firing its TRG/TRGL missiles. We also saw how effectively Ukraine used its artillery against Russian positions with the help of laser-guided drones. TB2 could do such a task, but mini-drones have started to get the focus of the militaries around the world using them to pinpoint targets instead of sending armed drones to do such tasks.

 

[F-6 enthusiast]

Wasn't the BA tender for heavyweight attack helicopter? T-129 should be eliminated automatically unless they changed it

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648569084815224832

Assuming that these two are the finalists ,
The T-129 has a higher chance given that we haven't signed those two agreements with the US

They still may not have fully phased it out , those deployed and on excercises are equipped with better gear

still bugs me that we are using ancient type-56 and Folding stock BD-08 with no Optics
The only way to reach someone out at 300m is with the help of optics
Before evryone yells at me , yes i know iron sights can be adjusted for range and windage but how effective is that in practice ?
I mean what's the point if you have the same engagement range as a caveman with an Ak ?

 

[Gary]

still bugs me that we are using ancient type-56 and Folding stock BD-08 with no Optics
The only way to reach someone out at 300m is with the help of optics
Before evryone yells at me , yes i know iron sights can be adjusted for range and windage but how effective is that in practice ?
I mean what's the point if you have the same engagement range as a caveman with an Ak ?

I don't see swapping rifle or equipping each BD-08 with optics will make the BA superior than that of its immediate foe. The biggest killer of infantry and vehicles to this day remains artillery. In real war I don't think the regular infantry will even care to use their optics especially regulars. Look at the war in Syria and Ukraine, the infantry most of the time just happens to spray and pray.

From the look of it BA really need to address more of its basics first like issuing standard helmet, modern comms, etc. Instead of a new shiny rifle which could eat up a huge chunk of defense budget but a marginal effect on the battlefield.

 

[yf120]

Serbian Nora b52 k1 could be a very cost effective but a reliable choice.
Army already has 1 regiment of it. And it only cost 2.5/3 millions per unit. So very much affordable.
In my estimation, we should have 3x more regiment of this. (To be deployed at 11th, 55th and 66th divisions)



Bro, there is 2 types of firing solutions. One is direct data link from TB-2 to The Howitzer's fire control computer.
Another one is TB-2 operator orally communicate with howitzers gunner and tell him the precise coordination.

From what I heard, Nora b52 is a PITA in maintenance and also in some operational cases.

Got some news two days ago that TB-2 will be delivered very soon, just not sure about the numbers. Will it be 6 or 12?

Assuming that these two are the finalists ,
The T-129 has a higher chance given that we haven't signed those two agreements with the US

From what it looks like from the current political situations and the US pressure, there's no way to bypass the agreements; it's going to happen sooner or later. But the point is, do these agreements matter when it's just 4 pieces of helis, not to mention especially for the UN Mali mission purposes? By the way, the Bell helicopters that BAF operates, is their maintenance done inside the country or in the US?



If the heavyweight helicopter requirement has been stripped from the tender, then instead of the T-129, the army would be better off getting the original A129 Mangusta imo and if we consider other logic.

 

[Knowledgeseeker]

I don't see swapping rifle or equipping each BD-08 with optics will make the BA superior than that of its immediate foe. The biggest killer of infantry and vehicles to this day remains artillery. In real war I don't think the regular infantry will even care to use their optics especially regulars. Look at the war in Syria and Ukraine, the infantry most of the time just happens to spray and pray.

From the look of it BA really need to address more of its basics first like issuing standard helmet, modern comms, etc. Instead of a new shiny rifle which could eat up a huge chunk of defense budget but a marginal effect on the battlefield.

Indeed Bangladesh has other priorities right now than replacing its standard rifle. It should first of all turn its back on eastern equipment that lacks the quality needed for Bangladesh. That's the best decision they can do, and they are kind of in a good position due to that since they have not made any extraordinary HUGE deals, so they still have a lot of gaps to fill.

 

[Afif]

When the tender was floated probably back in 2021, the T-129 did not meet all the requirements as far as I remember, making its chances very low compared to the Mi-28, Apache,

That is true.

The funny thing is, the BA tender was for only 3 helicopters initially, and now we see 4.

Yeah, I remember that too.

BTW, I was trying to say the BD armed forces are already familiar with the AW helicopters similar to the Russian Mi helos and also more AW are coming, not to mention the company is well established, partnered with a local company, and already has contracts. AW249 looks promising too.

That is also true. But I think considering geopolitical angel and other broader possibilities with Turkish defence industry, TUSAS's options could be chosen at the end.

 

[Flextape]

A new Riverine Engineer Brigade (under 19div or Indp) may be raised as soon as possible, as news have been circulating in both AHQ and Area HQ Ghatail that the procedures have started in order to form a Adhoc RE Bde. As the news is more prominent in Ghatail and 19 Div is the only div with 2 Div Engr Bn, chances of the new RE Bde being under 19 Div is quite likely but again, as most of our Engrs are Indp, there are chances of the Bde being Indp as well.

A new STHQ will be raised in Mirpur cantt ASAP as the cantt was lacking one despite hosting 3 Arty Regts, HQ 6 AD, NDC and DSCSC among others. Currently the STHQ is in its Adhoc state.

 

[Afif]

@Flextape , good to have you back.

Last time we talked you said Army's R&D already developed some gadget prototypes.
What's the status on that?
And what are those prototypes?
Also, did BOF found the land for new Artillery and missile production plant?

 

[PutinBro]

A new Riverine Engineer Brigade (under 19div or Indp) may be raised as soon as possible, as news have been circulating in both AHQ and Area HQ Ghatail that the procedures have started in order to form a Adhoc RE Bde. As the news is more prominent in Ghatail and 19 Div is the only div with 2 Div Engr Bn, chances of the new RE Bde being under 19 Div is quite likely but again, as most of our Engrs are Indp, there are chances of the Bde being Indp as well.

A new STHQ will be raised in Mirpur cantt ASAP as the cantt was lacking one despite hosting 3 Arty Regts, HQ 6 AD, NDC and DSCSC among others. Currently the STHQ is in its Adhoc state.

Did you make any updates/changes to your unit list?

 

[PutinBro]

@Afif @F-6 enthusiast I have a feeling that boran may also replace our 122mm howitzers.Do you think it will be a good decision?